Author Topic: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings  (Read 5742 times)

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Offline AbdullahD

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News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« on: March 15, 2019, 01:41:54 »
I'll preface this post, I do not want to, nor do I intend to become "that" person who posts anti-Islamic stuff as some way, shape or form of mitigating the evil that is committed by those Kafrs claiming to be Muslim.

Without further comments.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/03/14/asia/christchurch-mosque-shooting-intl/index.html

- mod edit to differentiate from analysis thread -
« Last Edit: March 16, 2019, 16:51:13 by milnews.ca »

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shooting
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2019, 02:51:42 »
One of my best buddies / groomsmen lost a family friend and is waiting to hear from extended family - Fijian Muslim family with a lot of family in NZ. 

I have seen the video. It’s awful. Absolutely terrible. He went in shooting and got a whole bunch of people cornered in a big open room and just kept shooting into two piles of people. Start to finish it was three and a half minutes before he made it back to his car.

He handled his firearms reasonably well considering the situation. I won’t be surprised if he has firearms training and possibly former service. He had two long guns inside, a semi auto (shotgun I think) that he started with and discarded after nine rounds, and then an AR with a few high capacity magazines (39 rounds continuously at one point from one magazine). In his car trunk he had another AR or something similar, and a couple red gasoline jugs with something taped to them externally- likely IEDs. 

I’m still wrapping my head around this. Absolutely unbelievable. 

One mosque attendee caught him a tackle but took shots as he made contact. The shooter picked himself back up, fired a few more at that person then just kept killing without pause.  The shooter spoke English, but only spoke to himself quietly near the end. 

I think this may be the single worst thing I’ve ever watched.

CNN now reporting 40 dead.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 03:01:20 by Brihard »
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shooting
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2019, 03:05:39 »
Looks like British media has already gotten a look at the social media of one of the shooters- Aussie born and I think British raised. If this is even fractionally accurate, we’re looking at a right wing white nationalist extremist who pretty much wants race war and sees himself as avenging Muslim Terrorism in Europe.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/8642007/christchurch-mosque-shootings-brit-gunman-racist-manifesto/

One of the things that immediately jumped out at me was ‘Alexandre Bissonette’ as one of the names written on his magazines. He was inspired by past acts of mass violence.
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shooting
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2019, 03:35:26 »
One of my best buddies / groomsmen lost a family friend and is waiting to hear from extended family - Fijian Muslim family with a lot of family in NZ. 
...

CNN now reporting 40 dead.

A lot of my buddies are fijian and a lot of them have friends or family in NZ. I am having a hard time processing this all.

One of the confirmed fatalities I know of was Imam of Noor Masjid Hafiz Musa Patel.

My heart is broken in two tonight, your recap even via text was tough to read. Scary as hell.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shooting
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2019, 03:52:07 »
Edit for unnecessary detail.

Sorry. Still rattled by this. Turns out what Insaw was the short video there’s a second longer one that gets worse. Basically he got another gun and went back.

What a goddamned monster.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 04:03:29 by Brihard »
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shooting
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2019, 06:40:04 »
Split into separate thread given the scale of the attack.

Army.ca Staff

Condolences to all those affected ...

Usual "early reports" caveats apply.

More on this via Google News here, Bing.ca news here and the EU's news aggregator here - list of NZ media to track here.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 06:46:59 by milnews.ca »
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2019, 09:33:42 »
I seen some of the shooters writings. He brags about using firearms specifically to inflame the (western) left who will push for more gun control which will inflame the right and start a war.

I think you're right Brihard about a nationalist trying to start a racewar. I hope he survived and gets to rot in prison.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 13:16:04 by Jarnhamar »
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2019, 09:36:37 »
...I hope he survived and gets to rot in prison.

The article I read on CBC News said he was arrested and charged.
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2019, 09:53:07 »
Latest from NZ police (~0500 Eastern Daylight Time):
Quote
UPDATE 8: Christchurch serious firearms incident
Commissioner stand-up
Friday, 15 March 2019 - 10:10pm
National News

Please attribute to Police Commissioner Mike Bush

Police continue to deal with what is an unprecedented event for New Zealand. The loss of life and the number of those who have been injured is tragic.

As the Prime Minister has stated, this has been designated a terrorist attack.

This has been an abhorrent event and my thoughts are with all of those affected in Christchurch. Be assured NZ Police stand with you all tonight.

We now know that 49 people have been killed in the attacks, 41 people at the Deans Avenue mosque, and seven at the Linwood Avenue mosque. One person died in hospital.

The number of those being treated in hospital has been updated to 48 people.

A 28-year-old man has been charged with murder and is due to appear in the Christchurch District Court tomorrow morning.

Two others remain in custody. Another person was arrested earlier today however that was not related to these events.

This is still an ongoing situation and Police has a significant number of staff on the ground in Christchurch

We are unable at this stage to provide details about matters leading up to the attacks. It is very early days and these matters will form part of the investigation.

