Author Topic: Question about foreign service, medals and badges and para course for C.I.C.  (Read 63440 times)

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Offline SFSG

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It's my first post in here, I did search for about 2 hours on this forum but couldn't find any info on my specific question!

I served with the British 1st parachute regiment for a bit more then 5 years
Over the years I served in Iraq, Afghanistan and more
I did cumulate medals and also my British para wing
I will be returning home to Canada soon and I was thinking about joining my ex cadet Corp to become a CIC officer. I am wondering if I'm accepted and join the CIC will I be allowed to wear my British medals on my CF and my para wings?

I read a tread about foreign para wing but it was only talking about CF members serving in other countries and not about old military personal that have served with a foreign country.

Also if I join the CIC will there be a chance for me to maybe try out and go for the Canadian parachute training program?
Although it might be boring considering the fact that I am qualified for H.A.L.O. , H.A.H.O. And of course static line jumps. It still could be nice to represent the para here in Canada also.
paras don't die, we re-group in hell

Offline CRMA

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If you think you'll be bored if you cant do HALO and HAHO jumps, dont you think you'll get bored being in the CIC...

Offline SFSG

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If you think you'll be bored if you cant do HALO and HAHO jumps, dont you think you'll get bored being in the CIC...
I'm not saying the course will be boring in anyway, if I can do it I'll crack on and do it! What I'm saying is that it's going to be a hell lot different then what I was used of.
C.I.C. Is not boring as you say! I think a great deal of the C.I.C job is to steer and help youth and that's what I want to do! And it will still keep me in a some what "military environment"
If I wanted to still be a soldier don't you think I wouldve stayed in the army?
Lol
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Offline BulletMagnet

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To answer you question,

No you are not allowed to wear foreign wings in CF uniform unless you are in the country who has given them to you. So in Canada no if you and your cadets take a trip to England then yes you may put them on your dress uniform.

As for Medals If they are NATO issue medals then you may wear them. If they are for missions non NATO authorized and/or Home nation specific then you cannot wear them, Such as your current Iraq medal but likely you could wear Afghanistan.

Medals such as N.Ireland are a for sure no as that is a home nation specific

EDIT: Spelling
« Last Edit: August 05, 2011, 10:37:03 by BulletMagnet »
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MikeL

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Some CIC Officers have attended the Basic Para Course

Also, you say you were in the 1st parachute regiment? Do you mean 1st Battalion of The Parachute Regiment? I assume so since your username is SFSG which is what 1Para belongs too.


Offline SFSG

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So basically I can were my NATO Afghanistan medal and my Afghanistan op herrick service medal but not my Op Telic Iraq one since Canada wasn't involve. Cheers mate!

What about the MC( military cross) and the golden jubilee ?

1st battalion of the British parachute regiment
SFSG based in MOD St Athan since 2009
« Last Edit: August 05, 2011, 10:45:18 by SFSG »
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aesop081

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Op Telic

Tell Everyone Leave Is Cancelled

 ;D

I worked in gagetown with an Ex-Brit who wore his Falklands medal. You may be able to wear your Iraq one.

Offline Strike

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To answer you question,

No you are not allowed to wear foreign wings in CF uniform unless you are in the country who has given them to you. So in Canada no if you and your cadets take a trip to England then yes you may put them on your dress uniform.

As for Medals If they are NATO issue medals then you may wear them. If they are for missions non NATO authorized and/or Home nation specific then you cannot wear them, Such as your current Iraq medal but likely you could wear Afghanistan.

Medals such as N.Ireland are a for sure no as that is a home nation specific

EDIT: Spelling

Not too sure about the wings thing.  I know of a fighter pilot who is now in the Canadian Air Force who earned his wings through the UK when he was with their Air Force.  Of course, his training was done in Moose Jaw, so that may have something to do with it.
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Offline ModlrMike

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Quote
CFAO 18-6 -- COMMONWEALTH AND FOREIGN ORDERS, DECORATIONS AND MEDALS



6.       A member who was awarded an order, decoration or medal by a foreign power prior to enrolment may be granted approval to wear the insignia and ribbon while in uniform. To obtain approval the member shall submit a written request to the member's commanding officer (CO), accompanied by documentary proof of the award. The CO shall forward the request with the
original or photocopy of the documentary proof, through normal channels, to NDHQ/DC.

7.       If a member is granted authority to wear a foreign award, a copy of the authority shall be filed on the Unit Personnel Record and the NDHQ personal document file.

