The Land Operations Temperate Boots (LOTB)

[rmc_wannabe]

I too have heard that the Army Sergeant Major, with the Army Commander,while addressing the last Army Command Team Course, had stated that the LOTB will go away and we will all move to the GP boot through attrition replacement.  That means you will wear what is on your feet until those wear-out, and you will get whatever style of boot happens to be on the shelf at clothing when you go for replacement or new issue.  However, when the LCMM needs to restock the shelves, then GP boot is what will be contracted for.

So we're back to square one again essentially....

 

[Jarnhamar]

So I'll be able to just keep spending $300 a pop out of my own pocket to get boots that work best for me and I'll be left alone?

 

[Terrier]

So I'll be able to just keep spending $300 a pop out of my own pocket to get boots that work best for me and I'll be left alone?

Not by default, no... is the short answer. They're moving back to one boot issued, one boot worn from what I understand. I'm sure there will still be people with medical chits etc... but the new boot will be the rule to the exception.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

So I'll be able to just keep spending $300 a pop out of my own pocket to get boots that work best for me and I'll be left alone?

Not by default, no... is the short answer. They're moving back to one boot issued, one boot worn from what I understand. I'm sure there will still be people with medical chits etc... but the new boot will be the rule to the exception.

That hasn't stopped people from doing it now....so it won't stop them in the future.....

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Not by default, no... is the short answer. They're moving back to one boot issued, one boot worn from what I understand. I'm sure there will still be people with medical chits etc... but the new boot will be the rule to the exception.

I'm sure the HSS Folks are going to love the sudden influx of people demanding boot chits.

 

[Terrier]

I'm sure the HSS Folks are going to love the sudden influx of people demanding boot chits.

I'm sure there's a line up already just from talking about boots... hopefully most people at least try them on first.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

I'm sure there's a line up already just from talking about boots... hopefully most people at least try them on first.

If they are more of the same garbage from Boulet... They won't need to.

 

[sidemount]

Agreed, my foot didnt fit in the mkIII properly nor the mondo size. (Sorry more to boots fitting then just length and width). I'll just keep on buying boots that actually fit.

 

[PuckChaser]

Last boots the Army issued me that fit properly were 9.5D MkIIIs, and 9.5D parade boots. Mondopoint is junk.

 

[PMedMoe]

Agreed, my foot didn't fit in the mkIII properly nor the mondo size. (Sorry more to boots fitting then just length and width). I'll just keep on buying boots that actually fit.

That's what I did.  Screw the medical chit.  I had Danners for my desert boot and kept a pair of the old combat boots which had Vibram soles on them....that I paid for myself...twice.  I also managed to keep that pair when I released. And the desert boot, of course, as they weren't on my docs.

I never did get issued new boots (CWW or whatever) because they didn't fit.

 

[Lumber]

Just so a tadpole like myself can keep up with all you land lubbers...

I recall and still own MkIIIs, but I also have a pair of boots I got in 2007 that they called "Gortex" at the time; which ones are those?
Which ones are the tan ones everyone coming back from Afghanistan was wearing?
And which ones are the ugly brown ones I see people wearing lately?

Cheers and thanks.

 

[PuckChaser]

Tan ones were original desert boots with a rippled sole, ugly brown are arid region combat boots, uglier brown are the failed temperate boot, and there's 2 types of brown/tan boots that look more like civilian boots that are LOTB.

Your goretex boots are either cold wet weather, or GP (known as Mk IV). Difference is basically cwwb has an insulated liner, GP is much thinner.

 

[Lumber]

Tan ones were original desert boots with a rippled sole, ugly brown are arid region combat boots, uglier brown are the failed temperate boot, and there's 2 types of brown/tan boots that look more like civilian boots that are LOTB.

Your goretex boots are either cold wet weather, or GP (known as Mk IV). Difference is basically cwwb has an insulated liner, GP is much thinner.

Damnit! And just when I had it all straight in my head, you go using another new acronym!

Otherwise, thanks for the clarification. I have several pilots working for me and they all are wearing different coloured boots (black, brown and tan).

 

[Loachman]

The Cold Wet Weather Boot was the a** f**ce boot, which was the crappiest boot that I ever wore. The Wet Weather Boot was the Army equivalent. I was issued a pair of those when I returned the CWWBs to Borden Clothing Stores, with a scathing review (which I also posted on the a** f**ce CEMS (Clothing and Equipment Millennial Standard).