There is an increased Police presence across Christchurch and surrounding areas. Our priority is to keep all New Zealanders safe.

There are community events planned across the country this weekend and there will be a visible Police presence at these events for safety and reassurance.

We thank the public for their ongoing co-operation and we would like to reassure members of the public that a large Police presence will remain in the city for the time being. The safety of the community is our priority.

Police wish to notify the public of the Restoring Family Links (RFL) website (link is external) where people can register missing persons or register themselves as alive. People living in New Zealand can also register missing persons on 0800 115 019.

Information will continue to be provided as it becomes available.

Our thoughts remain with all of those affected.

ENDS

Issued by Police Media Centre
Updates are also being shared via what looks like an official NZ police FB page here.
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2019, 10:14:25 »
And some reaction from Canada's public safety minister, the PM, and the CPC leader via Twitter ...
“The risk of insult is the price of clarity.” -- Roy H. Williams

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2019, 13:09:12 »
Interesting statement by a politician, I think it has *some* merit. To many issues are not being reconciled, acknowledged or dealt with in any way, but are left to ferment and fester.

He condemns violence, but hazards a guess at the underlying issue.. I wouldnt crucify him over that.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12213197

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2019, 13:32:28 »
... He condemns violence, but hazards a guess at the underlying issue.. I wouldnt crucify him over that.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12213197
Well, at least according to his Twitter feed, he's consistent in his message.  Interesting that he's such a specific statement on a controversial issue so close to a May election in Australia.
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2019, 14:00:43 »
https://thenewsrep.com/115359/eco-fascism-makes-its-terrifying-debut-in-new-zealand/?fbclid=IwAR0uZKxCNlIy-kHU9R8mWg-KOPLHbRlGtG0obqYFhIfy9yxvw3y5PWHr_N4
Like the closing line ...
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... in this ideological conflict there is no Raqqa to bomb and no Special Operations raid that can wipe out its leadership cell.
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2019, 14:26:11 »
Well, at least according to his Twitter feed, he's consistent in his message.  Interesting that he's such a specific statement on a controversial issue so close to a May election in Australia.

Too fair my friend. No excuse for the whole thing.

Vigilantism for what? Going to Church. Then shoot me too.
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2019, 14:36:48 »
My prayers and condolences for the victims. Very senseless. The words spoken to one of the shooters was " hello brother". Definitely a brave man who was spiritually ready for the worst.


Numan Afifi
@NumanAfifi


Today is chaos. But one incident stood out.

Final words of the first Muslim man to die were “hello brother”.

Even at gunpoint, he showed us to be peaceful, gentle and kind.

Let’s stop the violence instead of fueling it.#christchurch

9,708
4:54 AM - Mar 15, 2019 · Geneva, Switzerland

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2019, 16:34:28 »
For anyone who saw the video, my thoughts keep going back to the one man who got shot as he connected the tackle. I hope we learn, in time, who that sheepdog was. I gather something similar happened at the second mosque that was not on video.
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2019, 16:39:00 »
According to the NZ Herald one of the worshipers at the Linwood Mosque returned fire at the attackers with either a shotgun or rifle:

Quote
  Second shooting at mosque in Linwood

A second shooting happened at a mosque in the Linwood area of the city.

One Friday prayer goer returned fire with a rifle or shotgun.

Witnesses said they heard multiple gunshots around 1.45pm.

A well known Muslim local chased the shooters and fired two shots at them as they sped off.

He was heard telling police officers he was firing in "self defence".

"They were in a silver Subaru," he told police.

Link here. Scroll down to almost end of article to find above quote.
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2019, 16:41:32 »
No excuse for the whole thing.
Too true ...
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2019, 18:21:05 »
I hope it’s more clear now why I got fired up a few weeks back when the concept of ‘white nationalism’ was getting frigged off. This is the most horrific manifestation of exactly the fears I was speaking of. This is why we have to call that toxic swill what it is.
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2019, 18:29:56 »
Honest question, do you think white nationalisim (in terms of violence or violent extremism ) is worse than Islamic extremism or violent religious extremism?
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2019, 18:37:15 »
Honest question, do you think white nationalisim (in terms of violence or violent extremism ) is worse than Islamic extremism or violent religious extremism?

Absolutely not. But it’s the one that’s much more ‘here’. It’s the one that we as a western culture have a hell of a lot more ownership of. This is where I expect everyone who spouts off about wanting moderate Muslims to speak up and ‘do something’ about their radicals to awkwardly step off and shut up unless they’re going to put their money where their mouth is and start acting against our own violent radicals. These are the people we grew up with, that we ostracized in school and at work, the weird cousin we don’t talk to, the creepy coworker who says concerning stuff that we don’t speak up about. Now it’s a hell of a lot easier for them to ‘meet’ each other, to communicate, to cross-validate, and to invite each other.

