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Syria Superthread [merged]

In 1998 Bill Clinton bombarded Sudan and Afghanistan - Result - Osama bin Laden blew up the World Trade Centre

In 1914 the Kaiser bombarded Whitby - Result - Grandma joined the Queen Alexandra's Nursing Corps

In 1814 the Royal Navy bombarded Baltimore - Result - "The Star Spangled Banner"

In 1813 the Yanks burned York - Result - The White House got a paint job.

These demonstrations never achieve the desired result.  They do not "pacify".  They merely prod the hornets.
 
The moon phase is wrong for air strikes.  First week of September between Tuesday and Saturday.


My guess.  That will give POTUS et al a bit more time to get out the propaganda and to get the requisite forces in place.

 
.....and Monday is Labour Day; can't go to war on a Stat Hol.    :nod:
 
Technoviking said:
The moon phase is wrong for air strikes.  First week of September between Tuesday and Saturday.

And I believe the following week (Sep 9-15) marks the start of one of the four Muslim months of peace: Dhu al-Qi'dah
 
Ban Ki-moon tells Security Council ‘give peace a chance’ in Syria

UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon has called for weapons inspectors to be given time to determine whether chemical weapons were used.

Speaking at the Hague, Ban urged members of the UN Security Council to look for a diplomatic solution, saying: “Give peace a chance, give diplomacy a chance, stop fighting and start talking.”

His words may have fallen on deaf ears as American, European and Middle East allies have already firmly pinned the blame on President Assad’s forces.

Syria says it believes that Britain, France and the US have helped “terrorists” use chemical weapons in Syria, in order to justify foreign intervention and warned that the same groups would soon use them against Europe.

In Damascus, inspectors have finished their second visit to a suspected chemical weapons strike in the Mouadamiya suburb.

Hundreds of people are reported to have died in the attack on August 21.


Article Link is shared with provisions of The Copyright Act
 
Even the Afghan Taliban are calling for action - sorta makes ya wonder ....

Usual disclaimer - if you don't want the Taliban's webmeisters to have your information by clicking on the statement link, there's an alternate link

Communiqué of Islamic Emirate regarding the mass killings in Syria - screen capture of statement at Google Drive
Created on Wednesday, 28 August 2013 19:15
Everyone is aware that for the past two years, the oppressed Syrian nation has been burning in a raging fire; more than a hundred thousand men, women and children have died, millions have become refugees and homes and villages have been destroyed however it did not end there! but now chemical weapons have also been used against them.

On the 21/08/2013 in Ghawtha area near the capital Damascus, the Syrian regime brutally used chemical gas deployed in bombs which resulted in some 1300 innocent civilians, mostly women and children, becoming martyrs in the heinous crime, according to the tally of the locals.

The Islamic Emirate, while condemning this inhumane action in the strongest of terms, calls on the international community and especially the Islamic world to immediately put a stop to such crimes against humanity and take every necessary step to help the oppressed Syrian nation so to put an end to similar crimes from taking place in the future.

The Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan
21/10/1434
06/06/1392        28/08/2013
 
Technoviking said:
Jus ad Bellum:
We don't have a reasonable hope.  We cannot achieve the desired outcome no matter how many bombs are dropped.  We have no choice but to let this war carry on, and stand by to render assistance without interfering.  After all, Assad, who is no saint, is only mildly more brutish with these Islamo-fascist thugs than we are.

And I don't believe for one moment that his government, who is winning and has the support of the majority of his people (coerced or otherwise), used chemical weapons on the savages.  And unlike Saddam some ten years ago, he's complying with the UN, and therefore the international community as his fights his own little counter insurgency against the same people we're trying to kill in other parts of the world.

I concur.
 
So Berlin might sit this one out as well...

EU Observer link

Germany not keen to join France and UK on Syria strike

27.08.13 @ 10:02


BRUSSELS - Germany has indicated it will not take part in any military strike on Syria, as France and the UK signal readiness to join a US-led intervention.