That should include all of your medals as they emanate from HM.


For your wings, you will likely have to seek authority up the chain. If you want to attend the CF Para course... don't hold your breath. As a CIC officer you would be well down the priority list (likely falling off the bottom of it).
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Offline BulletMagnet

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My understanding came from Ex-Brit members serving now with the CF in terms of medals

For the wings that is the CF policy I havent the power to look up the dress reg on it. Though I have seen it quoted here a few times and around my old unit.
"Often have I regretted my speech, never my silence" Cpl Jordan Anderson 1981-2007 RIP

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Offline SFSG

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Cheers mates! Good info! Glade to know that I might have the chance to represent my military service in Canada even if I want to be a cic!
As guess it will fall in the hands of the chain of command lol not sure if it's a good think lol we know how the F&@$ S$&@ up lol!
It also ok for the Canadian para wing I don't really need to prove anything, I've been there done that!
paras don't die, we re-group in hell

Offline BulletMagnet

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Well you wouldnt need to do the full basic Para anyway to get then, it would likely be a conversion jump quick ground school and the a hop and pop est voila Canadian Wings...

I would suggest when you get here and if you go CIC that you conact say the Jump school known as CFLAWC (Canadian Land Advanced Warfare Centre) and ask them about it, you may just need to provide a copy of your pers file showing your Jump related Quals.

Also check your personal messages there is another route for you possibly
"Often have I regretted my speech, never my silence" Cpl Jordan Anderson 1981-2007 RIP

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Offline Old Sweat

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There was a British exchange officer in the Land Staff circa 1993 who transferred to the CF. He continued to wear his British ribbons, but traded his SAS wings for the Canadian parachute badge with silver maple leaf.

Offline Brihard

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I can only speak to this anecdotally, but I've also worked with a couple of former Brit service members who've been allowed to wear whatever they had, with order of precedence falling behind everything Canadian. I would be surprised if wear of a full set of British medals were not authorized.
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Offline BulletMagnet

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OS,

Don't know about you but I tend not to argue with former members of the SAS.... I like my health and ability to walk lmao.

If he said he was wearing something who was going to stop him right  ;D
"Often have I regretted my speech, never my silence" Cpl Jordan Anderson 1981-2007 RIP

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Online Blackadder1916

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If your interest in doing the Canadian course is more about getting Canadian wings, then it might not be necessary.

CFAO 55-10 applies http://www.admfincs.forces.gc.ca/cfa-oaf/055-10-eng.asp
Quote
SPECIALIST SKILL BADGES -- GENERAL

17. A CF specialist skill badge may be awarded to a CF member of the Regular or Reserve Force after successful completion of formal CF training or a CF qualifying course for parachutists, submariners, clearance divers, ship divers, combat divers, or explosive ordonance disposal (EOD) members.

18. Members who have received military training or courses from other countries for which the requirements are deemed to be equivalent to CF training requirements may be authorized to wear the applicable CF specialist skill badge subject to approval by NDHQ/DGRET.

PARACHUTE BADGE

19. A CF parachute badge may be awarded to a member of the Regular or Reserve Force after successful completion of formal CF training or a CF qualifying course for parachutists.

20. Members who have received military training or courses from other countries for which the requirements are deemed to be equivalent may be authorized to wear the CF parachute badge subject to approval by NDHQ/DLO (Director Land Operations).
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Offline SFSG

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Cheers guys really help full!
paras don't die, we re-group in hell

Offline Mike63

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When I was posted in North Bay (96-03), there was an Ex-Brit that served in Ireland and he was allowed to wear his ribbons/medals.
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Offline BillN

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Never had a problem wearing my Brit medals after I switched over in 1981, including my GSM for NI.

But I did have to ask formal permission in writing from some office in NDHQ (can't remember which), and along with permission to wear my medals, permission was also granted to wear Canadian jump wings as I held Brit wings.

Somebody will know who you should ask permission from.

Offline BulletMagnet

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Moral of the story is come over get the job you want then ask questions of your CoC and do some research on the DIN and such from there you will probably be good to go for just about anything you need.

Glad we all could help
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Offline Towards_the_gap

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When did you get out? How long have you lived in Canada? What herrick/telic tours did you do?

Offline Pusser

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Never had a problem wearing my Brit medals after I switched over in 1981, including my GSM for NI.

