• Thanks for stopping by. Logging in to a registered account will remove all generic ads. Please reach out with any questions or concerns.

Informing the Army’s Future Structure

The struggle is real







If the US is short of assets to move its own forces, with whom are we going to hitch a ride?
This article is based on changing assumptions. That the US has global security responsibilities. It doesn't. It only has North American security responsibilities. It has global security choices. The US is choosing to not deploy rapidly because it doesn't need to.
 
This article is based on changing assumptions. That the US has global security responsibilities. It doesn't. It only has North American security responsibilities. It has global security choices. The US is choosing to not deploy rapidly because it doesn't need to.
I wish that were true.

I agree that the US has global security choices but force structure is also a choice and more often than not is not based on needs but on wants. All too often logistics are kept scaled more for peacetime than a potential was. It's cheaper that way and the fancy kit bling is so much more attractive. (In fairness, it appears more essential)

At least the US Army keeps a vast percentage of its reserve force in support and service support brigades which are low cost in peace time and easily spun up in war time. That unfortunately still doesn't get them into theatre.

On the other hand Canada has virtually no depth in reserve logistics support other than a few very understrength and practically unequipped brigade service battalions and virtually no internal lift capability.

You're very right. That's a choice. As to need? Only time will tell.

🍻
 
I think if we can't equip a brigade with either the personnel or equipment then perhaps then perhaps we should adjust our eyes to more adequately represent our stomachs, but sustaining a battle group should not be beyond our capabilities. What other countries are capable of doing is unknown to me, so I don't have any frame of reference but the Italians would seem to be our nearest comparable. A fully equipped battle group should still require at the least the addition of self propelled artillery, motar carrier, SHORAD, and AT capability. We've concentrated on moving PY's around but has anyone tallied up the additional equipment requirements. I think that will put an end to the idea of sustaining a brigade


 
This article is based on changing assumptions. That the US has global security responsibilities. It doesn't. It only has North American security responsibilities. It has global security choices. The US is choosing to not deploy rapidly because it doesn't need to.

Just like every plant I have commissioned is subject to changing assumptions. The chase of the moving target is codified/excused as Continuous Improvement. Are we there yet?

As FJAG says everything is about choices. Nobody has to do anything.

But.

The Armed Forces exist to deal with the world when it runs out of choices.
 
Question to all and sundry:

How many helicopters does 408 squadron hold in Edmonton? And, to confirm, they are all Griffons, right?
 
OK - The answer to the above question, according to Google, is 16. Assuming a small section of 6 then 16x6 = 96 or a small company being lifted simultaneously. 4 lifts for a Battalion. Each lift represents moving a fighting force anywhere on the battlefield in a 100 km radius in 30 minutes.

Now if only they could do something useful when they got there.

Currently the best they can do is pelt armour plate with 7.62mm pellets. If they are lucky they will be ignored.

On the other hand IF they had 24 ATGMs in the battalion, or 8 available to the company, and also 4 CG M4s to the platoon then those 16 helicopters could relocate 8 ATGM firing posts with 48x 4 km missiles and 12 CG84s with 72 rounds - some 500m AT rounds and lots of smoke.

Enemy advance identified.

AT equipped company group lifted in 30 minutes to a flank ahead of the advance.

Establish an "enfilade in defilade" position using available terrain.

Engage enemy at 2-4 km with 48 fire and forget missiles using volley fire and retire tactics.

Pop smoke with CGs, and lay down a screen of 7.62 pellets to break contact.

Retire at best rate of knots to the RV for pickup and recovery by the helos.

Retain 500 m CG84 AT-HEDP rounds for the unexpected on the exfil.

Home for breakfast.


And if the Squadron is regrouped, swapping 4x CH146s for 4x CH147s from 450 then the relocatable force expands from 16x 6 = 96 to 12x 6 + 4x 44 = 248 troops in the relocatable AT force.


The problem for the infantry is not that they are irrelevant on the armoured battlefield. It is just that Canadian Infantry have not been given the tools that make every other army's infantry relevant.

In the absence of those tools strained scenarios have to be developed to justify their employment (and what to do with transport helicopters).

