Sapper tab approval/denial
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Scratch_043
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I may be mistaken, but it looks quite a bit (from the sapper leader course website) that it is essentially a Special operations specialty trade course.
If this is the case, why shouldn't it be put in the same bracket as the Ranger tab?
Correct me if I am wrong, please, but it does seem that way from what I have read on that page.
If this is the case, why shouldn't it be put in the same bracket as the Ranger tab?
Correct me if I am wrong, please, but it does seem that way from what I have read on that page.
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maybe it is and maybe it isn't.
Until the people at the very top of the heap say it is OK to wear it, it stays in a box in the back of the drawer.
The LF CWO is a sapper and while I have not talked to him on that particular subject, I am certain that he has put in his 2 cents worth
Until the people at the very top of the heap say it is OK to wear it, it stays in a box in the back of the drawer.
The LF CWO is a sapper and while I have not talked to him on that particular subject, I am certain that he has put in his 2 cents worth
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Before we continue throwing on qualification badges from other countries it would be a refreshing change to actually don the Canadian stuff we may be qualified to wear (Para, Diver, EOD) on something other than DEU. However only the Air Force seem to be permitted that one......Total Force eh....
In 2005, as eluded to earlier the matter of wearing hazardous qualification badges on Cbt's was brought up at a certain high level meeting of the minds and was supposedly to be addressed at the 2006 meeting. But I for one have heard nothing to date. The person who brought it up in 05 was not a Sapper and the Sapper tab was not on the agenda.
Airborne-Chimo-Ubique
In 2005, as eluded to earlier the matter of wearing hazardous qualification badges on Cbt's was brought up at a certain high level meeting of the minds and was supposedly to be addressed at the 2006 meeting. But I for one have heard nothing to date. The person who brought it up in 05 was not a Sapper and the Sapper tab was not on the agenda.
Airborne-Chimo-Ubique
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Reading this thread with interest, especially the part about wearing qual badges on Cbts.
I would have to agree with the wearing of Cdn qual badges, especially for trades of inherent danger who don't already have some sort of distinctive dress, but I think it would be pretty easy to get carried away with the use of foreign decorations too.
I mean, should I sew my air cav badge, Air Assault wings, CIB and all the other flash I've accumulated from trips to the states on my cbts? They don't do it with ours, whether the qual exists or not.
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to have my wings on my shirt, but alot of the time, it is not a helpful thing to be noticed and conspicuous - both overseas and at home - "there's alot of haters out there" to coin a phrase!
I would have to agree with the wearing of Cdn qual badges, especially for trades of inherent danger who don't already have some sort of distinctive dress, but I think it would be pretty easy to get carried away with the use of foreign decorations too.
I mean, should I sew my air cav badge, Air Assault wings, CIB and all the other flash I've accumulated from trips to the states on my cbts? They don't do it with ours, whether the qual exists or not.
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to have my wings on my shirt, but alot of the time, it is not a helpful thing to be noticed and conspicuous - both overseas and at home - "there's alot of haters out there" to coin a phrase!
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Stand by for badges on the CADPAT, in particular the CIB and CAB or whatever the Canadian equivalent.
I agree with Old Fart,((something that doesn't always happen), I think if we have earned a Cdn qualification then we should be able to wear it and not limited to the amount of hazard/skill badges we wear by regulations.
The Dress Instruction is a continued work in progress so who knows one day...
I agree with Old Fart,((something that doesn't always happen), I think if we have earned a Cdn qualification then we should be able to wear it and not limited to the amount of hazard/skill badges we wear by regulations.
The Dress Instruction is a continued work in progress so who knows one day...
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GO, I think we had it right in the Airborne Regiment (and SSF) with regard to our smocks, by comparison certainly no worse than say a Royal Marine, UK Para, SAS Trooper, Ammo Tech or UK Royal Engineer jumper, diver or EOD qualified.
Given that the CONSTITUTION OF THE CANADIAN FORCES states that we are one service, "Q R & O Vol 1, Chap 2 (1) Section 14 of the National Defence Act provides: The Canadian Forces are the armed forces of Her Majesty raised by Canada and consist of one Service called the Canadian Armed Forces", the double standard which exists with regard to the wearing of hazardous skill badges on combats has always seemed wrong to me. Rules that permit the Air Force and Navy pers to wear all kinds of regalia on there works/battle dress but not the Army.
However it's the Air Force and Navy that have it right, not the Army. Imagine telling a pilot or submariner they can only wear their skill badges on Remembrance day!!
I have never bought into “the noticed or conspicuous aspect”, certainly the opposite was true in the past. For instance the UK Para Regt did not get nicknamed the Red Devils for covering up their Wings and by not donning their beret. In my opinion that's why the "gentleman upstairs" invented Velcro, which seems to adorn our combats even more these days. If it was deemed necessary to remove Wings etc then they could be along with the name tag.
Soldiers First....