But I did have to ask formal permission in writing from some office in NDHQ (can't remember which), and along with permission to wear my medals, permission was also granted to wear Canadian jump wings as I held Brit wings.

Somebody will know who you should ask permission from.

This is the correct answer.  That is, you have to ask permission and it is highly likely that you will be allowed to wear all medals earned while in the British Army (even for UN/NATO missions in which Canada is/was not a participant).  I've known a number of Canadians with service in the UK who wear their GSM with NI bar.  Your request has to go through the Chain of Command to the Director of Honours and Recognition (DH&R), who in turn will forward it to the Chancellery of Honours at Rideau Hall.  It can take a little while, but it will likely all be approved in due course.

I'm not absolutely sure on the para wings, but my best recollection of the policy is that if you have successfully completed a course that is deemed equivalent to the Canadian course, then you are entitled to wear the Canadian badge.  Only under very special circumstances would you be allowed to wear a foreign badge in Canada (one criteria being that the CF has no equivalent badge, which is not the case here).  This does not, however, prevent a lot of people wearing foreign badges on their mess kits.

As an aside, any service with the British Army (or any of Her Majesty's Forces around the globe) that has not been recognized with another long service medal (in this case the British Army LS&GC) can be used toward award of the Canadian Forces Decoration (CD), provided that the last five years are served with the CF.  For example, if you did seven years with the British Army (i.e. no entitlement to LS&GC yet) and then joined the CF, you could be awarded the CD after five years in the CF (provided you meet all the other criteria).   However, if you did 15 years in the British Army and did receive the LS&GC, then you would have to serve 12 years in the CF to get the CD.  If you did 20 years in the British Army and received the LS&GC, then you would have to do seven years in the CF to receive the CD.  In another example, British Army officers (who are not normally eligible for long service medals) with 17 years service in the UK may be awarded a CD and bar all at once after five years in the CF (i.e. for 22 years total service to Her Majesty).
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Offline MCG

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So basically I can were my NATO Afghanistan medal and my Afghanistan op herrick service medal ...
Having recently seen the a decision letter from DHH on this topic - as UK sees their medal as the official (for lack of better word) recognition, you would not be authorized to wear the NATO medal from the same service that the UK medal recognizes. 

Offline Pusser

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Having recently seen the a decision letter from DHH on this topic - as UK sees their medal as the official (for lack of better word) recognition, you would not be authorized to wear the NATO medal from the same service that the UK medal recognizes.

We have similar rules.  If Canada issues a medal to recognize a period of service, then the UN/NATO/other medal for the same service is not inducted into the Canadian Honours System (and thus, cannot be worn with Canadian Honours or on CF uniform).  In short, Canada does not permit dual recognition of the same service.  For the most part, this does preclude someone from accepting the second medal and hanging it on their wall.  They just can't mount and wear it with their Canadian medals on their uniform.  However, if they are recognizing two different periods of service (and I don't know the specifics here), then it may be possible to wear both.  If both were authorized to be worn in the UK, it is possible that both would be authorized here.

The Director of History and Heritage (DHH) has nothing to do with this.  The request goes through the Director of Honours and Recognition (DH&R), but the actual decision comes from the Chancellery/Governor General.

When considering foreign awards to be worn with Canadian Honours, two (of several) key questions are:

1)  From where does it emanate?  Her Majesty is the fount of all Canadian Honours, so no foreign award will be approved unless it is awarded by a Head of State (e.g. a medal from the US Secretary of the Navy would not be approved); and

2)  Would the award constitute dual recognition (i.e. is the individual in receipt of or eligible for a Canadian Honour for the same service)?
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Offline formercadet1029

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Wow, this is a nutty topic. Just wear them all together on a blue blazer or something, not much anyone can do about that.

Offline N. McKay

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Wow, this is a nutty topic. Just wear them all together on a blue blazer or something, not much anyone can do about that.

It's good to get it right, even if you won't go to jail for getting it wrong.

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Wow, this is a nutty topic. Just wear them all together on a blue blazer or something, not much anyone can do about that.

