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Alberta Election (2015)

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I suspect Rachel Notley is trying to run a one woman show.  People think Harper is a control freak, Notley is worse.

She only appointed 12 cabinet ministers, most with 2 portfolios.  She ended up with a lot of politically unsophisticated members lacking practical skills not unlike the NDP showing in Quebec last federal election.  She found only 11 others whom she could trust.  I'm sure the cabinet will double in size after a couple years as more peons gain her trust.

Out of the 12 chiefs of staff for cabinet members, 10 are from other provinces.  I think the problem was that it is hard to find radical committed Bolsheviks in Alberta that share Notley's philosophy.  Albertans might be tempted to place pragmatism over dogma and Notley couldn't have that.  The next government, in 4 years, is going to be faced with something that looks like clean-up shift at the slaughterhouse.
 
Rocky Mountains said:
I suspect Rachel Notley is trying to run a one woman show.  People think Harper is a control freak, Notley is worse.

She only appointed 12 cabinet ministers, most with 2 portfolios.  She ended up with a lot of politically unsophisticated members lacking practical skills not unlike the NDP showing in Quebec last federal election.  She found only 11 others whom she could trust.  I'm sure the cabinet will double in size after a couple years as more peons gain her trust.

Out of the 12 chiefs of staff for cabinet members, 10 are from other provinces.  I think the problem was that it is hard to find radical committed Bolsheviks in Alberta that share Notley's philosophy.  Albertans might be tempted to place pragmatism over dogma and Notley couldn't have that.  The next government, in 4 years, is going to be faced with something that looks like clean-up shift at the slaughterhouse.


I agree that the small cabinet is, probably, a direct result of the inexperience in her caucus. I suspect you're right that the cabinet will grow; I don't disapprove of large cabinets ~ cabinet making in Canada is a mixture of art and craft: getting the right regional, gender, ethnic and so on 'balances' just right to make something that works and is pleasing to the voters ~ but I would like to see small, powerful "inner cabinets" balanced with larger numbers of "junior ministers" or secretaries of state of associate ministers or, or or ...

I guess that the imported chiefs of staff are also a reflection of the inexperience level of her cabinet. It seems (did I read it wrong?) that many (most?) of the imports have some (political/governmental) executive experience.
 
Those Chief of Staffs will not last long in AB.

If the low information, gimme votes of Canada elect a minority NDP Federal government they will move on to higher paying jobs in Ottawa, probably doubling their socialist salaries. Chauffeurs limos, vast expense accounts, flying everywhere in Challengers to environmental conferences, first class hotels, etc. What a life being a self important, pious socialist. 
 
Rifleman62 said:
Those Chief of Staffs will not last long in AB.

If the low information, gimme votes of Canada elect a minority NDP Federal government they will move on to higher paying jobs in Ottawa, probably doubling their socialist salaries. Chauffeurs limos, vast expense accounts, flying everywhere in Challengers to environmental conferences, first class hotels, etc. What a life being a self important, pious socialist.

Low information...  gimme votes... You mean like the people who thought the GST cut was a good idea (all the informed people know that this is moronic, you cut income taxes not consumption taxes!!).  You know, the uneducated voters who work shiftwork at on rigs, or in mines, or for Magna who voted in the Conservatives federally.  All voters are gimme voters.  Unless they are partisan politicos.  Most voters run on the philosophy of "what have you done for me lately" or "who's gonna screw me over the least".  Most people who do vote, are low information including those who are partisan (why bother to research if you are just going to vote for the Natural Law Party anyway).

And wasn't it the use of Chauffeured limos, vast expense accounts and flying everywhere on the gov't aircraft that started the end of the conservatives in AB in the first place?  And didn't they tell you that it was the voters that the conservatives were like that?

...edited for recceguys ease of reading....
 
Underway said:
Low information...  gimme votes... Oh you mean like the people who thought the GST cut was a good idea (good lord all the informed people know that this is moronic, you cut income taxes not consumption taxes!!).  You know the uneducated voters who work shiftwork at on rigs, or in mines, or for Magna who voted in the Conservatives federally.  All voters are gimme voters.  Unless they are partisan politicos.  Most voters run on the philosophy of "what have you done for me lately" or who's gonna screw me over the least.  Most ppl who do vote are low information including especially those who are partisan (why bother to research if you are just going to vote for the Natural Law Party anyways).

Oh and wasn't it the use of Chauffeured limos, vast expense accounts and flying everywhere on the gov't aircraft that started the end of the conservatives in AB in the first place?  Oh and it was your fault voters that the conservatives were like that.

Some punctuation would make this easier to read.

Just a thought.
 