Airborne-Chimo-Ubique
Given that the CONSTITUTION OF THE CANADIAN FORCES states that we are one service, "Q R & O Vol 1, Chap 2 (1) Section 14 of the National Defence Act provides: The Canadian Forces are the armed forces of Her Majesty raised by Canada and consist of one Service called the Canadian Armed Forces", the double standard which exists with regard to the wearing of hazardous skill badges on combats has always seemed wrong to me. Rules that permit the Air Force and Navy pers to wear all kinds of regalia on there works/battle dress but not the Army.
However it's the Air Force and Navy that have it right, not the Army. Imagine telling a pilot or submariner they can only wear their skill badges on Remembrance day!!
I have never bought into “the noticed or conspicuous aspect”, certainly the opposite was true in the past. For instance the UK Para Regt did not get nicknamed the Red Devils for covering up their Wings and by not donning their beret. In my opinion that's why the "gentleman upstairs" invented Velcro, which seems to adorn our combats even more these days. If it was deemed necessary to remove Wings etc then they could be along with the name tag.
Soldiers First....
Airborne-Chimo-Ubique
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Hmmm.... if there are a bunch of people on the ground, standing in a circle or standing behind a security cordon, wouldn't it be nice to recognize the EOD tech - to give him room and open up the route for him? They already have those white armlets with the red cross for the medics........... It makes sense when you think about it.
Thoughts?
Thoughts?
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geo said:
Hmmm.......wouldn't you think that after a few days on the ground and working with these guys, you'd know who was who?
Medic wear that white band with the Red Cross so that the Enemy will know who they are and hopefully obey the Geneva Conventions. Should we also advertise to Enemy Snipers who our 'Specialists' are?
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geo said:
I've got to go with the tactical issues here. While we are readily identifying our specialists with armbands, we may as well start allowing the identification of our Officers by saluting them, just so everyone, including the enemy, is acutely aware of who is in charge.
Not a good idea.
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As the contrary voice (it seems to be my loadstation 
).....
I've always believed that the side with the simplest uniform wins.
This is becoming an issue of great importance because NDHQ dwellers are wearing CADPAT. I've never had much trouble distinguishing between real warriors, people who want to be thought of as hard (but who can apparently never be spared from HQ line-serials), and those who simply aren't intended to be pointy-end.
I have 3 Canadian skill badges...plus 7 foreign parachute wings and 2 foreign dive badges from three continents. The only way wearing any of these badges could make me a more effective soldier is if they were made of Kevlar!
Leave the badges off the combats; concentrate on soldier skills and equipping the troops.
Oh, and I've never met an EOD guy who was quiet & shy....and would sit outside a cordon moaning "gee, I wish I had a badge on this uniform so people would move out of my way" ;D
).....I've always believed that the side with the simplest uniform wins.
This is becoming an issue of great importance because NDHQ dwellers are wearing CADPAT. I've never had much trouble distinguishing between real warriors, people who want to be thought of as hard (but who can apparently never be spared from HQ line-serials), and those who simply aren't intended to be pointy-end.
I have 3 Canadian skill badges...plus 7 foreign parachute wings and 2 foreign dive badges from three continents. The only way wearing any of these badges could make me a more effective soldier is if they were made of Kevlar!
Leave the badges off the combats; concentrate on soldier skills and equipping the troops.
Oh, and I've never met an EOD guy who was quiet & shy....and would sit outside a cordon moaning "gee, I wish I had a badge on this uniform so people would move out of my way" ;D
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I could not care less what NDHQ dwellers are wearing, I just could never figure out the Army policy on this.
For years after I joined the CF I kept hearing the reasons why we never wore combats that where comprised of a disruptive pattern material (DPM), simply stated reasons such as the old olive drab (green) worked fine/better etc. Then many years later we get CADPAT (although I'm not forgetting the garrison jacket) and here all this I was thinking that the majority of foreign armies who where wearing DMP for donkeys years were all screwed up.
Same goes for subdued skill badges worn as appropriate....on combats…..
For years after I joined the CF I kept hearing the reasons why we never wore combats that where comprised of a disruptive pattern material (DPM), simply stated reasons such as the old olive drab (green) worked fine/better etc. Then many years later we get CADPAT (although I'm not forgetting the garrison jacket) and here all this I was thinking that the majority of foreign armies who where wearing DMP for donkeys years were all screwed up.
Same goes for subdued skill badges worn as appropriate....on combats…..
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First of all, looking forward to the new Combat badge for the troops, whenever it shows up; it is well deserved by our boys.
As for EOD badges on Combats, Velcro is the answer. For cases like Post blast sites, you can have EOD operators from up to three different offices working the same area, and they do not always know each other. It is helpful, to throw a patch on, while you are working in that enviroment, and peel it off on completion. Been there, done that, it works. Is it in our dress regs??? You do what you gotta do in the Sand Box, be ready to explain if asked. Cheers.
As for EOD badges on Combats, Velcro is the answer. For cases like Post blast sites, you can have EOD operators from up to three different offices working the same area, and they do not always know each other. It is helpful, to throw a patch on, while you are working in that enviroment, and peel it off on completion. Been there, done that, it works. Is it in our dress regs??? You do what you gotta do in the Sand Box, be ready to explain if asked. Cheers.
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