And with those tools the infantry can take the load off the RCAC's tanks so that they can be retained as the Mailed Fist.
 
And once they are finished eating up the enemy's vehicles, containing their mounted opponents, then they are available to accompany the Mailed Fist with bomb and bayonet to close with and destroy the enemy.
 
I'm going to do a bit of an about face on this topic. My heart lies with FGAG and Kirkhill in many ways. I think a country the size and wealth of Canada should aspire to be able to fairly rapidly field a combat-capable Mechanized Brigade Group and sustain it. I also see a future for light forces using emerging technologies in dispersed operations to great effect.

Unfortunately, for a great many diverse reasons we are pretty far away from either of those goals. However, as TangoTwoBravo has pointed out we have a pretty good starting point with our existing CMBG structure. So maybe a better goal for the Force 2025 to Force 2030 time frame should be to consolidate and strengthen that base so that going forward we have a stronger foundation to build upon.

As far as deploying and sustaining a full CMBG in a combat operation goes, there are a whole bunch of reasons we can't currently do that (transport, support organizations, Reserve structure/training/equipment/legislation, supply, replacement equipment, etc.). We need to recognize those weaknesses and start working on solutions now so that going forward such a deployment could be an option.

With regard to a dedicated Heavy Brigade. Firstly, as noted above we wouldn't have the capability to deploy it as a full Brigade and I see zero possibility of Canada forward deploying such a force in Europe. There simply is neither the political will or the budget to support it. So in any case we'd be looking at a slower, trans-Atlantic deployment of a Battle Group. That is something that can be done within the current CMBG structure.

I find the possibilities for a rapidly deployable light force that is sensor heavy and uses non-LOS weapons to counter the advance of a conventional force quite intriguing. But I'm not sure that is where we should focus our efforts right now. We probably only have enough transport capability to deploy and sustain a handful of Company-Group sized units. Is that enough mass to make a significant difference against a major peer invasion force? Would we want to risk our air transport assets in this deployment when they will also be needed to deploy and support our heavier follow-on forces? Does this capability fit better with CSOR rather than with our Reg Force Light Battalions? If a major conventional war is the least likely of our deployment scenarios, then would we be better off adding these capabilities to our Mechanized units instead where they are better protected (and for most other types of operations rapid deployment isn't as critical)?

I'd say for Force 2025 we should disband the 3rd Light Battalions from the Reg Force CMBGs. Use those PYs to increase the manning levels in the remaining Mech Battalions...starting with fully filling out the Combat Support Companies with all the required support elements (AT, mortars, pioneers, MG?, recce, etc.). Higher permanent manning levels should also help to reduce the time required to ready the Battalions for deployment.

Concentrate all of the Leopard Squadrons in a single location to simplify logistics and support and standardize training and tactics. Form them into a separate Tank Regiment, or have it a composite Regiment with detached Squadrons from each of the three existing Armoured Regiments...let the RCAC figure that one out.

Dedicate a portion of the Reserves specifically to augmenting the Reg Force. For example, Reserve Infantry Regiments (restructured as Companies) could augment the Reg Force Mech Battalions. This could be done in one of two ways. You could either pair a Reserve Regiment with each Reg Force Company and task the Reserve Regiment with force generating a Platoon to augment that Company, or you could group the Reserve Regiments (Companies) together to provide a 3rd and 4th Light Battalion to augment the parent Reg Force Regiments.

There would be enough Reserve Infantry units left in Ontario to create a single Reserve Canadian Infantry Brigade Group. The medium term goal would be to work on equipping and training this Brigade to the point of being able to force generate a Light Infantry Battle Group with the eventual goal of being to deploy the entire Brigade in case of full mobilization. Perhaps this Brigade could even be given a specialized role. For example, defence of our forward airfields and/or landing ports/supply hubs during a conflict. Or possibly winter/arctic warfare or urban ops.

