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The navy is broke,' says former sailor over maintenance budget

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Navy battles mould in frigate ventilation systems

All of Canada's front-line navy frigates have had serious mould problems, something that has routinely affected the health of sailors deployed overseas, a CBC News investigation has determined.

The navy has struggled to deal with the blight in the ventilation systems of the warships since it was first documented aboard HMCS St. John's in the fall of 2011, but a former senior commissioned officer says his repeated pleas to fix the situation fell on deaf ears.

More at link:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canadian-frigates-mouldy-1.3685779

 
Jesus...these next 2 quotes are only inches apart in the article.

The commander of the East Coast fleet, Commodore Craig Baines, acknowledged mould is a fleet-wide concern, but said the navy has been proactive to come up with a solution outside of the refit program.

"We have absolutely no concern about the mould in the ships," Baines told CBC News in an interview.

::)

If what the reports from the other HMCSs inspection detailed in the article are even half true, maybe the good Commodore could explain how he has "absolutely no concern" for his ships and more importantly, their crews.
 
For as long as I have sailed in frigates, the AC unit condensation issues have been a known problem. It was not unusual to have to keep your gortex rain jacket on top of your rack to keep it from getting soaked as condensation poured from the chiller units over head when the ship rolled.

We would routinely have electrical equipment destroyed in the Aircrew Ready Room (ADR), unless we modified the AC unit and added a drain line to dump the water down and away from anything important.

I am surprised it has taken this long to figure out that there is a mould issue.
 
Eye In The Sky said:
If what the reports from the other HMCSs inspection detailed in the article are even half true, maybe the good Commodore could explain how he has "absolutely no concern" for his ships and more importantly, their crews.
Based only on what's written, it sounds like he has enough confidence in the solutions that even though it's there, it's not a worry.

That said, I can't read the mind of either the Good Commodore, the former CPO or the reporter - and I can't read documents that don't appear to have been shared with media consumers.  Usually, if the docs are obtained via ATIP, they can be or are shared.  Any other acquisition method = no can share.
 
blackberet17 said:
No disrespect, but unless I failed Basic, a CPO is not a "senior commissioned officer".

Well the media often gets our rank system confused and turned inside out.  I was reported as being a CPO1 6 months ago in the Chronicle Herald, I am actually a PO2...

These "follies" seem to be par for the course now. 
 
blackberet17 said:
No disrespect, but unless I failed Basic, a CPO is not a "senior commissioned officer".

The bottom of the article features this:
Clarifications

Clarifies MacLaughlin's rank in paragraph 2.
Jul 25, 2016 9:53 AM ET 
Perhaps it was initially misreported as a Snr Officer rank.  Regardless, I don't think that's the key issue.
 
milnews.ca said:
Based only on what's written, it sounds like he has enough confidence in the solutions that even though it's there, it's not a worry.

That said, I can't read the mind of either the Good Commodore, the former CPO or the reporter - and I can't read documents that don't appear to have been shared with media consumers.  Usually, if the docs are obtained via ATIP, they can be or are shared.  Any other acquisition method = no can share.

Agreed, but the rest of the article sort of makes his lines sound...questionable? 

If the refugees we brought to Canada recently were made to live in mouldy living conditions for years, the press and opposition would have a field day.  If its just our citizens who volunteer to serve their country in uniform...meh.  No biggy.  :nod:
 
Eye In The Sky said:
Agreed, but the rest of the article sort of makes his lines sound...questionable? 
And this would be the first time in Veritas history the lines are more ... optimistic/charitable ... than the REST of the story?  ;D
 
Journeyman said:
Regardless, I don't think that's the key issue.

Well aware, it was just something I noted in the article.

I thought it...the word escapes me...disingenuous? In any case, the two paragraphs regarding the clawed-back maintenance budget, and the lapsed/unused budget funds being returned, the two are not necessarily connected  - was it funds budgeted for maintenance which were being returned, or was it funds for (an)other budget item(s)?
 
The former CPO a while back posted quite a few pictures and other documents on a RCN face book group and made a lot of wild claims. He was told to cool it, persisted and was banned. Mold is always a problem with ventilation systems that deal with recirculated air. I wonder is PMed was involved with air quality testing on board. I found the same when I was sailing on a different Class of ship, people would develop a hack after a few weeks. It mostly has to do with recycled air, constant AC and other factor, persistent mold was not a problem.
 
Shack hack is common in army barracks as well. Lots of people in close quarters, that stuff spreads rapidly.
 
Chief Stoker said:
The former CPO a while back posted quite a few pictures and other documents on a RCN face book group and made a lot of wild claims. He was told to cool it, persisted and was banned. Mold is always a problem with ventilation systems that deal with recirculated air. I wonder is PMed was involved with air quality testing on board. I found the same when I was sailing on a different Class of ship, people would develop a hack after a few weeks. It mostly has to do with recycled air, constant AC and other factor, persistent mold was not a problem.

The article makes reference to Navy documents and inspections and the like.  Not "crazy CPO Bloggins" FB group stuff.
 
PuckChaser said:
Shack hack is common in army barracks as well. Lots of people in close quarters, that stuff spreads rapidly.

Common in all recycled air buildings, had in J7 in Gagetown.  Our roof vents were always moldy during winter.  Come spring they would clean the vents.
 
Eye In The Sky said:
If the refugees we brought to Canada recently were made to live in mouldy living conditions for years, the press and opposition would have a field day.  If its just our citizens who volunteer to serve their country in uniform...meh.  No biggy.  :nod:
Good point - although I suspect the lines to deal with the bit in orange would be just as optimistic as the ones we've seen on the bit in yellow.  All Info-machines are pretty similar that way.
 
Chief Stoker said:
I found the same when I was sailing on a different Class of ship, people would develop a hack after a few weeks. It mostly has to do with recycled air, constant AC and other factor, persistent mold was not a problem.

There's relatively inexpensive solutions to those problems, just needs someone to write it into a refit spec, or for that matter, very easy for crew on board to do.

Given how many folks the navy jams into a boat, investing in UV sterilizers for the AHUs would pay off productive man hours.

They take up no space (typically mounted inside the duct itself), and are very simple to install (powered from an existing lighting circuit.

May or may not affect positive pressure for NBCD protection, may require some study, to be honest I'm not sure if there's any notable reduction in air flow.
 
Eye In The Sky said:
The article makes reference to Navy documents and inspections and the like.  Not "crazy CPO Bloggins" FB group stuff.

No the stuff was legit, he was told to take it down because it was a possible issue of protected material. He was also going on about possible claims and medical pensions. This was the same guy, he was working in NDHQ.
 
Not a Sig Op said:
There's relatively inexpensive solutions to those problems, just needs someone to write it into a refit spec, or for that matter, very easy for crew on board to do.

Given how many folks the navy jams into a boat, investing in UV sterilizers for the AHUs would pay off productive man hours.

They take up no space (typically mounted inside the duct itself), and are very simple to install (powered from an existing lighting circuit.

May or may not affect positive pressure for NBCD protection, may require some study, to be honest I'm not sure if there's any notable reduction in air flow.

Pretty good idea, on the class of ship that I have sailed on we have its 6 furnace type filters in the AHU.
 
Now this is in the media, I wonder if there is going to be a sudden increase in VAC claims with people who has respiratory issues that sailed on the ships?
 
gryphonv said:
Now this is in the media, I wonder if there is going to be a sudden increase in VAC claims with people who has respiratory issues that said on the ships?


If it was a case of unsafe working conditions that led to chronic illness yes I would imagine it would.
 
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