Evil is evil. We just don’t get to pretend it’s always, or even usually, brown guys anymore.
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2019, 19:21:30 »
Honest question, do you think white nationalisim (in terms of violence or violent extremism ) is worse than Islamic extremism or violent religious extremism?
Extremism is extremism. It does appear that white nationalism is on the rise and needs to be eradicated.


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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2019, 19:41:10 »
I'm thinking the same way. I see non-muslims saying moderate Muslims need to step up to the plate and condem extremists more. I'm sure I've said it myself a few times.
But I never see "us" doing that with white shooters/extremists. Well maybr we do in a generic eay but not in the same manner I think we expect Muslims to do it. I kinda find were hipocrites about it.

I think a big part of the problem is that when there's a mass shooting many people in society habbour thoughts that they hope it's white males or Muslims.  A sort of extreme right and left reaction.

New Zealand's gun control views are what I'd like to see in Canada (focuses on strong checks rather than banning certain guns) .
I'm curious about the shooters licence /where he sourced the guns etc..

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #24 on: March 15, 2019, 19:43:22 »
I'm thinking the same way. I see non-muslims saying moderate Muslims need to step up to the plate and condem extremists more. I'm sure I've said it myself a few times.
But I never see "us" doing that with white shooters/extremists. Well maybr we do in a generic eay but not in the same manner I think we expect Muslims to do it. I kinda find were hipocrites about it.

I think a big part of the problem is that when there's a mass shooting many people in society habbour thoughts that they hope it's white males or Muslims.  A sort of extreme right and left reaction.

New Zealand's gun control views are what I'd like to see in Canada (focuses on strong checks rather than banning certain guns) .
I'm curious about the shooters licence /where he sourced the guns etc..
Knew we’d be on same page J. Curious about the Kiwis ‘ firearm laws as well.


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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #25 on: March 15, 2019, 20:47:39 »
I'm thinking the same way. I see non-muslims saying moderate Muslims need to step up to the plate and condem extremists more. I'm sure I've said it myself a few times.
But I never see "us" doing that with white shooters/extremists. Well maybr we do in a generic eay but not in the same manner I think we expect Muslims to do it. I kinda find were hipocrites about it.

I think a big part of the problem is that when there's a mass shooting many people in society habbour thoughts that they hope it's white males or Muslims.  A sort of extreme right and left reaction.

New Zealand's gun control views are what I'd like to see in Canada (focuses on strong checks rather than banning certain guns) .
I'm curious about the shooters licence /where he sourced the guns etc..

Jarnhamar, I feel like I had to defend Muslims and state we do denounce it and stand against extremism.

But now, I have immense pleasure in telling you that "white folks" do denounce this killing etc and speak up against it.

Here is some proof, a beautiful thing born from tragedy.

Abdullah

P.s I think highlighting the fact that the majority of us are normal is a great reminder during bad times. So if anyone tries to say "white people" dont denounce white extremism I will be the first to counter that voice. Being in the Islamic community I see some actions far more then others, so I am happy to say many white folks stand with solidarity with Muslims or well any oppressed people.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #26 on: March 15, 2019, 21:11:31 »
But "white" is a race and Muslim is a religion.

You yourself are "white folk", aren't you? There's white Muslims and brown Christians.

Perhaps one of the first steps to combating white nationalisim is to stop treating Muslims like it's a "race of brown folks"? 

« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 21:14:55 by Jarnhamar »
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #27 on: March 15, 2019, 21:28:44 »
But "white" is a race and Muslim is a religion.

You yourself are "white folk", aren't you? There's white Muslims and brown Christians.

Perhaps one of the first steps to combating white nationalisim is to stop treating Muslims like it's a "race of brown folks"?

Yes, but people attack Muslims for not denouncing and the discussion was white people and lack of denouncing.

But yeah, I am white, I even wear plaid, a hat and etc.

Maybe though it would help, education usually solves some problems. Issue is a lot of extremists no matter the flavour, are invested deeply into their extreme ideology. I think we are in for it now, even if we start promoting this narrative (which would be wise), it will still take years to take hold. I feel most extremists think in binary terms, those with half a brain can understand the world is more complex. Extremists simply choose to reduce complex subjects to oversimplified talking points and radicalize from there.

Sorry if my thoughts are not coherent right now.

Abdullah

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #28 on: March 15, 2019, 22:48:19 »
Majority of the conflict between Muslims and the west are actually with the Sunni Muslims, I don't lose sleep over the Ismaili mosque that's been down the road for 35 or so years, I do worry about the Gulf funded Sunni Mosques that spring up everywhere and the proliferation of women running around in full niqabs, because those people don't mix well with others and when their numbers are small they aren't a problem, but eventually that will change. Also within the Sunnis you have Sufi's, Safi's and other branches of belief and interpretation.
The number of radicals may be smallish, but a small percentage of 1.6 billion people is still a large number. The US is on it's way to have more Muslims than Malaysia.