The OP is asking if he can wear the medals and qualification badge he earned while in the British Army on his CF uniform.  It's a valid question and there is a correct answer.  Why make a lazy comment that doesn't even address what the OP is actually asking?
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Offline Brihard

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Following up- one of our NCOs here at my current tasking served with the Scots Guards, and wears his South Atlantic Medal from the Falklands, his General Service Medal with Northern Ireland bar, and his long sevice/good conduct medal. They are all worn after his CD.
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Offline formercadet1029

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The OP is asking if he can wear the medals and qualification badge he earned while in the British Army on his CF uniform.  It's a valid question and there is a correct answer.  Why make a lazy comment that doesn't even address what the OP is actually asking?
Well, judging by all of the responses, it doesn't seem to be 100% clear as what is what because it seems everyone is on their own plan. Doesn't it? While I think medals are an important part of the overall experience of putting yourself at risk, my attitude about this specific topic is somewhat different than many other people you'll find posting here. I have a couple of good friends in the reserves and reg force, most of them decline to wear these things on their dress uniform unless they are absolutely directed to. Most of us belong to the anti Walts group on facebook.

Moderator edit: Removed link to Facebook page with racist content. You might chuckle at it but it violates site guidelines. It is also in poor taste.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2011, 09:11:35 by Scott »

Online rmc_wannabe

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Well, judging by all of the responses, it doesn't seem to be 100% clear as what is what because it seems everyone is on their own plan. Doesn't it? While I think medals are an important part of the overall experience of putting yourself at risk, my attitude about this specific topic is somewhat different than many other people you'll find posting here. I have a couple of good friends in the reserves and reg force, most of them decline to wear these things on their dress uniform unless they are absolutely directed to. Most of us belong to the anti Walts group on facebook.


Regardless if the OP was a "Walt" which I doubt he would be asking a simple question such as he did, numerous posters have provided the regs and valid cases of people authorized to wear these medals to enlighten the OP.

Your argument has no validity or context to this thread. You've pretty much accomplished the internet's version of standing on a soapbox on a street corner trying to shout your opinions louder than people carrying on a normal conversation. Congratulations  :salute:

Edited by moderator to remove link, provided in quote from another member, to Facebook group with racist content.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2011, 09:10:09 by Scott »
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Offline Journeyman

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I have a couple of good friends in the reserves and reg force, most of them decline to wear these things on their dress uniform unless they are absolutely directed to.
Which "things" are you specifically referring to -- British jump wings or British campaign medals?

Offline daftandbarmy

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I'm ex-1 PARA.

I wear the Canadian wings with the silver maple leaf and my NI medal. It was all sorted out during the enrolment process. I also wear US wings on my DEU as per SOP.

On my mess kit I wear the Blue Badge of courage on my right shoulder, Commando Dagger on my left (did an exchange with Royal after doing their AACC), Canadian Wings with silver maple leaf (as I also served with a Canadian Operational Parachute unit), US wings, NI medal and CD. Didn't need any permission to put all the foreign bling on the mess kit. Seriously considering transferring it all to a sash of some kind...

I also carry an extremely large wooden racing spoon but you fancy SFSG 'Hollywood crows' probably wouldn't know about that, never having had to eat out of a mess tin like a proper PARA.  ;D
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Online PPCLI Guy

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Most of us belong to the anti Walts group on facebook.

Who is this "us" of whom you speak?  is it people with the same military experience as yourself?

I was a former Army Cadet, joined when I was 12, left when I turned 19 in 1989.

I was the Cadet RSM/CWO, left with Gold Star with Wreath, Advanced First Aide and Crossed Rifles & Crown

Summer Training:

'84 Junior Cadet, Ipperwash
'85 Cadet Leader, Ipperwash
'86 Wilderness Leadership, Petawawa
'87 Leadership and Challenge, Banff
'88 Basic Para, Edmonton
'89 Staff Cadet Wilderness Leadership Basic, Ipperwash

Years later, I received an Army Cadet Long Service medal, with two service bars. I don't recall there being any medal system in place when I was a cadet???

I assume from this that you decline to wear your "Army Cadet Long Service medal, with two service bars" for fear of appearing "Walt-ish"...

Edited by moderator to remove link, provided in quote from another member, to Facebook page with racist content.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2011, 09:09:00 by Scott »
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Offline formercadet1029

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Who is this "us" of whom you speak?  is it people with the same military experience as yourself?

I assume from this that you decline to wear your "Army Cadet Long Service medal, with two service bars" for fear of appearing "Walt-ish"...