Underway said:
Oh and wasn't it the use of Chauffeured limos, vast expense accounts and flying everywhere on the gov't aircraft that started the end of the conservatives in AB in the first place?  Oh and it was your fault voters that the conservatives were like that.

This has been brought up before, but I would say that Alberta electing NDP was more related to the Wildrose and PC splitting the right wing vote vice the NDP garnering a majority of the voters (same as the CPC federally). Over 50% of Albertans voted for right wing parties after all
 
I doubt the Tory and wildrose supporters are crying about changing proportional representation because the NDP didn't win the popular vote. Seems like a typical left wing ploy to change how the system works so they win.
 
Bird_Gunner45 said:
This has been brought up before, but I would say that Alberta electing NDP was more related to the Wildrose and PC splitting the right wing vote vice the NDP garnering a majority of the voters (same as the CPC federally). Over 50% of Albertans voted for right wing parties after all

You nailed it.

The race for the 'right to the right' totally forgot about the hard left hook. And they deserved to fail as a result, of course.
 
It doesn't really matter what percentage of people voted for the right wing.  Our electoral system is not based on the popular vote. 

Why did 50% vote for the right wing parties?  Did they want 4 more years of PC entitlement, or 1 or 2 or 3 years because the fixed election dates sure didn't stop an early election - but math is hard, I forgive Prentice. What part of the Wildrose message did they like?  It surely wasn't evident in the debate - they had no message.  I like no more taxes too, but that isn't a good response about how to fund education in the face of a growing school population.  Did they vote for the right wing parties, or did they vote against the NDP? 

I can't believe I've actually sunk down to defending the NDP.  Rachel Notley came out with a strong campaign, and was solid in the debate.  She deserved to win.  I wait to see how she will govern.  Sure the NDP have screwed up in other provinces, but how well did the other parties in those provinces do?  Gordon Campbell wasn't great for BC, Christy Clark hasn't improved things.  Were things all hunky dory in Ontario under Mike Harris?  Saskatchewan is a mess of its own, even now with Brad Wall - their transportation infrastructure is horrendous, as one example.

I will wait to see how she governs before passing judgement.  For now, everyone else just sounds like sore losers.
 
Ontario was excellent under Harris. Look at the absolute destruction of its economy under the Liberals.
 
stealthylizard said:
It doesn't really matter what percentage of people voted for the right wing.  Our electoral system is not based on the popular vote. 

Why did 50% vote for the right wing parties?  Did they want 4 more years of PC entitlement, or 1 or 2 or 3 years because the fixed election dates sure didn't stop an early election - but math is hard, I forgive Prentice. What part of the Wildrose message did they like?  It surely wasn't evident in the debate - they had no message.  I like no more taxes too, but that isn't a good response about how to fund education in the face of a growing school population.  Did they vote for the right wing parties, or did they vote against the NDP? 

I can't believe I've actually sunk down to defending the NDP.  Rachel Notley came out with a strong campaign, and was solid in the debate.  She deserved to win.  I wait to see how she will govern.  Sure the NDP have screwed up in other provinces, but how well did the other parties in those provinces do?  Gordon Campbell wasn't great for BC, Christy Clark hasn't improved things.  Were things all hunky dory in Ontario under Mike Harris?  Saskatchewan is a mess of its own, even now with Brad Wall - their transportation infrastructure is horrendous, as one example.

I will wait to see how she governs before passing judgement.  For now, everyone else just sounds like sore losers.

No sore loser here.... Simply pointing out that in the Cdn electoral system its rare that a governing party has a majority of the vote despite a majority of seats. So, had the right not been divided (as the left is federally) than the outcome might be different.

Things in Ontario weren't all "hunky dory" under Mike Harris, but they were a heck of a lot better than the 4 years of Bob Rae.
 
I was in Ontario for Bob Rae. It was a mess. I have been in BC for the NDP, too. Campbell and Clark were/are vast improvements.

I have also been in Saskatchewan under Brad Wall. Easily (far and away), the best provincial government I have ever seen, in terms of being professional and good with money.

Naturally, your mileage may vary.
 
stealthylizard said:
It doesn't really matter what percentage of people voted for the right wing.  Our electoral system is not based on the popular vote. 

....

There are no parties.  The Constitution doesn't recognize them.  There is no entitlement for parties. 

The current system permits the election of independents unaffiliated to any party and, in fact, is geared towards the unaffiliated member. Proportional Representation works against the Independent.
 
I have to wonder if the recent number of Federal NDP bill supported by the CPC is an indicator that the CPC and NDP thinks the CPC may only win a minority government and the NDP is forming a relationship to get access to power if that happens. It makes sense in a way, neither the NDP or CPC will mistake the relationship as anything other than a relationship of convenience with clear positions for both parties, whereas a Liberal and NDP coalition will be a nasty mixed up mess with both parties claiming to be the idea maker and true governance, which will eventually confuse and annoy votes and party supporters alike. Possibly a early election as the fallout. The CPC-NDP alliance will be the CPC showing it can play well with others and the NDP showing that it is a grown up party that can checkmate the "worst of the Conservatives". The CPC retains power for another 4 years but at the whim of the NDP, who can use that time to show Canada that they are a "serious party".     
 