As for White Supremacists, the numbers are even smaller, there is perhaps 5,000 KKK in the US with a smattering of other groups maybe pushing that number over 10,000.

Attacks on house of worships have effected not only mosques, but churches as well.

  https://www.trtworld.com/asia/the-times-that-mosques-have-been-attacked-and-turned-into-slaughterhouses-24973

https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/27/asia/philippines-church-explosion/index.html?fbclid=IwAR1Zd8uyi7uGKzXzW_KvU_ptOzL6BXGPdcxqfLL5tOM6LyxkcFzvFTKnghg

https://www.news24.com/Africa/News/major-attacks-against-egypts-christians-20181103

https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2018/april/nigeria-fulani-attack-catholic-church-benue-boko-haram.html


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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2019, 08:01:58 »
Latest from NZ police (as of ~2200 EDT last night) ...
Quote
UPDATE 12 - Christchurch terror attack
Saturday, 16 March 2019 - 3:05pm

Please attribute to Police Commissioner Mike Bush

Police have a number of key priorities as we continue to work in response to the Christchurch terror attacks.

Our priority is public safety, not just in Christchurch but nationally. We have deployed staff right across the country.

Our other key priority is making sure that those people so horribly affected by these events get the support and welfare that they need.

Our investigation will focus on what unfolded and how it unfolded, and to answer the many questions people will have.

We also want to ensure that all our staff and responders get every support possible.

I want to acknowledge the leaders from all of the agencies involved, including Canterbury District Commander Superintendent John Price who has led the local response.

I also want to acknowledge St John, Fire and Emergency New Zealand, Civil Defence, NZDF, Victim Support, Christchurch City Council and the other agencies working so closely together.

One offender, a 28-year-old male, has been charged with one count of murder. He has been remanded to the High Court to reappear on 5 April. Any further charges he will face will be determined by the ongoing investigation.

There are many, many victims of this tragic event and we are giving every possible support to them.

I also want to thank all of the religious leaders and Imams who have travelled here to give their support to those who have been affected.

ENDS

Issued by Police Media Centre

Lots of ongoing Radio New Zealand (RNZ) coverage here.

Some highlights ...
And what mass tragedy would be complete without the "false flag" accusation?  :facepalm:
"Limbaugh Floats "False Flag" Theory NZ Shooter Is "Leftist" Who Staged Attack To Frame Conservatives" (zerohedge.com)

And finally, Charles Adler's take (2 min audio commentary).
« Last Edit: March 16, 2019, 08:13:18 by milnews.ca »
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #30 on: March 16, 2019, 09:10:20 »
New Zealand's gun control views are what I'd like to see in Canada (focuses on strong checks rather than banning certain guns).
I'm curious about the shooters licence /where he sourced the guns etc..
According to some media reports the guns were all legal to own, legally obtained and he was licensed.  The NZ PM has stated "our gun laws will change".
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #31 on: March 16, 2019, 12:11:32 »
Topic split into the [generously named] Analysis: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings. Please keep Newsroom posts to news updates and political/personal discussions to Radio Chatter or Politics.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #32 on: March 16, 2019, 13:50:41 »
Naeem Rashid, and Abdul Aziz. These are two names we have to remember and honour.

Naeem Rashid was the man seen tackling the shooter at the Al Noor mosque, knocking him over, and being shot several times while doing so. He died in hospital from his wounds. He moved to Nee Zealand from Pakistan, and was a teacher in NZ.

Abdul Aziz confronted the shooter at the Linwood mosque and was able to distract him and chase him off before he was arrested. Aziz is an Afghan refugee who had lived in Australia for 25 years before moving to New Zealand.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-47596816

https://globalnews.ca/news/5063692/hero-new-zealand-mosque-attack/

https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/111335681/heroic-worshipper-tackled-gunman-at-linwood-mosque-during-christchurch-terror-attack
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #34 on: March 16, 2019, 16:50:11 »
From vox.com an explanation of NZ gun laws:

Quote
New Zealand’s gun laws, explained

New Zealand’s gun laws are strict compared to America’s, but there are gaps.

By German Lopez@germanrlopezgerman.lopez@vox.com Updated Mar 15, 2019, 4:54pm EDT

Early Friday morning, 49 people were killed in mass shootings at the Al Noor and Linwood mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand. In the aftermath of this tragedy, there’s a renewed interest in how gun laws work in New Zealand.

And on Friday evening, New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said “our gun laws will change” — referencing, among other possibilities, “a semiautomatic gun ban.”

As it stands, New Zealanders do not have a legal or constitutional right to own guns, and the small island country has strong gun laws relative to the US (as is true for developed nations in general). But the laws have some gaps, particularly when it comes to the registration of firearms and the regulation of semiautomatic weapons. These gaps have led to contentious debates in the country: Some gun owners don’t want tougher laws, while police have come to see the current legal framework as “patchy,” as reported by Stuff, a media company in New Zealand.