Edited by moderator to remove link, provided in quote from another member, to Facebook page with racist content.
I wasn't aware that I had to post my service experience as well (like many of the braggarts found here seem to do every other minute), to qualify my opinion. The original question of that thread you quoted me from was asking what cadet qualifications people had. Typically infantry guy trying to make himself feel better about have to walk everywhere, lol.  :)

BTW, I've never worn my cadet cookie medal, as it sits in a box with the rest of my "real" ones, lol.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2011, 11:31:37 by formercadet1029 »

Offline Michael O'Leary

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I wasn't aware that I had to post my service experience as well (like many of the braggarts found here seem to do every other minute), to qualify my opinion, as your quote is from a cadet only related thread, here in this cadet related forum. BTW, I've never worn my cadet medal, it's in a box with the rest of my "real" ones, lol.

Former cadet,

If you want to try and throw your weight around in a "cadet only related thread" in a "cadet related forum", then I'm sure you can go find an appropriate forum to do that in. Here, you get to deal with the entirety of the membership, and your personal Walt-hunting attitude is not helping. If you want to use that approach elsewhere on the internet, please do so, here we prefer  to wait until someone actually outs themselves in an undeniable fashion, because the only thing worse than being a Walt, is to accuse someone wrongly. There are more than enough people here who can interpret the Dress Manual and current regulations, and who have recent experience with the processes on seeking authorization for items that are not specifically mentioned in the Dress Manual. In comparison you probably don't have much expertise to offer the membership here, and your membership in a self-appointed "walt hunting" group doesn't count for much.  So, rather than trying throw your own weight around here, why don't you relax and let Milnet.ca police its own actions.

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Offline formercadet1029

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Former cadet,

If you want to try and throw your weight around in a "cadet only related thread" in a "cadet related forum", then I'm sure you can go find an appropriate forum to do that in. Here, you get to deal with the entirety of the membership, and your personal Walt-hunting attitude is not helping. If you want to use that approach elsewhere on the internet, please do so, here we prefer  to wait until someone actually outs themselves in an undeniable fashion, because the only thing worse than being a Walt, is to accuse someone wrongly. There are more than enough people here who can interpret the Dress Manual and current regulations, and who have recent experience with the processes on seeking authorization for items that are not specifically mentioned in the Dress Manual. In comparison you probably don't have much expertise to offer the membership here, and your membership in a self-appointed "walt hunting" group doesn't count for much.  So, rather than trying throw your own weight around here, why don't you relax and let Milnet.ca police its own actions.

Milnet.ca Staff
Well, I'm certainly not a Walt hunter by any stretch. My comments in this thread are more than worthy in my opinion, since everyone in here seems to be contradicting each other with whatever info is being posted. There doesn't seem to be clear answer because it's obvious that whatever regulations are in place, people are wearing what they want. My opinion is this, if you're awarded so0me type of service medal under the honours system, then it should be ok to wear it, as many appear to be.

Throwing my weight around? Are suggsting I should go on a diet,, lol? :) Sorry, just my poor attempt at humour.

Offline Strike

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My comments in this thread are more than worthy in my opinion, since everyone in here seems to be contradicting each other with whatever info is being posted. There doesn't seem to be clear answer because it's obvious that whatever regulations are in place, people are wearing what they want.

No one is really contradicting each other.  What they all have pretty much said is to go through the CoC and ask for permission.  There may be different results, but that is due to the various different types of leaders in said CoCs.
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Offline formercadet1029

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No one is really contradicting each other.  What they all have pretty much said is to go through the CoC and ask for permission.  There may be different results, but that is due to the various different types of leaders in said CoCs.
Fair enough. :)

Offline Journeyman

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So once you're done bemoaning braggarts, while claiming to have a box of "real" medals....are you going to answer this question, posed earlier?

Offline formercadet1029

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So once you're done bemoaning braggarts, while claiming to have a box of "real" medals....are you going to answer this question, posed earlier?
Well, I guess I forced into the pissing competition just to validate my opinion, lol. ::) ::) ::) which was the point of my comment, it's unfortunate that a blood sample needs to be provided in this forum just to offer an opinion.

As far as my earlier reference goes, I was at a mess dinner a few months ago in Toronto and a friend of my was taking heat for not wearing his campaign and service medals. His reply was this, in his opinion, the fact that he made it back from his last tour (armoured regiment) without being the target of a Taliban bomb buried in the road should speak miles more than some ribbon and tin ever could.

Offline Journeyman

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You actually claimed a "couple of good friends in the reserves and reg force."

Now, personally, I don't give a crap one way or another about your military experience. My issue here is with the truth/informed opinion primarily; the fact that you contributed nothing but a lame attitude in failing to answer the posted question is a distant second.

