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RUMINT of Canada wanting more C-17's

it is done http://www.rcaf-arc.forces.gc.ca/en/news-template-standard.page?doc=canada-s-fifth-cc-177-globemaster-iii-touches-down-at-8-wing-trenton%2Fi7kv5fuv


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Canada’s fifth CC-177 Globemaster III touches down at 8 Wing Trenton
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    Defence Minister Jason Kenney (second from left) joined Lieutenant-General Yvan Blondin, commander of the Royal Canadian Air Force, to witness the inaugural landing of the RCAF’s fifth CC-177 Globemaster III in Canada.

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    CC-177 Globemaster III
    Operation Impact
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    8 Wing Trenton
    429 Transport Squadron

News Article / March 30, 2015

From the Department of National Defence

Government welcomes increased air power for the Royal Canadian Air Force.

The Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF) today accepted delivery of its fifth CC-177 Globemaster III aircraft, increasing its flexibility to respond to both domestic and international emergencies and support a variety of missions, including humanitarian assistance, peace support and combat.

Defence Minister Jason Kenney joined Lieutenant-General Yvan Blondin, commander of the RCAF, to witness the aircraft’s inaugural landing in Canada. The aircraft, tail number 705, augments the current fleet of four CC-177 Globemaster IIIs operated by 429 Transport Squadron at 8 Wing Trenton, Ontario.

"Our five CC-177 Globemasters give Canada a huge advantage in projecting our presence around the world,” said Defence Minister Kenney. “In the past, Canada was completely dependent on other countries for strategic airlift capability. Now we can move personnel and equipment around the globe in short order. This is essential for our ability to respond quickly to urgent military and humanitarian missions.”

The additional Globemaster will extend the life expectancy of the entire fleet by about seven and a half years. Moreover, with the purchase of an additional aircraft, the RCAF is projected to have at least three Globemasters available more than 90 per cent of the time to respond to concurrent international or domestic crises. This represents an increase of approximately 25 per cent.

The current Globemaster fleet has been playing an integral role in ferrying supplies and troops to establish and resupply the Canadian camp in Kuwait during Operation Impact. It has also delivered essential materiel to CF-188 Hornet crews deployed in support of NATO as part of Operation Reassurance and the international response to the Putin regime’s aggression against Ukraine.

The Globemasters are also used to support domestic operations, including more than 75 missions to Canada’s North to deliver 1.5 million litres of fuel, seven million pounds of equipment and 3,120 personnel to locations such as Alert, Iqaluit and Resolute Bay in Nunavut.

“We’ve chalked up enormous successes with our first four Globemasters,” said Lieutenant-General Blondin. “With the arrival of our new Globemaster, we will be more agile, more flexible, and better able to respond when the Government of Canada calls on the RCAF.”

Using resources the Government had previously set aside for National Defence to implement the Canada First Defence Strategy, the acquisition project cost is estimated at $415 million, including the cost to purchase the aircraft, spare engine, ancillary equipment, specialized systems, project costs and contingency for exchange rate fluctuation. The cost for 12 years of integrated in-service support for the additional aircraft is estimated at $30 million.


Meanwhile back in France (aren't you glad we aren't in that mess!) http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articles-view/feature/5/161581/partner-nations-may-apply-penalty-clauses-to-a400m-program.html
 
And here it is ...

1899828_1691038457790016_6737970951655030709_o.jpg


... tail no. 177705.

(I would be very glad to see 177706, 707 and 708, too, bit I don't know how many whitetails might be left.)
 
Its an older article from last year, but that would add up to about 10 airframes left if none were spoken for by anyone else. I don't think 177706 would be hard to obtain, we just need to find the funds to get it.
 
PuckChaser said:
Its an older article from last year, but that would add up to about 10 airframes left if none were spoken for by anyone else. I don't think 177706 would be hard to obtain, we just need to find the funds to get it.

And crews to man it. And funds to pay for increased YFR, and related increased maintenance.