Assign three Reserve Arty Regiments to each Reg Force Arty Regiment and task them each will supplying an additional 3-gun Battery. When the Reg Force Regiments eventually get a self-propelled 155mm gun the M777s can be moved to these Reserve Batteries keeping all the 155mm guns concentrated in three Reg Force Regiments. The three remaining Ontario Reserve Regiments would be grouped to provide the Artillery Regiment for the Reserve Infantry Brigade. The remaining Reserve Artillery Regiments would remain 105mm regiments until such time as we bring SHORAD and HIMARS capabilities online. Then they can transition into supplying batteries for hybrid Reg/Reserve AD & Rocket Regiments.

Four Reserve Armoured Regiments per CMBG area could be tasked to each supply a TAPV Recce Troop to provide a composite Squadron for each Reg Force Armoured Regiment. They could also provide individual augmentees to be trained on the LAV Recce platform. The three Atlantic Regiments (plus the 5th Ontario Reserve Regiment) would be grouped to provide the Armoured Recce Regiment for the Reserve Infantry Brigade. The two BC Regiments could be re-tasked for more specialized roles (AT, UAV Recce, etc.).

The three Engineer, Signal and Service units from the current Ontario Brigade Groups would group to provide the support elements for the Reserve Infantry Brigade. The units from the rest of the current Reserve Brigades would either be used to augment the Reg Force elements of the CMBGs or beef up the CCSB.

Nothing that is creating a radically new capability, but hopefully changes that would make the existing structure stronger and provide a strong foundation for future growth.
 
As I was writing up my suggestions on the employment of AT systems by the infantry it occurred to me: in the absence of an effective Anti-Tank weapon the LAV battalions are essentially toting Gendarmes, not Soldiers. It is little wonder that when those Gendarmes are deployed without the LAVs, as a light force, they have little impact on the battlefield.
 
... With regard to a dedicated Heavy Brigade. Firstly, as noted above we wouldn't have the capability to deploy it as a full Brigade and I see zero possibility of Canada forward deploying such a force in Europe. There simply is neither the political will or the budget to support it. So in any case we'd be looking at a slower, trans-Atlantic deployment of a Battle Group. That is something that can be done within the current CMBG structure. ...
I've always maintained that there are numerous options available that will produce something better than what we have. Many of your ideas fit in very well with my own. (which therefore makes them absolutely brilliant ideas :giggle: )

I'll take up the defence of the heavy brigade, however.

Firstly I think that such a brigade is necessary for the simple reason that it is organized and employed differently from how either a light or mech brigade is (and thus needs its own table of organization and training regime). It's use as a brigade in full is entirely aspirational as in a day to day context, I see it more being used to reinforce a light or mech contingent, that is being seriously tactically challenged, with a heavy battle group.

There are two points to this.

First, is that when we operated in Afghanistan the opponent was a very light asymmetric force which at no time ever challenged our contingent's survival. They had the ability to hurt us but never kill us as an entity. On the other hand, there are numerous OOTW scenarios out there where the potential opposition is armed in a way that could seriously challenge a light or mech battle group. That type of scenario would have our deployed force living under a constant threat or be such that militarily we shouldn't deploy our force when politically the government might want us to.

Second, I do not consider projecting either such a heavy brigade or a heavy battle group offshore a limitation. The deployment difficulties are recognized factors that need to be planned for and exercised to the point that we have a known optimal planning requirement that we can then adjust the system to. I try to distinguish the way we are from the way we ought to be.

Each of the United States, Russia and now Britain have gone to brigade groups and brigade combat teams as units of action with heavy, medium and light versions. I'm not saying we should be blind copy-cats, but we should consider that much research has gone into that and the formats are there for very valid tactical reasons. The key raison d'être for a heavy brigade or combined arms battalion is its ability to conduct aggressive offensive actions in all but the most difficult terrain. Light and mechanized brigades are very limited in that respect (albeit they may be the preferred option in difficult terrain). In addition those countries also maintain a divisional framework for occasions when a force larger than a brigade needs to deploy.

Generally these brigades have the ability to spin off a combined arms battle group. With a US ABCT that's already organic by way of the armour heavy or infantry heavy combined arms battalions. The Russians do it as well with their Battalion Tactical Groups. Essentially their brigades and battle groups are similar to Canada's CMBG (if it has a tank regiment) and Canada's battle groups (with the major exceptions that Canada has a tactically unsound NSE concept on operations, and lacks sufficient artillery, anti-armour and AD capabilities).