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As far as my earlier reference goes, I was at a mess dinner a few months ago in Toronto and a friend of my was taking heat for not wearing his campaign and service medals. His reply was this, in his opinion, the fact that he made it back from his last tour (armoured regiment) without being the target of a Taliban bomb buried in the road should speak miles more than some ribbon and tin ever could.

If a medal is award it should be worn, whether they're just "ribbon or tin". Sounds like your friend is just pissed he didn't get something prestigious like a MMV or Medal of Bravery.

Offline Pusser

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Well, I guess I forced into the pissing competition just to validate my opinion, lol. ::) ::) ::) which was the point of my comment, it's unfortunate that a blood sample needs to be provided in this forum just to offer an opinion.

As far as my earlier reference goes, I was at a mess dinner a few months ago in Toronto and a friend of my was taking heat for not wearing his campaign and service medals. His reply was this, in his opinion, the fact that he made it back from his last tour (armoured regiment) without being the target of a Taliban bomb buried in the road should speak miles more than some ribbon and tin ever could.

Some ribbon and tin?  Napoleon once opined that with enough coloured ribbon he could conquer the world!  I guess he ran out of ribbon  ;D (the best ribbon manufacturers are in the UK anyway).

Each to his/her own, but just because someone chooses not to wear their medals (for whatever reason) does not mean that the medals themselves have no meaning.  The process to create honours is long, complex and full of checks and balances.  This is why it takes so long to create them.  By the time the Queen personally approves a Canadian honour (and She personally approves all Canadian honours), the criteria, the regulations and the design itself have really gone through the wringer.  These decisions are not taken lightly.  Is it is a perfect process?  No, but no decisions are taken lightly and much debate occurs beforehand (Armed Forces Council, Canadian Honours Policy Committee, Prime Minister's Office, Etc) .

The original poster asked whether he could wear his medals earned while in the British Army on his CF uniform.  The answer, for the most part is probably yes, but there some hoops he has to jump through.  These hoops are actually there to protect the integrity of the Honours System and the respect of the CF uniform and that's a good thing.  I really don't think that flippant remarks about the value of honours or that you should just wear whatever you want on a blue blazer are helpful or appropriate.  Are you saying that the medals worn by members of the Legion are of questionable value?

Most members of the CF, although sometimes humbled by the honours they receive, are justifiably proud of them.  If some choose not to wear them, that's their business, but it is inappropriate to cast aspersions on those who do.  The original poster has, as far as we know, earned his honours from an honours system very much like our own.  He should be permitted to wear them accordingly and with pride.
Sure, apes read Nietzsche.  They just don't understand it.

Offline formercadet1029

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Most members of the CF, although sometimes humbled by the honours they receive, are justifiably proud of them.  If some choose not to wear them, that's their business, but it is inappropriate to cast aspersions on those who do.  The original poster has, as far as we know, earned his honours from an honours system very much like our own.  He should be permitted to wear them accordingly and with pride.
I agree with you 100%, if you have legit awards inside the system, then there shouldn't be any reason you shouldn't be allowed to wear them.

Offline my72jeep

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For your wings, you will likely have to seek authority up the chain. If you want to attend the CF Para course... don't hold your breath. As a CIC officer you would be well down the priority list (likely falling off the bottom of it).
[/quote]
As a CIC Officer you can apply for one of the 3 officer slots every year with the cadet jump course( these are admim slots but the option to train  jump and qualify are there)
« Last Edit: August 12, 2011, 16:23:33 by my72jeep »
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Offline Fishbone Jones

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As far as my earlier reference goes, I was at a mess dinner a few months ago in Toronto and a friend of my was taking heat for not wearing his campaign and service medals. His reply was this, in his opinion, the fact that he made it back from his last tour (armoured regiment) without being the target of a Taliban bomb buried in the road should speak miles more than some ribbon and tin ever could.

If he has been awarded medals\ decorations, and refuses to wear them while in the proper uniform, he's out of dress and should be given heat.

As well as a few extras to solidify the point.
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What scares me is how comfortable people are doing nothing about it.

Offline Pusser

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If he has been awarded medals\ decorations, and refuses to wear them while in the proper uniform, he's out of dress and should be given heat.

As well as a few extras to solidify the point.

There is actually no regulation that specifically states you must wear your medals.  The regulations only state how they shall be worn if worn.  Should still be good for a few drinks though...
Sure, apes read Nietzsche.  They just don't understand it.