Borden Base Clothing was also nice enough to buy me two pairs of Magnum desert boots when they could not fit me with the ones in stock. No medical chit was required, and the very helpful lady had begun the paperwork while I was still struggling to cram a foot into a boot.

 

[PuckChaser]

Damnit! And just when I had it all straight in my head, you go using another new acronym!

Otherwise, thanks for the clarification. I have several pilots working for me and they all are wearing different coloured boots (black, brown and tan).

GP is general purpose, it was supposed to be an interim solution between mark IIIs and temperate boot... 10 years ago....

 

[daftandbarmy]

Tan ones were original desert boots with a rippled sole, ugly brown are arid region combat boots, uglier brown are the failed temperate boot, and there's 2 types of brown/tan boots that look more like civilian boots that are LOTB.

Your goretex boots are either cold wet weather, or GP (known as Mk IV). Difference is basically cwwb has an insulated liner, GP is much thinner.

This summary is in itself a wonderful testament to how f&cked up the whole boot thing is, IMHO.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Don't forget about the personnel costs of injuries associated with ill-fitting or inadequate footwear...for the last decade. That's my sunny thought for the day.  :facepalm:

This.

Because of the crappy cbt boot "insoles" that were issued for years, I have fallen arches.  Because of that, since 2003 I have been getting orthotics and LPO boots and will until I am CRA in 2030. 

So for 27 years, the CAF will pay for:

- orthotics every 2 years, approx. $300/pr.

- LPO temp cbt boots x 2 pair, LPO CWWBs x 2 pair, and LPO desert boots x 2 pair.  My current boots are about $180/pr for TCB and desert, and $230 for the CWWB because I make sure they meet the same specs as the CEMS project CWWB; Thinsulate, waterproof and all that IAW the CEMS project boots specs.

If I replaced all that at the same time, the bill would be about $1780, every 2 years.  Yup, we are great at producing shitty boots that no one wants that also have the added benefit of costing even MORE money for years after.  BZ!!

 

[Eye In The Sky]

The Cold Wet Weather Boot was the a** f**ce boot, which was the crappiest boot that I ever wore. The Wet Weather Boot was the Army equivalent. I was issued a pair of those when I returned the CWWBs to Borden Clothing Stores, with a scathing review (which I also posted on the a** f**ce CEMS (Clothing and Equipment Millennial Standard).

Borden Base Clothing was also nice enough to buy me two pairs of Magnum desert boots when they could not fit me with the ones in stock. No medical chit was required, and the very helpful lady had begun the paperwork while I was still struggling to cram a foot into a boot.

The CEMS project boots are junk IMO.  Kind of weird to be 'thankful' the old cbt boots messed my feet up, so now I am LPO for all types of boots and don't have to suffer with the 6lb cripplers on.  Who the hell wants to walk around with 5-6lbs of boots on even in the summer?  :facepalm:

Worst are the desert boots.  Absolute fuckin' junk that I would refuse to put on my feet if I wasn't a LPO type.

 

[BinRat55]

This summary is in itself a wonderful testament to how f&cked up the whole boot thing is, IMHO.

A very accurate statement. Add the rumour mill, outside-the-box policies and personal preference and you have ... well, this.

I know that unit RSMs will allow troops to wear personally bought footwear. I know that certain units even stock them in their kit shop. I know that there are many, many people who legitimately can't wear issued boots. But I also know there are many people who just want cool looking boots.

Here is what I also know - we are directed by ADM(MAT) to utilize all 76 sizes prior to going the COTS route. as far a medical chits go, we have have had meetings with the BSurg WRT the legitimacy of said chits. Now please don't get me wrong - as I said, there are many who legitimately can't wear the issued boot. But there was a problem in the past where some docs and physio people blindly writhing these chits. The system is tightening up quite a bit on COTS boots and there are now many hoops to leap through before it happens.

Yes, it's like a soup sandwich. I have heard that we are going back to MkIII with vibram soles, MkIV with different soles, sticking with the LOTB (two styles) come hell or high water and we are also going back to the "CADPAT GP". What I can tell you for fact is that all I can find on and CTS / CEMS / ADM / VCDS site is that we are issuing the LOTB through attrition - which means to me that we are exhausting our stock of everything else we have first. The only reason I can see this happening (my opinion only) is the LOTB is here to stay.

 

[PuckChaser]

As unethical as it is, no one would cry if there was at fire a depot only where they stock triwalls of crappy boots.

Fortunately for most troops, the common sizes are what we eat through first, so they won't have to wait long.