Do I see the heavy brigade used in most of Canada's OOTW scenarios? No, but I do see it as the preferred option to maintain the eFP presence in Latvia which appears to be a long term mission. If we had a heavy brigade with three combined arms battalions and a cavalry battalion with even one full reserve brigade (unequipped but trained as heavy) we would have sufficient elements to maintain the eFP indefinitely and even reinforce it, if desired or necessary. In addition I foresee that there may come a time where we might need to deploy a heavy combined arms battalion on an OOTW deployment.

For me the big difference with what Canada is doing now comes in the fact that "heavy" components should not merely be "bolt-on" elements to an otherwise light or mech force. That only works in very limited circumstances. It needs to be a properly organized, equipped, manned and trained to its own doctrine and TTPs if it is to have any success in combat.

Do I see a political limitation here? No I don't. Each of Canada's missions into Kabul and Kandahar were politically motivated and there were no objections in Canada to taking heavy weapons like LAVs and artillery into what were basically humanitarian operations because there was a clear understanding of the risks. Similarly, the acquisition of the Leopard 2 were seen by the politicians as a reasonable response by the government to the increased level of threat in Kandahar and to reduce Canadian casualties. The subsequent plan to obtain IFVs was also accepted by the Government albeit subsequently killed by the Army itself. I sometimes (but not always) think that the phrase "the government won't do that" is a code phrase used within the Army by folks who "don't want to do that". I suspect that the concept of the symmetric Army and the resistance to an asymmetric one has more to do with regimental cliques that feel that they will get the short end of the stick in a reorganization then the need to keep the structure to facilitate managed readiness. But that's the cynic in me coming out.

Edited to add:


🍻
 
Last edited:
There are lots of things that can (and should) be done given enough time. My thoughts above are limited to the Force 2025 (3-1/2 year) and Force 2030 (8-1/2 year) time frames.

I think that consolidating 3 Battalions of infantry, modernizing and concentrating our tanks, purchasing and integrating AGTMs, a self-propelled artillery system, a SHORAD capability and possibly loitering munitions (including developing our doctrine, training systems, etc.), and completely re-aligning and re-grouping our Reserve forces is a fair bit to bite off in that time frame. Never mind all the changes that will be going on in both the RCN and RCAF during that same time frame.

Going beyond to Force 2035, etc. I agree that more changes should follow. But in the short term let's fix our cracked and leaky foundation then we can look at putting on that nice, new addition!
 
How about..... :D

WW2 British/Canadian Armoured Division

2 Brigades and a Support Group?

1 Armoured Brigade (Combined Arms?)
1 Motor Infantry Brigade (LAV?)
1 Support Group of Arty (keep), Air Defence (keep), Anti-Tank (keep?),

We don't have to organize on the Triangular Division. Do we?

2 of our 3 Brigades to make a fully functional WW2 Armoured Division analog. The 3rd Brigade as a Light Force.

I think we could get Force 2025 to this configuration in short order.

With, of course, the addition of the infantry ATGM and an NLOS system for the Arty.
 
But is there a need for a Brigade-sized light force, Kirkhill? The discussion I've seen in this thread can't even agree on whether or not there is a role for a single Light Bn in the CA.
 
I take very different view. My view is that the light brigade (or regiment or group - I'm not fashed about having a formed brigade with all the appurtenances and a defined mission) is available to to everything that the rest of the army can't do.

I would be quite content with an assemblage of well trained light companies available to reinforce LAVs, hold ports, provide security, take on anti-tank roles, assault over rough terrain, take on flank duties, establish defended localities,... release troops for training, conduct training, OMLTs, PRTs.... should I go on?

I can agree that the LAV guys can probably do a lot of this stuff but I would argue that there is a lot of this stuff that doesn't need LAVs and there is a lot more stuff to be done than there are LAVs available.