I suspect that should the Conservatives win a minority, it would be in the Liberal Party's best interest to support the Conservatives.  If the Liberals put the NDP in power, I suspect they would simply become irrelevant and disappear.  My guess is that the Liberals are a lot more like the Conservatives than they like to believe. 

Alberta Thread - sorry.
 
The newly sworn Government of Alberta held their first Address to the Legislative Assembly today.

It was a sad sight.
 
LunchMeat said:
It was a sad sight.

Alberta's economy is in the crapper so they are raising corporate income taxes 12%.  I hope they weren't actually planning on collecting any more.  The PC's budget had a $5 billion deficit.  I wouldn't doubt the Bolsheviks manage $8 billion.

Actually I read it wrong - provincial corporate taxes are going from 10% to 12%, a 20 % increase.
 
E.R. Campbell said:
This morning, on CBC Radio's "The House" former Bank of Canada Governor David Dodge, one of the smartest men in Canada - head and shoulders smarter than any elected politician at any level, and smarter than 99% of the senior civil servants who advise all those politicians - will argue for more Keynesian stimulus: but he will argue, very very specifically, for infrastructure spending: e.g. yes to Kathleen Wynne's plan to spend several billions on transit, for example, but no to additional social spending.

I'm not sure how he will come down on the Ontario premier's plan for an Ontario Retirement Pension Plan, which would be mandatory for those who don't already have a workplace plan. In fact I'm not exactly sure how I feel about it: I, generally, want to see people save more for their own retirement, but I think I would rather see enhancements to the RRSP system, including, perhaps, very small employer contributions (maybe something <0.5% of payroll under, say, $60,000.0) for employees who do not have pension plans but who do contribute to a RRSP. But I also think that the very best way to address the problems that Ontario, for example, faces, is to grow the economy - which is why I know I will agree with David Dodge about some additional stimulus - stimulus focused, exclusively, on infrastructure, especially on maintenance of existing infrastructure but also on new public transit projects.


Edited to add:


Here, in Bennett Jones Spring 2014 Economic Outlook, is the substance of David Dodge's views. (Mr Dodge is a Senior Advisor at Bennett Jones.)

Mr (Prof or Dr if you prefer) Dodge is very clear: we must restrain current spending, which is, mainly social spending, but he advocates long term (30-50 year) borrowing, now, at low rates, for long lived (30 to 50 years) infrastructure. He also advocates tolls for roads and bridges and ports, and, and, and ... to help pay the interest on those loans.


And, given that Premier Rachel Notley has hired David Dodge to help her get Alberta back on track, David Parkinson suggests that AB is in for some long term debt financed infrastructure renewal in this article which is reproduced under the Fair Dealing provisions of the Copyright Act from the Globe and Mail:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/economy/economic-insight/albertans-will-be-forced-to-face-debt-with-david-dodge/article25100695/
gam-masthead.png

Albertans will be forced to face debt with David Dodge

SUBSCRIBERS ONLY

David Parkinson
The Globe and Mail

Last updated Thursday, Jun. 25, 2015

For the better part of two decades, Alberta’s definition of good government has been built on an aversion to debt. New Premier Rachel Notley’s choice of David Dodge to come up with a blueprint for the province’s infrastructure investment signals a major departure from that well-worn path.

Last Friday, Ms. Notley held a press conference to introduce Mr. Dodge, the professorial former governor of the Bank of Canada, as the adviser enlisted to recommend a plan to address Alberta’s considerable infrastructure needs. Of all the outsiders Ms. Notley has recruited to the province in recent weeks to help guide her conspicuously under-experienced rookie government, Mr. Dodge is undoubtedly the biggest name.

“We need to get this right,” Ms. Notley said. “We are turning to the experts to ensure that we do.”

Mr. Dodge has been asked to come up with answers to the most fundamental questions of Alberta’s infrastructure future: How much it should spend, what it should spend on, and – crucially – how it should finance the spending at a time when weak oil prices have put the province under a serious strain.

He will study these issues over the summer, and provide his recommendations before the presentation of a new capital plan in the government’s budget scheduled for October. But it is no secret where he stands on the key principles. And if you are one of the many Albertans who are fiercely proud of the debt-free status the province enjoyed (albeit briefly) in the 2000s, you are not going to like what he has to say.

