Royal Canadian Air Force headed to mission in Africa ‘very soon’: top general

[Good2Golf]

If Global Affaires Minister Stephane Dion and his staff (which includes linkages with DND) had not already engaged the UN regarding its desired priorities for PK ops, I would be surprised (and disappointed).  Just because we haven't heard details about such discussions doesn't mean that they are not known. 

That a member of Privy Council is actually on the ground as part of the conduct of the recce is not necessarily a bad thing.  Ground truth, vice taking a report vetted through a number of bureaucrats and passed through the Clerk, isn't to say that the Executive (Privy Council) doesn't trust anyone.  Yes, there is a bit of showmanship going on here as well, no doubt, however, it is refreshing to see the MND make some rather frank (and true) statements about peace operations (ops with an intend to establish or build peace, particularly where little to non may exist), vice pre-judging every potential activity as a peacekeeping operation.  It would seem that Mr. Sajjan is beginning to find his pace in the Town.

:2c:

G2G

 

[Colin Parkinson]

People seem to get a lot of impressions without much evidence.

I get the impression that some use every situation as a chance for political spin and point scoring.

I like Sanjin, but I think he has his work cut out for him to educate the rest of the Cabinet and yes I have decades of evidence from previous encounters with the Liberals and mindset.

 

[Altair]

I like Sanjin, but I think he has his work cut out for him to educate the rest of the Cabinet and yes I have decades of evidence from previous encounters with the Liberals and mindset.

That's like saying you have experience from Vietnam when talking about the Iraq war.

Cool, but not relevant to the current situation.

 

[Bird_Gunner45]

Or maybe it is a sign that the government has had a better understanding of modern peace support operations than many here have given credit for.  Could the minister have taken an opportunity to educate the media on things he already knows, to change vernacular of the discussion as it is presented to the average Canadian and thereby bring public perceptions in line with reality?

I think that this may be closer to the truth than most on this forum are willing to give credit for. We have to remember the LGen (Ret'd) Leslie, former Commander of the Army, is also in the Liberal caucus and is, no doubt, providing as much, if not more, insight into these matters than Minister Sajjan. While some may not like Leslie personally, he has more knowledge of Peace Support operations and modern military requirements than likely the entire Conservative government before this one.

 

[blackberet17]

Time spent on recce is never time wasted.

I appreciate the MND taking the time to personally (when was the last time such a thing happened??) hear from the political and military minds during his fact-finding mission. I also appreciate Sen Dallaire there - someone who has had to deal with the UN, on a "peacekeeping" mission, in an African country. While it may have been more than twenty years since UNAMIR, it's still the most current experience available (aside from the CANSOFCOM pers in Niger, etc.).

On a side note, anyone visit the CANSOFCOM web page lately? Ironic how under the "Myths" tab for CSOR, there are...none. 

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Or maybe it is a sign that the government has had a better understanding of modern peace support operations than many here have given credit for.  Could the minister have taken an opportunity to educate the media on things he already knows, to change vernacular of the discussion as it is presented to the average Canadian and thereby bring public perceptions in line with reality?

Sure, but I'm still wary of this government.  Overall, the MND might have taken advantage of the opportunity but I still lean towards the earlier post I made;  promise a return to peacekeeping, then find a way to explain to the public who elected you why 'peacekeeping' no longer exists. 

 

[Colin Parkinson]

That's like saying you have experience from Vietnam when talking about the Iraq war.

Cool, but not relevant to the current situation.

This is the third government I have worked for, I am not seeing anything different than the previous Liberal one from the inside, other than Chreatian keeping his shirt on. The Liberal Party has not changed much, despite a few shining stars in Cabinet.

 

[Altair]

This is the third government I have worked for, I am not seeing anything different than the previous Liberal one from the inside, other than Chreatian keeping his shirt on. The Liberal Party has not changed much, despite a few shining stars in Cabinet.

While I would love to point out all of the difference between this liberal goverment and liberal governments past I think that would constitute a derail of this thread to a subject currently banned in this site.

 

[jmt18325]

I like Sanjin, but I think he has his work cut out for him to educate the rest of the Cabinet and yes I have decades of evidence from previous encounters with the Liberals and mindset.

And again, there are more Liberals that have military experience than people from any other party - I don't see the evidence.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

The question is, IMO, is that experience falling on open, or closed, ears.  :2c:

 

[jmt18325]

The question is, IMO, is that experience falling on open, or closed, ears.  :2c:

And we don't know the answer to that - speculation seems valueless.

 

[jollyjacktar]

And the numbers of members of the house in any party with military backgrounds is a pittance when set against sitting houses of the past.  I think the last sitting PM with any military experience was Mike Pearson in the 60's and his experience was 40 years behind him then.

 

[Kat Stevens]

And we don't know the answer to that - speculation seems valueless.

Motion carried!  Shut the thread down!

 

[Eye In The Sky]

And we don't know the answer to that - speculation seems valueless.

Agreed on both aspects.  8)

 

[George Wallace]

And again, there are more Liberals that have military experience than people from any other party - I don't see the evidence.

???

There are, and have been, a fair number of former military Members of Parliament from Parties other than the Liberals.  I would not make any suggestions that the Liberals hold any higher form of legitimacy in stating that they have more former military members than others.  And as our elected representatives, does that even matter?

 

[PuckChaser]

People seem to get a lot of impressions without much evidence.

I get the impression that some use every situation as a chance for political spin and point scoring.

You mean like everything between 2006 and Oct 2015?

 

[Bird_Gunner45]

And the numbers of members of the house in any party with military backgrounds is a pittance when set against sitting houses of the past.  I think the last sitting PM with any military experience was Mike Pearson in the 60's and his experience was 40 years behind him then.

Is LGen (Ret'd) good enough military experience? He commanded the army, so he probably has some concept of PSO, conventional, or asymmetric operations. Also, he was the COS for Sector south in Yugo and a DCO in Croatia and served in A-Stan....

In fact, he is likely a far better source of knowledge and is likely conducting a lot of the behind the scenes advising on these matters with the new government. Minister Sajjan's experience is good, but he wouldn't have been exposed to nearly as much on the strategic side of the military due to his tactical level position.

 

[jmt18325]

There are, and have been, a fair number of former military Members of Parliament from Parties other than the Liberals.

I don't know why people read things that aren't there.  Currently, there are more Liberals that have served.  That's the current reality that this government is working with.

 

[Brad Sallows]

>And again, there are more Liberals that have military experience than people from any other party - I don't see the evidence.

Largely irrelevant.  We need to stop fetishizing prior military service as if it means every ex-member is broadly knowledgeable.  This is geopolitical turf.  The "military" is only a small piece.

 

[Bird_Gunner45]

>And again, there are more Liberals that have military experience than people from any other party - I don't see the evidence.

Largely irrelevant.  We need to stop fetishizing prior military service as if it means every ex-member is broadly knowledgeable.  This is geopolitical turf.  The "military" is only a small piece.

Once again, former Commander of the Canadian Army... I'd say pretty knowledgable