Most of the world is not accessible by road. That's where you will find the "bandits" of the world, the Bin Ladens et al, organizing. Up in the mountains, the caves, the deserts, the jungles, the swamps and the islands. Those are the places where you need light troops. Troops that can be deployed by whatever transport is available. They are going to do their fighting on their feet a long way from home.

And, again, I will agree that the LAV guys could do this, given time, but why not have troops on hand practicing for those eventualities so we don't have to waste time adapting to the situation.

Better a battalion in time than a division too late.

The problem, as I see it, is that we are used to building a solution for a clearly defined problem.

I argue the need is there for a Just In Case force. An adaptable force.

That force can't hang around long. It needs to be removed, reinforced or replaced. But in the time that it is on the ground it is permitting follow on forces, like the LAV troops, to reorganize and adjust there efforts to meet the demands of the situation on the ground.

Go ahead, Fill all the LAVs you have with number of troops allocated to the infantry. Give me the 1000 or so that will be left over and organize them into standard platoons that fit in the back of 4 LAVs (Not the crews - those three will remain LAV specialists) But with a standard platoon of 24 organized into 3x 6 man sections and a 6 man HQ section that body of troops could be organized to backfill LAV casualties, operate independently or as companies or battalions.

1000 troops equals something like 40x 24 man platoons of adaptable, just in case forces.
 
There are lots of things that can (and should) be done given enough time. My thoughts above are limited to the Force 2025 (3-1/2 year) and Force 2030 (8-1/2 year) time frames.

I think that consolidating 3 Battalions of infantry, modernizing and concentrating our tanks, purchasing and integrating AGTMs, a self-propelled artillery system, a SHORAD capability and possibly loitering munitions (including developing our doctrine, training systems, etc.), and completely re-aligning and re-grouping our Reserve forces is a fair bit to bite off in that time frame. Never mind all the changes that will be going on in both the RCN and RCAF during that same time frame.

Going beyond to Force 2035, etc. I agree that more changes should follow. But in the short term let's fix our cracked and leaky foundation then we can look at putting on that nice, new addition!
It takes a long time to turn a force around. Our last transformation essentially aimed at 20 years which I thought was too long but was probably needed to cater to the inordinately long time our procurement cycles work at (and let's face it we're not even there yet although we pretend to be).

I think we need to look beyond 2030 to ensure that what we do in 2025 and 2030 defines the capabilities we should be aiming towards, facilitates the ongoing transformation, and doesn't hinder us with restricted numbers of people or dead-end organizational structures. If, for example, we lose a full-time brigade we not only lose a necessary deployable headquarters but a formation that we will in all probability never see again. I'd rather see a battalion or two reduced to a headquarters and one full-time company with the other companies designated to be filled by reservists rather than the entire battalion being lost and redistributed. That way at least you keep one very valuable bn headquarters for employment and/or rotations. While I tend to advocate strongly for the consolidation of administrative headquarters (like our divisions and reserve brigades) I'm also a proponent of keeping and even increasing all operational field headquarters even if some of the field units need to become hollow or hybrid full/part-time units.

One of my concerns is the fixing of the training system and that we do not do so in a way that will significantly restrict what we can do in the field force later. Fix the training system we must, but not in a way that cripples our ability to deploy and sustain units. Our administrative overhead has already impacted our defence outputs for a long time. We have to guard against any further negative impacts.

🍻
 
OK...keep your 3rd (Light) battalion HQ and a single Company for each Regiment. That still frees up two infantry companies and a CS company to beef up our Mech Battalions in each Regiment.

That gives Kirkhill his three Reg Force Light Companies to play with :cool: and fill the rest of the Battalion with Reserve Regiments (Companies). We have enough Reserve infantry units that you could have five or six or eight Companies in the Light Battalion or a 4th all-Reserve Battalion for each Regiment. The rest of the Reserve Regiments can pair up with a Reg Force LAV Company to provide a Platoon of Augmentees to each and then still have a full Reserve Brigade Group in Ontario.
 
For reference - attached is a worksheet that I recently prepared.

It is based on the numbers and ranks anticipated in the 2013 force review. This is for one of the three regiments.

It starts from the premise of there being 9 Lt Cols of Infantry with 9 CWOs, three of each per regiment.