“Borrowing for infrastructure development that will lead to greater economic development, where there is an identifiable return on that investment, is absolutely appropriate – particularly at this point in time, when we’ve got very low interest rates,” he said at the press conference.

That sums up what Mr. Dodge has been writing and saying about public infrastructure investment over the past year or so. In a nutshell, he strongly believes nothing is wrong with borrowing money to invest in long-term projects that will grease the wheels of economic prosperity – and with borrowing costs about as low as they are ever going to be, a government would be short-sighted not to do so.

Ms. Notley clearly leans in this direction as well. At the press conference, she said the choice by previous Tory governments to eliminate debt came “at the expense of infrastructure debt, which everybody decided to stop talking about until ceiling tiles started falling INTO major public buildings.”

Of course, all those years of debt aversion have left Ms. Notley with room to borrow. The province still has no net debt – it has borrowed in recent years, but its financial assets outweigh those debts. Considering that the median net debt-to-gross-domestic-product ratio for Canada’s other provinces is north of 30 per cent, Alberta could finance an awful lot of infrastructure and still be in comparatively good shape.

And paradoxically, Alberta’s oil misfortune may have provided it with a window to fast-track its infrastructure development. Despite the pressure a slumping economy has put on government revenue, the slack in activity in the energy sector, especially the capital-intensive oil sands, means public-sector projects would face a lot less of the competition for labour, materials and equipment that has pushed up government infrastructure costs in the past.

This, too, is a point Mr. Dodge was already making before Ms. Notley hired him.

“The federal government and the provinces should consider accelerated investment in needed infrastructure to take advantage of the reduced wage and cost pressures resulting from the decline of private investment in the resource industries,” he wrote in an economic report published earlier this year by Bennett Jones, the Calgary-based law firm where he has served as a senior adviser in its Ottawa office since 2008.

Still, these arguments will stick in the craw of many fiscal conservatives – and the province has plenty of such beasts – who fear rampant borrowing at a time when the government is already spending beyond its means. The oil slump has taken a deep gouge out of provincial revenue, and the government is headed for a deficit in the ballpark of $5-billion this fiscal year.

But despite Mr. Dodge’s support for a ramp-up in infrastructure spending, his past suggests he is not about to send Alberta down a path to chronic problem deficits. Remember that, before he was governor of the Bank of Canada, he was federal deputy finance minister under Paul Martin – and in that role was instrumental in dismantling the crippling federal deficits of the 1980s and 1990s.

It is important to recognize that taking on debt is not the same as running up a deficit. Especially when interest rates are low, governments can borrow for the long term while incurring only fairly modest increases to their annual expenses. Just as you and I can borrow for a house and still make ends meet with our monthly mortgage payments, the government can carry debts within prudent budgets.

Consider that in the fiscal year ended March 31, 2015, Alberta’s government borrowing increased by about $4-billion. But the impact on its budget for the year – its cost of making payments on its debt – increased $130-million from the prior year, or just 0.3 per cent of the total budget.

The hurdle Ms. Notley will have to clear with a Dodge-styled capital plan – and it even came up from the media in last week’s news conference – is getting the public to see the distinction between debts and deficits. In a province where an entire generation of voters has been raised on the notion that government debt must be avoided, that is no small feat. But then again, neither was defeating a government that had reigned for 44 years.


My fear, for Alberta, is that Premier Notley's party will want to borrow and spend on social programmes, which are extremely unproductive, even counterproductive, rather than on infrastructure renewal, which is very productive and should last as long as the term on the bonds used to finance it.

Debt is not bad ... in fact the very notion of "public debt" is what, more than any war or philosophy, created the modern world.
 
I am going to come out "against" this for the simple reason that politicans and bureaucrats are weasles and will contort the spirit and the letter of any plan so long as it aggregates more power and influence to them.

Once this plan is "blessed"; look for hocky arenas, performing arts centers, convention centers, "public art" sculptures and a whole host of "other" projects to magically turn into "infrastructure" to get funding. Evne real infrastructure like roads,bridges, water and sewer pipes etc. will be directed to where the (NDP) voters are, so it will suck to be an Albertan living outside of Edmonton and Calgary.

The vast majority of these projects will have 0 or negative impact on GDP growth, and the debt overhang will pull the rest of the economy down with it (does no one at all remember the Great Depression or the financial crisis of 2008?). Public debt is only good so far as we can trust politicians and bureaucrats to spend it on real infrastructure, not disguised social spending and vote getting (and the answer to that is "not at all").

No, this is just a cover for doing what they want to do anyway.
 
I think it's a good idea as far as diversifying where Alberta gets the money for infrastructure so that if oil prices dip, it won't be affected or at least ass affected.

I don't think it will turn out that way as once a money faucet is open for the government, they tend to flood the bathroom.
 
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