New Zealand has more than 1.2 million civilian-owned firearms — about one gun for every four people, according to Small Arms Survey, which provides estimates for gun ownership around the world. That puts the country in the top 20 nations in the world for civilian gun ownership (though still far behind the US, which has more than one gun for every person).

Still, New Zealand generally has very low levels of gun violence — likely due, in part, to its restrictions on firearms. But because of the remaining gaps and Friday’s terrorist attacks, there are already calls, including from the prime minister, to strengthen the country’s laws.

How New Zealand’s gun laws currently work

As the US’s Law Library of Congress explained, New Zealand’s system mainly focuses on licensing, but registration of firearms is not always required.

In New Zealand, people first have to obtain a license to legally purchase, own, and possess a gun. A license applicant is vetted to check for a criminal record, a history of violence, drug and alcohol use, and relationships with potentially dangerous people, among other factors. The applicant also must go through a firearms safety course. That all typically takes months to get through.

Once a person makes it through the process, he’s allowed to purchase guns and ammo — although some types of firearms, like handguns and certain semiautomatic rifles, require “endorsements” from police and separate permits to purchase. There are also extra storage and inspection requirements.

The licenses have to be renewed every 10 years, and police can revoke a person’s license if that person is believed to no longer be fit for ownership and may pose a threat.

Gun sellers are also licensed and regulated by police.

Unlike other licensing systems (such as Massachusetts’s), firearms in New Zealand don’t always have to be registered. This can lead to bizarre circumstances in which a gun only has to be slightly modified to no longer require registration.

Under the law, for instance, some semiautomatic rifles — commonly known as assault weapons — have to be registered as military-style semiautomatic rifles (MSSAs). But as Thomas Manch explained at Stuff, what is required to be registered and what isn’t can often come down to weird technicalities: Just inserting a lower-capacity magazine into an AR-15, an assault rifle, can make the weapon not required to be registered.

It’s also possible to import certain parts meant for MSSAs but for non-MSSA weapons, essentially letting a person modify a non-MSSA gun to become more dangerous, like an MSSA, without having to go through the legal hurdles tied to an MSSA.

Police have long worried that the gaps and loopholes make it easier for the wrong people to obtain and keep firearms. It’s unclear if that’s what happened with the Christchurch shooter, although he did get his guns legally, according to the prime minister.

Despite the concerns, New Zealand’s gun laws haven’t gone through significant changes since a mass shooting led to reforms in 1992. Amendments passed in 2012 did clarify some of the rules around registered assault weapons, but the changes were largely technical and minor.

It remains to be seen whether the push to strengthen the country’s gun laws following the March 15 attacks will be successful.

Gun control works, but it has limits

Stricter gun laws can’t stop all shootings. But the research shows that where there are stronger gun laws, and fewer guns, there are generally fewer gun deaths.

A 2016 review of 130 studies in 10 countries, published in Epidemiologic Reviews, found that new legal restrictions on owning and purchasing guns tended to be followed by a drop in gun violence — a strong indicator that restricting access to guns can save lives. A review of the US evidence by RAND also linked some gun control measures, including background checks, to reduced injuries and deaths.

Laws that require a license to buy and own a gun seem to be particularly effective, based on US studies. In Connecticut, researchers looked at what happened after the state passed a permit-to-purchase law for handguns — finding a 40 percent drop in gun homicides and a 15 percent reduction in handgun suicides. In Missouri, researchers looked at the aftermath of the state repealing its handgun permit-to-purchase law — finding a 23 percent increase in firearm homicides but no significant increase in non-firearm homicides, as well as 16 percent higher handgun suicide rates.

A recent study also found that weaker gun laws and higher levels of gun ownership were correlated with more mass shootings at the state level.

There’s a bit of common sense to this: Every country has bigots, extremists, and criminals, but looser gun laws, like the US’s, make it significantly easier to actually obtain firearms and use them for awful things. To this end, previous empirical analyses have concluded that the US doesn’t have more crime, generally, than other developed nations, but it does have more lethal crime, like murder — in large part thanks to easy access to firearms.

New Zealand, for its part, generally has few gun homicides. According to GunPolicy.org, the entire country had just eight gun homicides in all of 2015 — a rate of 0.18 firearm homicides per 100,000 people. In comparison, the US, which has the loosest gun laws among wealthy nations and far more gun deaths as a result, had nearly 13,000 gun homicides that year — a rate of 4.04 per 100,000.

The mosque shootings on March 15 effectively add up to six years’ worth of gun homicides in New Zealand — a testament to how awful the attacks were, but also to how rare such events are in the country.

Link


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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #35 on: March 16, 2019, 19:51:16 »
Aziz.... must be Pashtun for 'big brass ones'  :salute:

"He gets into his car and I just got the gun and threw it on his window like an arrow and blasted his window," he said.

The windshield shattered: "That's why he got scared."

