Divining the right role, capabilities, structure, and Regimental System for Canada's Army Reserves

[George Wallace]

Much of the kit exists and will just be moved from gathering dust and rust in Reg F lines to gather dust and rust in Res F lines.

Other items are already in the capital plan, and when delviered will be diercted to the units tasked to operate them.

Remember, however, that a lot can change - and if we end up not deployed en masse anywhere post 2011, expect to see equipment and tasks repatriated to the Reg F to keep them entertained.


And so the circle of life continues...

Yes a lot of this kit exists, and as you say the circle continues......robbing Peter to pay Paul.  I am in a unit that has been mandated two years ago to grow to 120 from 24.  We still only have 24 rifles, one Milcot sans radio installation, and one 8 PAX van.  We are stopping/slowing down our recruiting as we are now at 82 pers.  No signature on the necessary docs giving final authorization to this mandate.  No increase in kit and facilities.  Too many Catch 22's to get our Recruits on BMQ and SQ Courses.  Too many new caveates from LFC, LFCA and the School as to Trades Training and Clearances required.  Slow processing of Clearances required through DPM Secur.  A serious shortage of trained RMS clerks.  And yet another "REORG" coming in 30 days at LFCA Area Troops to OSG or whatever.  This is rediculous.

In all likelihood some units are going to have to give up equipment to newly formed or enlarged units. 

 

[George Wallace]

In SQFT, a group was form that include inteligence, CIMIC and PSYOPS.  We lost member to these units.  So, yep, it's real, not a paper invention...

This is the plan to make all Area ORBATS to be exactly the same.  It is real.  It is paper.  Where are the facilities, personnel and equipment?

 

[WLSC]

This is the plan to make all Area ORBATS to be exactly the same.  It is real.  It is paper.  Where are the facilities, personnel and equipment?

From what I know, they are at Longue-Pointe.  They have a CO, BOR and all.  For the equipment and all, surelly a case of Peter rubbing Paul.  But yes, it's up and running since 2/3 years.

 

[Haggis]

So, will "Operates an ATV" now be added to IBTS?

No, it's a separate qualification requiring the Canada Safety Council ATV Rider Course.  Then, you'll get "G18" added to your DND 404.

 

[HItorMiss]

Haggis ATV is G18 but that really isn't the point

Look lets call a spade a spade, Reserve units can barely manage a couple of 2 Pl Coys on huge area concentrations does anyone here really think anything this is more then a pipe dream, I sure don`t.

As for a Res CBRN(E) unit why double up on a capacity that already exist within the CF under the Umbrella of CANSOFCOM I don`t see CJIRU wanting people they don't trust playing in their sandbox and  honestly neither would I.

 

[Haggis]

Haggis ATV is G18 but that really isn't the point

Yeah, you're right.  My bad... a typo.

Look lets call a spade a spade, Reserve units can barely manage a couple of 2 Pl Coys on huge area concentrations does anyone here really think anything this is more then a pipe dream, I sure don`t.

It's a capacity issue rather than a capability issue.  As noted earlier the CF can recruit until the seams burst.  The training system cannot keep up with demand.  It's not a Reg or Res problem, it's a CF problem.

As for a Res CBRN(E) unit why double up on a capacity that already exist within the CF under the Umbrella of CANSOFCOM I don`t see CJIRU wanting people they don't trust playing in their sandbox and  honestly neither would I.

If you form a similar Reserve unit (even a PRL), it not only adds capacity but also aids in retaining capability since it gives expensively trained and experienced Reg F members a place to go once they decide to hang up the Reg F career.

 

[dapaterson]

For CBRN, past concepts have had different skill sets in the P Res than in the CJIRU - and not as high maintenance skills.  Complimentary, vice duplicate skillsets.

And some "direction" that has gone out is woefully incomplete, or had dramatic insubordination at its root - unit COs don't go to CLS directly, circumventing their chain of command.  Or at least, they shouldn't... as it makes implementation difficult when the chain of command learns about what happened after the fact and then tries to get engaged, or when proper development work was never done to support the request that circumvented the chain of command, leaving staff to ask fundamental questions as they try to backtrack the intent.  Not that any unit would ever do that, of course...

 

[HItorMiss]

It's a capacity issue rather than a capability issue.  As noted earlier the CF can recruit until the seams burst.  The training system cannot keep up with demand.  It's not a Reg or Res problem, it's a CF problem.

Thats why I say it's a pipe dream overall. Plus institutionaly if you can only get so few numbers to show up for scheduled Ex's how are they going tpo get these new units to have the porper numbers to do anything?

 

[McG]

Thats why I say it's a pipe dream overall. Plus institutionaly if you can only get so few numbers to show up for scheduled Ex's how are they going tpo get these new units to have the porper numbers to do anything?

Maybe you re-role units instead of creating new.

 

[HItorMiss]

Maybe you re-role units instead of creating new.