Last I heard there were significantly less than 10 tails unclaimed; from what I recall a few months ago, you could count them on one hand (with fingers left over).
 
Given that the first batch needs to be turned in for contract maintenance every five years or so (putting most of the fleet out of action at once), buying a few extra ones and putting them in long term storage *might* be an option. Everytime one of the C-17's has to go in for maintenance, pull the tarp off one of the ones ion storage and carry on....
 
Thucydides said:
Given that the first batch needs to be turned in for contract maintenance every five years or so (putting most of the fleet out of action at once), buying a few extra ones and putting them in long term storage *might* be an option. Everytime one of the C-17's has to go in for maintenance, pull the tarp off one of the ones ion storage and carry on....

The RCAF is better at fleet management than that.
 
Thucydides said:
Given that the first batch needs to be turned in for contract maintenance every five years or so (putting most of the fleet out of action at once), buying a few extra ones and putting them in long term storage *might* be an option. Everytime one of the C-17's has to go in for maintenance, pull the tarp off one of the ones ion storage and carry on....

So park a few +$200 million assets because we can't figure out how to stagger a couple months long maintenance check? (Which is staggered anyways since we didn't get all 4 at once). Even the RCAF isn't that incompetent...

The remaining white tails are being snatched up pretty quickly (and not very publicly), it's bascally now or never.
 
So park a few +$200 million assets because we can't figure out how to stagger a couple months long maintenance check? (Which is staggered anyways since we didn't get all 4 at once). Even the RCAF isn't that incompetent...

I'm trying to find the link, but that is precisely the reason that was cited for buying more C-17s for the RCAF
 
buying an extra one and placing it in long term storage down in Nevada might be a wise idea, allows you to pull it fly it as one goes down or heaven forbid one crashes. Which leads me to another question, since this is a military, do they actually plan a loss percentage into their buys from enemy action, accidents and still be able to operate?
 
We don't have war stock on aircraft. I don't believe we ever have. So many parts Tx after a fairly short timeframe it doesn't make any sense to put them in longterm storage, like trucks, tanks, and APCs. It would take almost as long to bring up an aircraft from storage as it would for a maintenance check on the one its supposed to replace.
 
It's every five years and lasts a few months. It would be absolutely ludicrous to buy and then mothball a perfectly good jet, only to spend potentially tens of millions to bring it back into service to prevent a slight decrease in capability a small fraction of the time...I can't stress how idiotic it would be for Canada to even consider doing it.

More airframes would allow the heavy workload to be spread among a larger fleet, extending the life of the aircraft.
 
captloadie said:
We don't have war stock on aircraft. I don't believe we ever have. So many parts Tx after a fairly short timeframe it doesn't make any sense to put them in longterm storage, like trucks, tanks, and APCs. It would take almost as long to bring up an aircraft from storage as it would for a maintenance check on the one its supposed to replace.

Actually we do, according to my AF buddies we have a storage facility south of Trenton where a war stocks like collection of aircraft is. Majority of it is the spare airframes for maintenance, but there are also a a handful of CF-116's in storage there.
 
MilEME09 said:
Actually we do, according to my AF buddies we have a storage facility south of Trenton where a war stocks like collection of aircraft is. Majority of it is the spare airframes for maintenance, but there are also a a handful of CF-116's in storage there.

Not really sure if you would call Mountain View a "storage facility".  Likely more of a "disposal facility".  Airframes deemed ready to dispose of or send off to become monuments or museum pieces. 
 
I think a distinction needs to be made between what the CF has and a boneyard type facility. Most aircraft sent to the boneyard are stored in a way that they can be reactivated if required. What we have in Mountain View is just a storage facility for old, high time airframes that will stay there until they are either stripped of parts, sold or scrapped. Canada doesn't have a war stock of aircraft that can be reactivated, the CF-18s there are there for a reason, and will never fly again.
 
Some of the T-33s that were there were flown out, (to the states), when they were sold off.  The Tutors that are there are rotated in and out of the Snowbirds. 
 
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