He said the gunman was cursing at him, yelling that he was going to kill them all. But he drove away and Aziz said he chased the car down the street to a red light, before it made a U-turn and sped away. Online videos indicate police officers managed to force the car from the road and drag out the suspect soon after.

Originally from Kabul, Afghanistan, Aziz said he left as a refugee when he was a boy and lived for more than 25 years in Australia before moving to New Zealand a couple of years ago.

"I've been to a lot of countries and this is one of the beautiful ones," he said. And, he always thought, a peaceful one as well.

Aziz said he didn't feel fear or much of anything when facing the gunman. It was like he was on autopilot. And he believes that God, that Allah, didn't think it was his time to die.

https://www.timescolonist.com/man-who-stood-up-to-mosque-gunman-probably-saved-lives-1.23665817
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #36 on: March 16, 2019, 23:14:50 »
Majority of the conflict between Muslims and the west are actually with the Sunni Muslims, I don't lose sleep over the Ismaili mosque that's been down the road for 35 or so years, I do worry about the Gulf funded Sunni Mosques that spring up everywhere and the proliferation of women running around in full niqabs, because those people don't mix well with others and when their numbers are small they aren't a problem, but eventually that will change. Also within the Sunnis you have Sufi's, Safi's and other branches of belief and interpretation.
The number of radicals may be smallish, but a small percentage of 1.6 billion people is still a large number. The US is on it's way to have more Muslims than Malaysia.

Thankful that our society's views here in Canada aren't based on your hunches, intuition, and poor math regarding something different that scares you. Evidenced by the outpouring of grief and solidarity in light of such attacks.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #37 on: March 16, 2019, 23:55:56 »
Thankful that our society's views here in Canada aren't based on your hunches, intuition, and poor math regarding something different that scares you. Evidenced by the outpouring of grief and solidarity in light of such attacks.

ACE,

There is no way you could know this, but Colin has extensive, first hand, real world experience with Islam. I know enough about him to know that is he no bigot.

Just sayin...

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #38 on: March 16, 2019, 23:57:54 »
ACE,

There is no way you could know this, but Colin has extensive, first hand, real world experience with Islam. I know enough about him to know that is he no bigot.

Just sayin...

Yes, a bit more involved than a thoughts and prayers status update.
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #39 on: March 17, 2019, 00:35:09 »
Thankful that our society's views here in Canada aren't based on your hunches, intuition, and poor math regarding something different that scares you. Evidenced by the outpouring of grief and solidarity in light of such attacks.

For a primer read the other Islam threads Colin posts in.

It is far to easy to attack, but Colin has a very nuanced opinion on Islam.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #40 on: March 17, 2019, 01:56:20 »
Thankful that our society's views here in Canada aren't based on your hunches, intuition, and poor math regarding something different that scares you. Evidenced by the outpouring of grief and solidarity in light of such attacks.

Ok, I’ll bite. What is factually inaccurate about what he specifically said?
Pacificsm is doctrine fostered by a delusional minority and by the media, which holds forth the proposition it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #41 on: March 17, 2019, 06:56:03 »
Thankful that our society's views here in Canada aren't based on your hunches, intuition, and poor math regarding something different that scares you...
Ok, I’ll bite. What is factually inaccurate about what he specifically said?
:nod:

More from NZ Police ...
Quote
Update 17: Christchurch terror attack; court appearance
Sunday, 17 March 2019 - 10:30pm

A 22-year-old man is due to appear in Christchurch District Court tomorrow morning (Monday) charged with offences under the Films Videos and Publications Classification Act.

This man was arrested by Police in the initial stages of the shooting investigation in Christchurch on Friday afternoon, but he is not being charged in relation to the attack. Police at this stage do not believe he was directly involved.

We would like to remind people that it is an offence to distribute or possess an objectionable publication (under the Films Videos and Publications Classifications Act 1993), which carries a penalty of imprisonment.

The live stream video of the shootings in Christchurch has been classified by the Chief Censor’s Office as objectionable.

A 28-year-old man remains in custody in relation to Friday’s events, charged with murder.

One other person arrested on Friday is facing charges not directly related to Friday’s events. They are in custody and those matters are currently before the court.

A fourth person was arrested, but was not charged with any offences.

ENDS

Police Media Centre
... as well as details on response times ...
Quote
... There has been some speculation around the Police response times to the first attack on Deans Ave on Friday.

To clarify, Police received its first 111 call at 1.41pm.

The first armed Police unit was on scene at 1.47pm.

That’s six minutes to respond.

Within 10 minutes, our Armed Offenders Squad was on scene.

Within 36 minutes, a mobile offender was in custody.

I am very proud of the Police response to this terrible attack.
... and how the identification of the dead is being handled
Quote
... Police and Coronial Services are very focused and working together closely to run the process in a way that is culturally appropriate, robust, and with speed. New Zealand’s Chief Coroner Judge Deborah Marshall, two other coroners and four support staff are in Christchurch to provide additional capability and support to the locally-based coroners to help speed up the process.

