2022 CPC Leadership Discussion: Et tu Redeux

[Pelorus]

Agreed, I think this rainbow group would have something to say

About | Gays Against Groomers

Gays Against Groomers is a 501(c)4 organization of gays and others in the community against the sexualization, indoctrination and medicalization of children under the guise of "LGBTQIA+"

www.gaysagainstgroomers.com

Let's at least acknowledge that this is a fringe US Right Wing group who's founder is extensively connected to the MAGA-sphere:

Grifter Gays: How conspiracy theorists and right-wing operatives created Gays Against Groomers

www.mediamatters.org

Who is Jaimee Michell?

Before founding GAG, Michell was a steadfast Trump supporter. In her one-episode podcast from 2017, she claimed she began supporting Trump in part following her interactions with online conspiracy theories and a pro-Trump Reddit forum that was later banned from the platform for issuing threats of violence. Michell’s earlier Twitter presence involved predominantly pro-Trump content which she posted well after revelations had been made involving Trump’s inappropriate comments and actions directed at underage girls, not to mention myriad reports by women ranging from verbal harassment to inappropriate touching and outright sexual assault.

Michell likewise used her online presence to promote conspiracy theories related to QAnon and the false claim that Democratic politicians were involved in child trafficking, retweeting support for the conspiracy theory from popular QAnon influencers (with whom she continued to interact through 2019) and tweeting that anti-Trump conservative writer Bill Kristol “has some skeletons in his closet. I’m guessing pizza flavored,” seemingly a reference to the QAnon-adjacent “Pizzagate” conspiracy theory. Michell also repeatedly posted a meme she created making similar accusations against liberal celebrities, using it to brand everyone from CNN anchor Jake Tapper to Late Show host Stephen Colbert as “a pedo.”

While lobbing these accusations at her political enemies, Michell posted a pro-Trump quote and picture from far-right figure Milo Yiannopoulos, months after Yiannopoulos’ 2016 comments supporting pedophilia came to light. Michell also continued to use her identity as a lesbian to falsely claim that Trump was a “pro-gay” politician, earning her an advisory board seat on the campaign’s “Trump Pride” coalition.

Leading up to the 2020 election, Michell had frequent online communication with Ali Alexander, the founder of the “Stop the Steal” movement that heavily pushed conspiracy theories about the 2020 presidential election. Michell would go on to be intimately involved in Alexander’s movement, being listed alongside right-wing activist Alex Bruesewitz as a contact for the Stop the Steal rally in Wisconsin under her online account, “TheGayWhoStrayd.” Following President Joe Biden’s victory, Michell asserted the election had been stolen, telling her followers “the war is just getting started” and later speaking at a Stop the Steal event in Washington, D.C., that November. In reaction to the January 6 insurrection, Michell posted in support of the rioters on Instagram and Telegram, including reposting more content from Yiannopoulos.

 

[Loachman]

So let me be very clear: Fuck them, and fuck their supporters.

Thanks. I needed a good fucking.

One person caused that lawful protest, and refused to even negotiate, then improperly and unjustifiably invoked the Emergency Measures Act. Put the blame where it belongs.

“They are extremists who don’t believe in science, they’re often misogynists, also often racists. It’s a small group that muscles in, and we have to make a choice in terms of leaders, in terms of the country. Do we tolerate these people?”

There was NO scientific justification for forced medical experimentation on the bulk of the population. There was no scientific justification for forced masking, or lockdowns, or shuttering businesses or Churches, or limiting outdoor gatherings except for BLM protests.

Where and when have things such as "Do we tolerate these people" been said before? Late 1930s/early 1940s Germany? That was the absolute most Final Solution thing that I had ever heard come out of a Canadian politician's mouth, and it chilled me like nothing else ever has.

"A Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian" only applies to terrorists, but not to those real Canadians whose lives he was destroying.

Pierre Poilievre may be blunt, but the real, and much bigger, bully is the one whom he will eventually replace.