And that changes what in terms of manpower


As per my above post when you can barely get a Pl of pers to turn out for an Ex do you really think they will have the manpower turn out for any of this?

 

[McG]

Re-rolling would avoid creating new manpower & infrastructure demands on the reserves (at least to some extent if not entirely), and it would reduce the new equipment demends.

If your question is 'how do we get units to turn out in strenght' then the answer is (as stated several times through the life of this thread) combine multiple regiments under a single unit HQ with a common role. 

 

[the 48th regulator]

Re-rolling would avoid creating new manpower & infrastructure demands on the reserves (at least to some extent if not entirely), and it would reduce the new equipment demends.

If your question is 'how do we get units to turn out in strenght' then the answer is (as stated several times through the life of this thread) combine multiple regiments under a single unit HQ with a common role. 

Uhm,


Neat idea, but that sure as hell will not bring out the troops.  The average troop could care less about the mechanics of how his fan out is created, and what building his paycheque has been signed.

These new roles are the incentives that will, and our current economic times, bring out the troops.

Mark my word

dileas

tess

 

[HItorMiss]

My point is this.

As a reservist you can't be compeled/ordered to show up for anything you can simply just not show up, you have work or school or studying to do etc etc. I am not slagging the system here it's just how it is.

You can have paper strength of 600 but only 50 show up for parade what is the point?


Tess: It might at first because it sound much more glamarious then it really is. In the end the situation will revert to the current status quo. And when it comes to such task as CBRN that status quo is simply unacceptable IMO.

 

[dapaterson]

Neat idea, but that sure as hell will not bring out the troops.  The average troop could care less about the mechanics of how his fan out is created, and what building his paycheque has been signed.

Exactly why s**t-canning HQs will have no impact (despite the claims of some) and instead free up funds for more, better training.  Scaling back to, oh, 7 Bde HQs (with limited deployability), each with say seven subordinate units (all in multiple locations) would free up a lot of funds - and maintain the current footprint - or maybe even expand it.

 

[WLSC]

The issue of strenght his a difficult one.  Each unit from a region/city parade a a different strenght.  More the unit his isolated, more difficult it is to have a big unit.

Re-role wont remove the root problem but solve some other.

 

[WLSC]

Exactly why s**t-canning HQs will have no impact (despite the claims of some) and instead free up funds for more, better training.  Scaling back to, oh, 7 Bde HQs (with limited deployability), each with say seven subordinate units (all in multiple locations) would free up a lot of funds - and maintain the current footprint - or maybe even expand it.

That would work.  And you might re-role so specialities would be spread over the country.

 

[the 48th regulator]

Exactly why s**t-canning HQs will have no impact (despite the claims of some) and instead free up funds for more, better training.  Scaling back to, oh, 7 Bde HQs (with limited deployability), each with say seven subordinate units (all in multiple locations) would free up a lot of funds - and maintain the current footprint - or maybe even expand it.

Right,

And you are reducing the manning level of the higher ranks.  With no incentive to move forward in rank and position, what would make me want to even bother taking any courses.  What would even make want to do any advancement, with the reserves?

Seems to me, we would rather dumb down the reserves, and eliminate many senior people, to free up a budget. A budget I see disappearing from the reserves, who would have less of a senior rank and file to fight for it.  Chia, that would really make the reserves come out... :

I say, go in the direction of the Past, enact a combined regimental unit (Similar to MCG's plan), and then deploy them operationally.  Manned from top to bottom with reservists.  I am sure we have had enough in every position, or close there to to be able to do that, that have operational experience to help out.

This will infuse more experience within the rank and file.  This will be the incentive for people to go want to parade.  Knowing that they are a valuable part of themilitary, that does not have to "supplement" their big brothers of the reg force by being part of their bat tallions.

Make the reserves a valuable, visibly valuable, part of the Canadian Military. 

BM,

I hear ya bro.  But I can bet you my bottom dollar, our economic situation in the world will beef up the ranks.  It happened in the early '90s.

dileas

tess

 

[McG]

Neat idea, but that sure as hell will not bring out the troops.  The average troop could care less about the mechanics of how his fan out is created, and what building his paycheque has been signed.

It [multi-regimental battalions] would not bring out more troops, but it would leave remaining units with a larger pool of the troops that come out.

 

[the 48th regulator]

So one full strenghth reserve unit.

Hmm, may work out, now I see what you mean.  So instead of brigades, we change the name to regiment, and problem solved...

ATTENTION THIS IS NOT A FACETIOUS STATEMENT

In fact, we should look at the complete military as a whole.  Do we really need three undermanned regular force battallions for each regiment?  I can see more budget being freed as well there.

dileas

tess

 

[WLSC]

It [multi-regimental battalions] would not bring out more troops, but it would leave remaining units with a larger pool of the troops that come out.

I like that very much.  I would go up to ammalgamation.  Not a easy one to sell, I know