“We, alongside Police and the forensic pathologists, are working as quickly as we can to establish the identity of those who lost their lives so tragically,” says Judge Marshall.

“Identification hearings will start this afternoon and we are anticipating that the process of returning the deceased will commence tonight. This is a complex task which must be completed according to New Zealand law. We are working closely with community representatives to explain the process.”

The nationalities of the victims cannot be confirmed at this stage. Information on this will be released as soon as possible as the coronial process continues.

“This is a long and complex process and all organisations involved are working as quickly as possible to return loved ones to their families but it’s vital we have certainty around cause of death for any future court proceedings,” Detective Superintendent Peter Read says.

The five stages are:

Postmortem phases: collecting detail from the victims

Phase 1: Scene
• The deceased are examined and documented in situ, then taken to the mortuary.

Phase 2: Mortuary
• The deceased is examined in detail by a pathologist, forensic dentist, fingerprint officer and Police DVI team
• Personal effects (such as jewelry, clothing) are photographed in situ, then collected, examined, cleaned, rephotographed and secured.

Antemortem phase: information about missing person is brought in from outside

Phase 3: Antemortem Information Retrieval
• Police gather information about possible victims, such as
o descriptions of appearance, clothing, jewelry, photos
o medical and dental records, x-rays
o fingerprints, from objects or official records (commonly collected by some overseas agencies)
o DNA samples, such as from a hairbrush, toothbrush or blood sample.

Phase 4: Reconcilliation
• Information from postmortem and antemortem phases are brought together to find a match
• At an identification hearing, the Coroner is presented evidence of the match by fingerprint, dentistry, DNA and Police DVI experts and decides if identification has been established
• Family and/or foreign authorities are advised, then media.

Phase 5: Debrief
• People involved in the DVI process keep each other updated throughout all stages
• Support and welfare is made available to staff including stress and grief counsellors, chaplains, Victim Support and police welfare officers.

ENDS
« Last Edit: March 17, 2019, 07:01:39 by milnews.ca »
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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #42 on: March 17, 2019, 07:52:31 »
The US is on it's way to have more Muslims than Malaysia.

For reference to the discussion,

Pew Research Center
Demographic Study
January 27, 2011

The Future of the Global Muslim Population
http://www.pewforum.org/2011/01/27/the-future-of-the-global-muslim-population/#/Malaysia


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Re: 15 Mar 2019: Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #43 on: March 17, 2019, 09:58:17 »
... I think a big part of the problem is that when there's a mass shooting many people in society harbour thoughts that they hope it's white males or Muslims.  A sort of extreme right and left reaction ...
Definitely part of the equation - and you don't need many loud ones @ either end ... :(
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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #44 on: March 17, 2019, 16:29:33 »
From NZ's PM ...
Quote
An Australian man who has been charged with murder in the shooting rampage that killed at least 50 worshippers at two mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand, on Friday will be tried in the country, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said Sunday.

The man, 28-year-old Brenton Harrison Tarrant, appeared in a Christchurch court Saturday and was charged with one count of murder. He was remanded in custody and was scheduled to appear in court again on April 5.

At a news conference Sunday, Ardern said the police will be filing additional charges against Tarrant, who is being held under high security in a special facility.

Asked whether Tarrant would be extradited to Australia, the prime minister said, “He will certainly face the justice system of New Zealand for the terror attack he has committed here.”

Ardern also said she intended to move quickly to toughen the nation’s gun laws. “We cannot be deterred from the work that we need to do on our gun laws in New Zealand,” she said. “They need to change.”

She added that her cabinet would begin discussions about gun legislation on Monday.

Arden said the bodies of the people killed in the attacks are beginning to be returned to the families of the victims. “It is the expectation that all bodies will be returned to families by Wednesday,” she said.

The families will be given $10,000 to help with funeral costs and other resources may be made available to them, Ardern said. Citizenship will have no bearing on the payments, she added ...
A bit more @ link
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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #45 on: March 18, 2019, 10:25:51 »
Quote
Christchurch mosque shooting victims receive $2.1m donation from Chinese visitors

A pledge of $2.1 million has been made to survivors of the Christchurch terror attack by international associates of a Chinese businessman who found himself in the centre of the Jami Lee Ross political storm in 2018.

On Friday evening Auckland mayor Phil Goff was invited to attend a dinner for Teochew delegates who had arrived in Auckland for the 20th Convention of Teochew International Federation held this weekend.

Goff arrived late due to a meeting with the New Zealand Police and the Muslim community over the attacks in Christchurch which had happened just hours earlier.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111368797/christchurch-mosque-shooting-victims-receive-21m-donation-from-chinese-visitors
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Reply:  "If."

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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #46 on: March 19, 2019, 07:52:10 »
What Canada's party leaders had to say in the House of Commons yesterday, attached.