 

[Loachman]

That might be true in the beginning, but what country only exports but doesn’t import?

China?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Thanks. I needed a good fucking.

One person caused that lawful protest, and refused to even negotiate, then improperly and unjustifiably invoked the Emergency Measures Act. Put the blame where it belongs.

“They are extremists who don’t believe in science, they’re often misogynists, also often racists. It’s a small group that muscles in, and we have to make a choice in terms of leaders, in terms of the country. Do we tolerate these people?”

There was NO scientific justification for forced medical experimentation on the bulk of the population. There was no scientific justification for forced masking, or lockdowns, or shuttering businesses or Churches, or limiting outdoor gatherings except for BLM protests.

Where and when have things such as "Do we tolerate these people" been said before? Late 1930s/early 1940s Germany? That was the absolute most Final Solution thing that I had ever heard come out of a Canadian politician's mouth, and it chilled me like nothing else ever has.

"A Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian" only applies to terrorists, but not to those real Canadians whose lives he was destroying.

Pierre Poilievre may be blunt, but the real, and much bigger, bully is the one whom he will eventually replace.

I find that the majority upset with the convoy are NIMBYs. You didn't see alot of the anti convoy rhetoric outside of Ottawa. The thousands of people that lined hiways and overpasses, in support, are far and away a more realistic indicator of support than those kept awake by horns.

 

[Pelorus]

Seeing as we already invoked Godwin's Law a few posts ago, let's try this comparison on for size and see if the logic holds up:

I find that the majority of French upset with the Nazis are NIMBYs. You didn't see alot of the anti blitzkrieg rhetoric outside of the Allies. The thousands of people that lined hiways and overpasses in Germany, in support, are far and away a more realistic indicator of support than those kept awake by air raid sirens.

 

[brihard]

Seeing as we already invoked Godwin's Law a few posts ago, let's try this comparison on for size and see if the logic holds up:

I find that the majority of French upset with the Nazis are NIMBYs. You didn't see alot of the anti blitzkrieg rhetoric outside of the Allies. The thousands of people that lined hiways and overpasses in Germany, in support, are far and away a more realistic indicator of support than those kept awake by air raid sirens.

It’s easy enough to describe and decry the lawlessness and general idiocy of the ‘Freedom Convoy’ without an absolutely over the top and absurd comparison like that.

 

[Pelorus]

The intent is not to make an actual Nazi comparison, but rather to use a silly hyperbolic comparison to point out that people having to live with nonsense in their neighbourhood for weeks on end affecting their lives is a much different scenario than coming to an overpass to wave a flag for a half hour.

Trying to hand wave away opposition to the convoy as NIMBYism is weak logic.

 

[Loachman]

It’s easy enough to describe and decry the lawlessness and general idiocy of the ‘Freedom Convoy’ without an absolutely over the top and absurd comparison like that.

That alleged "lawlessness and general idiocy" was of much less import that Trudeau's divisive, revolting, and destructive instigation, incitement, and overreaction.

 

[QV]

The point being, which escapes you Pelorus, is that support for the original "convoy" cause was widespread.

 

[Loachman]

Trying to hand wave away opposition to the convoy as NIMBYism is weak logic.

Again, the convoy would not have happened were it not for Trudeau being Trudeau.

Complaining about noise and disruption is legitimate. Just place the blame where it truly belongs.

 

[brihard]

The intent is not to make an actual Nazi comparison, but rather to use a silly hyperbolic comparison to point out that people having to live with nonsense in their neighbourhood for weeks on end affecting their lives is a much different scenario than coming to an overpass to wave a flag for a half hour.

Trying to hand wave away opposition to the convoy as NIMBYism is weak logic.

Trying to hand wave away opposition to the convoy as NIMBYosm is indeed weak logic, but as soon as you even approach Godwin territory, generally any valid point you may have had to make disappears. That’s all I’m saying.

