The Land Operations Temperate Boots (LOTB)

[McG]

The LCMM, for many items of kit, can do incremental improvements any time desired.  The specification could be modified prior to each contract to restock the shelves. 

For modifications of major end items, the preference is to get the whole fleet modded as quickly as possible.  Units holding the equipment may be pushed mod kits to do the changes on their own shop floors.  Quick conversion of fleets simplifies maintenance from a number of perspectives ... But sometimes a vehicle does keeps an old configuration longer than the remainder of the fleet, and suddenly a simple repair cannot be done without a significant mod at an inconvenient time.

 

[RCPalmer]

The LCMM, for many items of kit, can do incremental improvements any time desired.  The specification could be modified prior to each contract to restock the shelves. 

For modifications of major end items, the preference is to get the whole fleet modded as quickly as possible.  Units holding the equipment may be pushed mod kits to do the changes on their own shop floors.  Quick conversion of fleets simplifies maintenance from a number of perspectives ... But sometimes a vehicle does keeps an old configuration longer than the remainder of the fleet, and suddenly a simple repair cannot be done without a significant mod at an inconvenient time.

While that is a great point, I was more referring to the idea that when we buy an item off the shelf (particularly if it is a somewhat mature product) it has already been subject to iterative cycles of product improvements based off of the feedback of other end users. When we pursue our own designs, we don't have that benefit. 

 

[dangerboy]

We (DND) don't design anything. We issue out a statement of requirements to industry that lists the features we want the piece of equipment to have and the list of standards that it must conform to. Then industry puts forward their proposals to the SOR and the CF tests to ensures it meets the requirements but we don't select the winner.

 

[Terrier]

We (DND) don't design anything. We issue out a statement of requirements to industry that lists the features we want the piece of equipment to have and the list of standards that it must conform to. Then industry puts forward their proposals to the SOR and the CF tests to ensures it meets the requirements but we don't select the winner.

According to the PD brief with the Army Sergeant Major, it actually was "us" that decided on the Mark IV with the softer sole. They started out with a table full of boots, and via a list of "requirements" gained from trials, eliminated it rather quickly down to two boots. Then navigated their way to the current plan of the Mark IV with softer soles.

 

[BinRat55]

Again, I am not convinved we are scrapping the LOTB to go back to a boot we already have - considering that we are being told to completely deplete stocks in the MkIV before issuing the LOTB...

 

[Terrier]

Again, I am not convinved we are scrapping the LOTB to go back to a boot we already have - considering that we are being told to completely deplete stocks in the MkIV before issuing the LOTB...

If you're more in the know than the Army Sergeant Major,  so be it.

 

[Arty39]

According to the PD brief with the Army Sergeant Major, it actually was "us" that decided on the Mark IV with the softer sole. They started out with a table full of boots, and via a list of "requirements" gained from trials, eliminated it rather quickly down to two boots. Then navigated their way to the current plan of the Mark IV with softer soles.

That's what I remember hearing. All any one talked about that day was boots and kit.

 

[RCPalmer]

We (DND) don't design anything. We issue out a statement of requirements to industry that lists the features we want the piece of equipment to have and the list of standards that it must conform to. Then industry puts forward their proposals to the SOR and the CF tests to ensures it meets the requirements but we don't select the winner.

Correct me if I wrong, but wasn't there both DRDC and RSM net direct design input into the design of the load carriage system?

Perhaps a better way of saying it would be to draft an SOR that emphasizes the desirability of mature, widely used products, rather than designed from the ground up "bespoke" solutions.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Correct me if I wrong, but wasn't there both DRDC and RSM net direct design input into the design of the load carriage system?

I remember there was an infantry NCO on that project (if you're talking about the tacvest).  It's he said/she said but I've spoke with someone who talked to the NCO who apparently said he was  told to politely STFU anytime he disagreed with the Tacvest master plan and was basically there so the higher ups could defend the project by saying there was an infantry NCO SME on the team.

 

[PuckChaser]

I remember there was an infantry NCO on that project (if you're talking about the tacvest).  It's he said/she said but I've spoke with someone who talked to the NCO who apparently said he was  told to politely STFU anytime he disagreed with the Tacvest master plan and was basically there so the higher ups could defend the project by saying there was an infantry NCO SME on the team.

Makes sense, because someone at DLR around the time we bought the Bianchi pistol losing devices, I mean holsters, and the TacVest, also became a JTF-A commander. He took it personally that his troops didn't want to wear any of it, so he ordered everyone to only wear issued tacvests and holsters. Even threatened the Recce Pl Comd and WO with sending them home about 2 weeks into the Roto, because they had authorized their guys to buy rigs so they could actually be able to fight.

 

[BinRat55]

If you're more in the know than the Army Sergeant Major,  so be it.

Ok Terrier. You find me ONE post where I said the Army CWO was WRONG and that I know more than he. I said "I'm not CONVINCED..." which means my OPINION IS... why are you entitled to your opinion and I'm not? I have 27 years of senior staff either misinforming us unintentionally or completely reneging on wide ranges of issues.

No no - a CWO said it. It HAS to be true. You're right Terrier, in all your experience with the Logistic and Supply, there no WAY you can be wrong - because you were TOLD by a CWO.

I never once said you were outright wrong, nor did I call your integrity into question by inferring that you were better than anyone else.

 

[Terrier]

Ok Terrier. You find me ONE post where I said the Army CWO was WRONG and that I know more than he. I said "I'm not CONVINCED..." which means my OPINION IS... why are you entitled to your opinion and I'm not? I have 27 years of senior staff either misinforming us unintentionally or completely reneging on wide ranges of issues.

No no - a CWO said it. It HAS to be true. You're right Terrier, in all your experience with the Logistic and Supply, there no WAY you can be wrong - because you were TOLD by a CWO.

I never once said you were outright wrong, nor did I call your integrity into question by inferring that you were better than anyone else.

I don't recall saying anything of the sort,  nor have I stated an opinion of any kind. I've simply posted what the Army Sergeant Major passed on. 

 

[Nfld Sapper]

Oy vey.....

If you got nothing constructive to add, take the  :argument: banter to PM's.....

MILNET MENTOR

 

[Poppa]

This morning I received a phone call from clothing....boots in my size were available. Not expecting much I made the trek over and lo and behold LOTBs as far as the eye could see. I tried on the both versions and came away with the Terra (I don't like zippers). They're comfy but a bit on the short side so my blousing looks British.
That's about it for now

 

[Miller97]

I was under the impression they have recently stopped issuing out boots due to a massive amounts of breakdowns on the royer models? I have one of each and much prefer the terras over the royers.

 

[LPike]

My experience with the LOTB.

The Terra ones are the nicest. I did have an eyelet break on my first pair.

The Royer (Zipped) ones are garbage.Third time putting them on, the zip snapped.

I went back and got another pair of Terra boots, just because a broken eyelet is better than a broken zipper in the feild. My one issue with the Terras is that their impossible to clean after any sort of feild ex. My first pair looked like sh*t very quickly, every after brass brushing like no tomorrow.

Sent from my XT1563 using Tapatalk

 

[PuckChaser]

I wouldn't use a brass brush, the boots are faux suede, brass is going to cut them apart as you recently found out.

 

[ZKC]

How did this thread get so far away from the original topic... I just wanted to know if they've started issuing them lol

 

[PuckChaser]

They've stopped issuing the LOTB. If you've got it, you can exchange. If you don't, buy your own or hope they have your size in GP/DCB.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

How did this thread get so far away from the original topic... I just wanted to know if they've started issuing them lol

Yes and no... they are issued as the last resort if they have your size in the other previous boots.....