Philipp Missfelder, the foreign affairs spokesman for German Chancellor Angela Merkel's CDU party, said in the Leipziger Volkszeitung daily on Tuesday (27 August) that: "The [German] army has, through its current international operations, already reached the breaking point."

He added that a Western strike could create a "spiral of escalating violence" by drawing Iran and the Lebanese militant group, Hezbollah, deeper into the conflict.

He also said military action without a UN mandate is "hard to imagine."

Despite Missfelder's statement, Merkel in recent days joined British and French leaders in giving credence to reports the Syrian regime has used chemical weapons to kill hundreds of people on the outskirts of Damascus.

A statement by British Prime Minister David Cameron's office noted that Cameron and Merkel spoke by phone on Sunday.

"They agreed that this was a very grave incident and that there was little doubt that it had been carried out by the regime," it said.

"They agreed that such an attack demanded a firm response from the international community," it added.

France on Monday also used strong words.

"The only option that I am ruling out is to do nothing," French foreign minister Laurent Fabius said on Europe 1 radio.

The toughest language came from Washington on Monday evening, however.

US secretary of state John Kerry told media in the US capital: "The indiscriminate slaughter of civilians, the killing of women and children and innocent bystanders, by chemical weapons is a moral obscenity."

He added: "There must be accountability for those who would use the world's most heinous weapons against the world's most vulnerable people."

The US also cancelled a meeting with Russia, due in The Hague on Wednesday, designed to re-launch peace talks between Syrian rebels and Syrian authorities.

If the US and some EU countries do strike Syria's chemical weapons depots, elite brigades or air force, the move risks further alienating Moscow.

Cameron's office said he also spoke with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday, but "the Russian President said Moscow had no evidence as to whether such an attack had taken place or who was responsible."

Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov on Monday spelled out his country's point of view.

“We are especially concerned to hear talk coming from London and Paris suggesting that Nato could take the lead in bombing in Syria without Security Council approval. This is a very slippery slope," he told Russian press.

"Any military action without [UN] Security Council approval would be a crude violation of international law," he noted.

Asked what Russia would do if a Nato-linked coalition does strike its Middle East ally, Lavrov added that Moscow is "not planning to go to war with anyone," however.

A UN chemical weapons inspection team arrived on the site of the alleged attack on Monday, with any Western action unlikely to come before it files its report.

A former French airforce chief, Jean Rannou, told EUobserver in a previous interview a military strike would most likely be launched from the UK's military base in Cyprus.

He noted there is a risk that Syria's Russian-made SA-17 missiles could shoot down a handful of Nato planes.


But he added: "I don't see any purely military problems. Syria has no defence against Western systems."

Some defence analysts have also voiced concerns about asymmetric threats.

EU countries have troops in UN peacekeeping missions in Lebanon and Syria, which could become targets.
Rainer Wendt, the head of Germany's police trade union, also told press on Monday that Syria could react with terrorist attacks in EU countries, including Germany, whether or not it takes part in an assault.
 
Moscow says this deployment is not related to the Syria situation...or so they say.

Russia sending warships to the Mediterranean

Quote

Russia will "over the next few days" be sending an anti-submarine ship and a missile cruiser to the Mediterranean as the West prepares for possible strikes against Syria, the Interfax news agency said on Thursday.

"The well-known situation shaping up in the eastern Mediterranean called for certain corrections to the make-up of the naval forces," a source in the Russian General Staff told Interfax.


Quote

"Later it will be joined by the Moskva, a rocket cruiser of the Black Sea Fleet which is now wrapping up its tasks in the northern Atlantic and will soon begin a Transatlantic voyage towards the Strait of Gibraltar."

In addition, a rocket cruiser of the Pacific Fleet, the Varyag, will join the Russian naval forces in the Mediterranean this autumn by replacing a large anti-submarine ship.