It proceeds to incorporate the 7 Majors and 7 MWOs allocated to each Lt Col. etc.

The only additional body is the Regimental Colonel. Lts (SN) are supernumerary's held at Regiment.

Based on the numbers available, there are lots of Captains and few Privates, then each Captain essentially gets a small platoon under command. 24 all ranks including himself. Lts are trainees and assistants.

But the first thing I did was take all the 45 LAVs allocated to each LAV battalion, excluding the CO/DCO, and filled them with their 135 crewmembers (3 per vehicle). That leaves 7seats in the back, 6 and a spare. A group of 4 carries a 24 man platoon.

I know the LAV guys like that association to be permanent at the section level. That's fine. It's not the way that I would do it but so what. Nobody does things the way I like - especially my wife and kids. The important part is the allocation of numbers.

According to the way I have allocated the troops the LAVs get 45 vehicles with 6 man sections. They also get a recce and a pioneer platoon. They don't get an MG platoon, a Mortar platoon or a Transport platoon.

I figure they have got 45 2.5 tonne trucks for carrying the gear that a conventional infantry battalion would carry on its wheels. The LAV battalion rides and fights on its wheels.

The transport platoon in the LAV battalion is function that doesn't exist in the light infantry battalion. The light infantry battalion's transport platoon is to make up the difference between the 60 lbs on each man's back and the rest of the kit that the battalion owns. 9 men in a LAV with the same 60 lbs only take up 540 of the 5000 lb load carrying capacity available in the LAV.

In the Lt Battalion I have grouped the Transport platoon with the MG/DFS and Mortar platoons thus combining the functions that I see the LAV filling - transport and fire support. The primary role of the transport platoon is to transport ammunition (bullets and bombs), defence stores, rations and troops, in that order.

Each of the LAV battalions uses 464 of the PYs allocated to the Infantry Corps for its Regiments. The remaining PYs are enough for 3 battalions without LAVs, structured with all the required capabilities of an infantry battalion, with 401 infantry PYs each.

HQ, Recce, Pnr, 9x Rifle, MG, Mor, Tpt. All tailored to fit into the back of LAVs if necessary, or CH-146s. Each of the Brigades has a Squadron of Griffons - 16 helos with 6 men each equals a company of 96 troops.

Sigs, Log, Rats, Meds, Maint are attached from other branches according to current norms.

No changes in external structures. No changes in internal structures. Just reallocation of the available troops to fill the gaps.
 

Attachments

The subsequent plan to obtain IFVs was also accepted by the Government albeit subsequently killed by the Army itself.
Because the LAV 6 upgrade essentially made that entire program redundant. The LAV is an IFV that people seem to ignore because it doesn't have tracks.

In a weird way, GDLS won the competition in the end. They were bidding the Piranha 5 as an option. Nexter was putting up another 8x8 VBCI and The CV90 was bid by BAE. The LAV 6 is basically a Piranha 5. So all of the army's LAV's were converted to one of the bidders. For cheaper than the actual project was going to cost.
 
Because the LAV 6 upgrade essentially made that entire program redundant. The LAV is an IFV that people seem to ignore because it doesn't have tracks.

In a weird way, GDLS won the competition in the end. They were bidding the Piranha 5 as an option. Nexter was putting up another 8x8 VBCI and The CV90 was bid by BAE. The LAV 6 is basically a Piranha 5. So all of the army's LAV's were converted to one of the bidders. For cheaper than the actual project was going to cost.
Kinda but I think they just didn't have the money or the force structure for it anyways. In my mind tracks have to be better but a dozer operator of mine told me how he once watched a wheeled komatsu dozer push and pull a Cat D11 any which way it wanted. What does an IFV really need to separate itself in my mind it would need better protection than the LAV 6 but that doesn't necessarily need to come from the added weight of more armour does it?

The LAV 6 is to the LAV 700 is what the LAV 700 is to the Piranha 5 I think. So theres still a fair difference, I think the LAV 700 is using the Piranha 5's suspension
 

Attachments

  • lav3lpiranha.jpg
    lav3lpiranha.jpg
    49.4 KB · Views: 10
Back
Top