 

[FSTO]

I can sum up the support for the convoy with this old CFL moniker. "Following the CFL is like reading Pornography. Everybody does it but nobody admits it in public".

 

[QV]

I can sum up the support for the convoy with this old CFL moniker. "Following the CFL is like reading Pornography. Everybody does it but nobody admits it in public".

The silent voter who is pissed off with Team Trudeau and doesn't want to go through the public shaming of being labelled a racist by the extremists. This, IMO, is a large amount of voters.

 

[Pelorus]

The point being, which escapes you Pelorus, is that support for the original "convoy" cause was widespread.

Just as long as we agree that "widespread" is an ambiguous term, but that in this case never means "majority":

Blockade Backlash: Three-in-four Canadians tell convoy protesters, ‘Go Home Now’ -

Two-thirds say Justin Trudeau’s conduct has “worsened” situation; several public figures condemned February 14, 2022 – If the goal of the Freedom Convoy was to capture the attention of millions of people in Canada and around the globe – mission accomplished. If, however, the goal was to build...

angusreid.org

The Freedom Convoy and Federal Politics - February 8, 2022

THIS SURVEY EXPLORES CANADIANS’ PERSPECTIVES ON THE FREEDOM CONVOY, FEDERAL POLITICS AND MORE. In late January 2022, a “Freedom Convoy” began making its way to Ottawa to protest COVID-19 vaccination requirements and other pandemic restrictions. The protest shows no sign of slowing down, and over...

leger360.com

https://www.ipsos.com/en-ca/news-polls/nearly-half-say-they-may-not-agree-with-trucker-convoy

 

[Loachman]

Seeing as we already invoked Godwin's Law a few posts ago

When somebody uses language that matches somebody else's perfectly, I will point it out.

What does one do when one cannot or will not tolerate something/somebody?

Remove or eliminate it/him/her . . .

I was born in southern England only eleven years after the end of the Second World War. It was still, surprisingly, fresh in many people's minds. There were several bunkers at my school. My hometown was struck by air raids, V1s, and V2s several times. A V1 struck just behind my grandparents' house, wiping out a block of houses, heavily damaging over a hundred other houses, shops, and a Church, and killing a dozen people. My grandparents' back windows were all blown in. Fortunately, they and my then-teenaged father were all in the front of the house when it hit. His older brother had died in Burma the previous May. I grew up with, was taught by, and led by, in my early Militia days, Veterans of that conflict and others. I began voraciously reading history when I could still measure my age in single digits. I have toured a few battlefields, one Canadian cemetery in Normandy, one concentration camp, one site of a 12th SS Panzer Division (Hitler Jugend) murder of several Canadian prisoners, one Anne Frank house, and one Berlin a couple of months after The Wall was taken down. I watched that live on television, and have a small chunk of it.

I can see intolerance and tyranny quite plainly when it occurs, and I do not like it in any form.

 

[Loachman]

Everybody does it but nobody admits it in public.

I so admit. I went out to watch it, along with hundreds of others. The feeling of elation was incredible. It was truly a very deep breath of the most freshest of fresh air.

 

[Good2Golf]

Re: the Queer group against PP…

They failed being valid queer advocates in Canada. Trudeau added 2S to the front of the ten-letter acronym, and they should respect the primacy of indigenous queerness over settler queerness.

[who doesn’t import] China?

They actually import lots…of other countries’ intellectual property…

 

[Furniture]

Re: the Queer group against PP…

They failed being valid queer advocates in Canada. Trudeau added 2S to the front of the ten-letter acronym, and they should respect the primacy of indigenous queerness over settler queerness.


They actually import lots…of other countries’ intellectual property…

They also import a lot of their energy, and a lot of their food...

 

[Fishbone Jones]

They also import a lot of their energy, and a lot of their food...

And a lot of that is some of the dirtiest coal we have. Guilbeault's/ trudeau's hypocrisy knows no bounds.

 

[QV]

They actually import lots…of other countries’ intellectual property…

I see what you did there....