Quote

However, the state-run RIA Novosti news agency cited a high-ranking representative of the naval command who said the changes to the country's forces in the region were not linked to the current tensions over Syria and called them "a planned rotation."


link
 
The Soviet deployment of forces to the med was announced a while back, including their carrier.  They have a friend in Syria......



er...the Russians :)
 
A good report from CTV News, here, including a video of Prime Minister Harper addressing the question.
 
The US Navy increases its carrier presence in the region as tensions with Syria rise. In spite of what the article below says, perhaps the US is preparing to respond to Iranian threats to destroy Israel if a US-coalition air campaign against Syria is launched?

Military.com link

US Officials: Navy Boosts Carrier Presence in Gulf

Aug 29, 2013

Associated Press| by Lolita C. Baldor


WASHINGTON - U.S. officials say the Navy is beefing up its presence in the Persian Gulf region, increasing the number of aircraft carriers from one to two.

The USS Harry S Truman has arrived in the Arabian Sea and was scheduled to take the place of the USS Nimitz, which was supposed to head home. The Navy has ordered the Nimitz, which is in the Indian Ocean, to stay for now.

U.S. officials describe the decision as prudent planning and say it doesn't suggest the carrier would play a role in any possible strikes in Syria. The officials were not authorized to discuss ship movements publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.


The U.S. had kept two carriers in the region, but budget cuts in February forced officials to cut to one.
 
Excerpt of article;

In London, MPs voted against possible military action against Syria.

The government motion - to support in principle British involvement in military action - was defeated in by 285 votes to 272 late on Thursday.

Prime Minster David Cameron said it was clear the parliament does not want action and "the government will act accordingly".

Full article link
Syria's Bashar al-Assad will fight Western 'aggression'

                                    Shared with provisions of The Copyright Act
 
The USN presence just off Syria has been reinforced by another AEGIS destroyer.

military.com

Fifth Destroyer Joins US Naval Presence Off Syria

Aug 29, 2013

Military.com| by Richard Sisk


A fifth U.S. destroyer has arrived in the eastern Mediterranean to boost U.S. firepower should President Obama order strikes against Syria to punish the regime of President Bashar al-Assad for its alleged use of chemical weapons, the Navy said Thursday.

The Stout is underway in the Mediterranean where the guided-missile destroyer will join the destroyers Ramage, Mahan, Barry and Gravely off the coast of Syria as part of the U.S. Sixth Fleet, said Lt. Lauryn Dempsey, a Navy spokeswoman.

Dempsey also denied regional media reports that the amphibious assault ship Kearsarge with 1,000 Marines aboard was also on station in the Mediterranean. "That is incorrect," said Dempsey, adding that the Kearsarge and two accompanying ships were currently in the Fifth Fleet's area in the North Arabian Sea.

The Stout left its Norfolk, Va., homeport on Aug. 18 and initially had been scheduled to replace the Ramage. The Mahan had been due to return to Norfolk last week but was ordered to stay in the Mediterranean following the Aug. 21 rocket attacks on the Damascus suburbs that humanitarian groups and rebel forces have said killed hundreds with the nerve agent Sarin.

The buildup of naval power came after U.S. military chiefs consulted with their counterparts on the crisis in Syria and the U.S. response.

(...)
 
Canada has been convinced Western military action is needed against Syria after reports it used chemical weapons, but Ottawa does not plan its own military mission, Prime Minister Stephen Harper said on Thursday.

Harper told reporters in Toronto that doing nothing in the face of what he said appeared to be an escalation in the use of chemical weapons by Syria would set "an extremely dangerous precedent."

"This is a very big risk and we do support our allies who are contemplating forceful action to deal with this," said Harper, who spoke to U.S. President Barack Obama on Wednesday about Syria and has also talked with British Prime Minister David Cameron and French President Francois Hollande.

"That said, at the present time the government of Canada has no plans, we have no plans of our own, to have a Canadian military mission." ....
Reuters, 29 Aug 13

Also, couldn't resist adding the attached cartoon about the world's response.
 
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