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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #47 on: March 19, 2019, 09:49:12 »
And now, this ...
Quote
ISIS Spokesman Ends Silence by Calling for Retaliation Over New Zealand Massacres
By Rukmini Callimachi (New York Times)
March 18, 2019


The spokesman of the Islamic State emerged from nearly six months of silence on Monday to mock America’s assertion of having defeated the group and to call for retaliation over last week’s mosque attacks in New Zealand.

“The scenes of the massacres in the two mosques should wake up those who were fooled, and should incite the supporters of the caliphate to avenge their religion,” the spokesman, Abu Hassan al-Muhajir, said in a 44-minute audio recording.

Mr. al-Muhajir portrayed the shootings by a white extremist, which killed 50 Muslims as they prayed in the city of Christchurch, as an extension of the campaign against the Islamic State. He likened the mosque attacks to the weekslong battle raging in the last village under ISIS control in Syria.

“Here is Baghuz in Syria, where Muslims are burned to death and are bombed by all known and unknown weapons of mass destruction,” he said, painting the people in the town as regular Muslims when in fact coalition officials believe that the majority of them are either Islamic State fighters or their wives and children ...
More @ link
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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #48 on: March 19, 2019, 10:50:26 »
Welcome to Globalization of events, nothing happens in isolation anymore.

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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #49 on: March 21, 2019, 13:14:46 »
Welcome to Globalization of events, nothing happens in isolation anymore.

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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #50 on: March 25, 2019, 11:29:31 »
New Zealand has gone full panic.

Quote
Jordan Peterson's popular 12 Rules book banned by New Zealand booksellers because of Christchurch mosque massacre

A national chain of bookstores in New Zealand has pulled copies of Jordan Peterson’s book 12 Rules for Life from sale, directly linking the decision to the massacre of 50 people in two mosques in Christchurch.

“Unfortunately, 12 Rules for Life is currently unavailable,” said a customer representative for Whitcoulls, the country’s largest bookseller with more than 50 stores in New Zealand and an online business.

“(It) is a decision that Whitcoulls has made in light of some extremely disturbing material being circulated prior, during and after the Christchurch attacks.

“As a business which takes our responsibilities to our communities very seriously, we believe it would be wrong to support the author at this time.”

The representative declined to provide her name as she was not authorized to comment to the media. Requests for comment and further explanation from company officials were not answered prior to deadline.



Don't worry, Whitcoulls is still selling Hitlers Mein kampf.
https://www.whitcoulls.co.nz/product/mein-kampf-978039592503437930
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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #51 on: March 28, 2019, 20:31:16 »
And Pravda's* joining the crowd promoting the false flag theory ...
Quote
By now most of you will have had some information about a tragedy in Christchurch New Zealand.  You will have been fed on a well oiled Main Stream Media [MSM] press service which swung into gear surprisingly quickly after the incident.  Of course, if this event actually happened as portrayed in the MSM then it is to be thoroughly condemned as a callous and brutal attack on the citizens of the country - supposedly by an Australian Import and his three identified accomplices.

However, all may not be as it seems for many inconsistencies exist in the official story and there are too many similarities to False Flag operations that have been conducted around the world which are designed to sway public option ...
More @ link

* - Not the old Soviet Pravda, which apparently still has a print edition put out by the Communist Party of Russia, but a newer pravda.ru is online (pravdareport.com is the English version) reportedly staffed by folks who broke away from the old Pravda when the USSR became past tense.  They've reported, with an apparently straight face, that Yemen was attacked by nukes, so caveat lector ...
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Tony Prudori
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Re: News: 15 Mar 2019 Christchurch NZ Mosque Shootings
« Reply #52 on: March 30, 2019, 19:29:23 »
This from a collaboration of USA's DHS, FBI and National Counterterrorism Centre (via the publicintelligence.net blog), dated 15 Mar 2019:
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Attacks on Mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand, May Inspire Supporters of Violent Ideologies

This Joint Intelligence Bulletin (JIB) is intended to provide information on Australian national and violent extremist Brenton Tarrant’s 15 March 2019 attacks on two mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand. These attacks underscore the enduring nature of violent threats posed to faith-based communities. FBI, DHS, and NCTC advise federal, state, local, tribal, and territorial government counterterrorism and law enforcement officials and private sector security partners responsible for securing faith-based communities in the Homeland to remain vigilant in light of the enduring threat to faith-based communities posed by domestic extremists (DEs), as well as by homegrown violent extremists (HVEs) who may seek retaliation. This JIB is provided to assist federal, state, local, tribal, and territorial counterterrorism and law enforcement officials and private sector security partners to effectively deter, prevent, preempt, or respond to incidents and terrorist attacks in the United States ...
More in attached 3-pager.
“The risk of insult is the price of clarity.” -- Roy H. Williams

The words I share here are my own, not those of anyone else or anybody I may be affiliated with.

Tony Prudori
MILNEWS.ca - Twitter