Offline daftandbarmy

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I wasn't aware that I had to post my service experience as well (like many of the braggarts found here seem to do every other minute), to qualify my opinion. The original question of that thread you quoted me from was asking what cadet qualifications people had. Typically infantry guy trying to make himself feel better about have to walk everywhere, lol.  :)

BTW, I've never worn my cadet cookie medal, as it sits in a box with the rest of my "real" ones, lol.

Hellloooooooo..... I'm right heeeerrrreeeee!  ;D

"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

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There is actually no regulation that specifically states you must wear your medals.  The regulations only state how they shall be worn if worn.  Should still be good for a few drinks though...

To me, a regulation stating how medals will be worn is an implied order that if you're awarded a medal you will wear it, and in the following manner.

Online Blackadder1916

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There is actually no regulation that specifically states you must wear your medals.  The regulations only state how they shall be worn if worn.  Should still be good for a few drinks though...

To me, a regulation stating how medals will be worn is an implied order that if you're awarded a medal you will wear it, and in the following manner.

What do the regulations state?

In QR&Os

Quote
Section 2 – Wearing

18.11 – GENERAL

(1) No officer or non-commissioned member shall wear
an order, decorations, medal or the ribbon representing
any of them without authority.

(2) The order and manner of wearing orders, decorations,
medals and the ribbons representing them shall be as
notified by the Chief of the Defence Staff
.

(M)

18.12 – NON-MILITARY DECORATIONS AND
MEDALS

(1) No officer or non-commissioned member when in
uniform shall wear a non-military decoration or medal, or
the ribbon representing any such decoration or medal,
except:

. . . . . .

And the manner that the CDS used for notification is CFP 265:

Quote
CHAPTER 4

ORDERS, DECORATIONS, MEDALS AND
OTHER HONOURS

POLICY

1. Authorized honours (orders, decorations,
medals, and the insignia for mentions-indispatches,
commendations and citations) may be
worn
, when appropriate, by entitled personnel.
Where doubt exists on entitlement, the Command
concerned shall refer the matter to NDHQ/DHH for
clarification. No officer or non-commissioned
member shall carry or wear an order, decoration or
medal while engaged in operations against the
enemy.

2. Orders, decorations and medals may be
worn
with ceremonial and mess dress orders. See
Chapter 2, Annex A, and Chapter 6. Guidance on
selecting honours for wear should follow the
principles in sub-sub-paragraphs 7.a.(1) and (2)
and sub-paragraph 8.a.

3. Undress ribbons and related insignia are
worn on lesser dress orders as detailed in
paragraph 11. and Chapter 6.

. . . . .

Doesn't seem to be any implied orders there, the operative word is "may" - which shall be construed as permissive.  Nor does the dress instructions permit any lower level of command to change them to suit local whims.
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Offline BulletMagnet

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With that QR&O does this mean that I can without thought of being charged with being out of dress take down my Sacrifice Medal as I have no desire to wear it but was under the impression that once awarded a Medal you were obliged to wear it?
"Often have I regretted my speech, never my silence" Cpl Jordan Anderson 1981-2007 RIP

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Offline Old Sweat

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With that QR&O does this mean that I can without thought of being charged with being out of dress take down my Sacrifice Medal as I have no desire to wear it but was under the impression that once awarded a Medal you were obliged to wear it?
Hopefully that is a rhetorical question. As I suspect you would have anyway, check with your chain of command and use your perogative to have the last word, "Yes Sir."

Offline Infanteer

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I know plenty of soldiers who do not wish, and don't, wear a Sacrifice Medal.  There is even a box on the application form that confirms if the soldier wants a public presentation of the medal or just wants it handed to him.
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Offline BulletMagnet

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It isn't rhetorical I despise the medal and view it as a joke (personal opinion) and would much rather not wear it. I am well aware that once awarded it I had to take my wound stripe down and have done so but I would rather wear nothing then the Sacrifice Medal.

I will research the QR&O and seek my CoC interpretation however the way I read it now makes it seem like I have every right to do so.


EDIT: Spelling
« Last Edit: August 14, 2011, 14:30:06 by BulletMagnet »
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Offline BulletMagnet

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Infanteer

I wasn't really given that option either......
"Often have I regretted my speech, never my silence" Cpl Jordan Anderson 1981-2007 RIP

When the going gets tough I take a nap...It's easier that way