Is it time to list ANTIFA as a criminal or terrorist organization?

[Jarnhamar]

I’m not trying to paint them as victims at all. Antifa don’t claim to be non-violent, their preferred methods are ordinary protests, doxxing and other forms of digital protests. they actually said they will use violence if the situation justifies it…such as, among other things, when they are attacked

I'm having difficulty seeing your point. Maybe it's just going over my head but it feels like your're underselling how aggressive antifa can be. They don’t just wait to be attacked, actively seek confrontation, vandalize property, and use intimidation against people they oppose.

Even if it’s not on the scale of groups like the Proud Boys (I don't really see or hear anything from them), antifa’s willingness to justify violence whenever they feel it’s ‘necessary’ makes them more than just a protest movement. Antifa normalizes political violence just the same. It's very easy to find random videos of antifa protestors instigating violence against people.

Antifa gangs have the same energy as Islamic attacking people because someone in the back of the crowd accused a person of burning the Quran.

 

[Genetk44]

I'm having difficulty seeing your point. Maybe it's just going over my head but it feels like your're underselling how aggressive antifa can be. They don’t just wait to be attacked, actively seek confrontation, vandalize property, and use intimidation against people they oppose.

Even if it’s not on the scale of groups like the Proud Boys (I don't really see or hear anything from them), antifa’s willingness to justify violence whenever they feel it’s ‘necessary’ makes them more than just a protest movement. Antifa normalizes political violence just the same. It's very easy to find random videos of antifa protestors instigating violence against people.

Antifa gangs have the same energy as Islamic attacking people because someone in the back of the crowd accused a person of burning

I'm having difficulty seeing your point. Maybe it's just going over my head but it feels like your're underselling how aggressive antifa can be. They don’t just wait to be attacked, actively seek confrontation, vandalize property, and use intimidation against people they oppose.

Even if it’s not on the scale of groups like the Proud Boys (I don't really see or hear anything from them), antifa’s willingness to justify violence whenever they feel it’s ‘necessary’ makes them more than just a protest movement. Antifa normalizes political violence just the same. It's very easy to find random videos of antifa protestors instigating violence against people.

Antifa gangs have the same energy as Islamic attacking people because someone in the back of the crowd accused a person of burning the Quran.

My point is that while Antifa are not all kumbya, sandal-wearing anti-nazi,anti-racism non-violent protestors neither are they the violent rabid mad-dogs that those on the right want to paint as terrorists. Most of us get our info from curated news soundbites put out by our preferred media outlets and from various social media posts again from our preferred social media outlets…..so our views on groups like Antifa or Proud Boys get aligned to what we see on those outlets. Unfortunately the great majority of people go no further than that, while only a minority do dig deeper that just news media and social media and try to do some real unbiased research.

 

[Jarnhamar]

But they act and behave like the definition of terrorists conducting terrorism.

They're not placed on a terrorist entity list because they lack structure and official organization.

 

[Lumber]

The problem I have with the decision by POTUS to brand them as terrorists is the same problem that I have with Antifa itself; who gets to decide who is fascist, and who gets to decide who is Antifa?

For the former, I've seen "anti-fascists" (not necessarily self-described members of Antifa) describe a fascist as everything from a neo-nazis to someone who agrees with any of Trumps policies. There was even a meme at one point, "Have you punched a Nazis today?". I wouldn't be upset if I heard of someone punching a neo-Nazi, but what about punching someone who was just advocating for a reduction in immigration quotas?

On the latter, there are those who parade around in shirts wearing the commonly used Antifa logo and waving the same logo on a flag. Ok, even if Antifa isn't a formal group, you couldn't definitely point to those people and say "they are Antifa". But what about someone who has no affiliation with any political activistic group, but joins a counter-protest against a group of people advocating for the forced expulsion of recent immigrants? Is that person "Antifa"? What if during the demonstration they get into a scuffle with one of the anti-immigration activists? Does their becoming violent now make them "Antifa"? I guess I'd have to ask @ArmyRick...

 

[brihard]

The problem I have with the decision by POTUS to brand them as terrorists is the same problem that I have with Antifa itself; who gets to decide who is fascist, and who gets to decide who is Antifa?

For the former, I've seen "anti-fascists" (not necessarily self-described members of Antifa) describe a fascist as everything from a neo-nazis to someone who agrees with any of Trumps policies. There was even a meme at one point, "Have you punched a Nazis today?". I wouldn't be upset if I heard of someone punching a neo-Nazi, but what about punching someone who was just advocating for a reduction in immigration quotas?

On the latter, there are those who parade around in shirts wearing the commonly used Antifa logo and waving the same logo on a flag. Ok, even if Antifa isn't a formal group, you couldn't definitely point to those people and say "they are Antifa". But what about someone who has no affiliation with any political activistic group, but joins a counter-protest against a group of people advocating for the forced expulsion of recent immigrants? Is that person "Antifa"? What if during the demonstration they get into a scuffle with one of the anti-immigration activists? Does their becoming violent now make them "Antifa"? I guess I'd have to ask @ArmyRick...

I’m perplexed by Trump’s announcement. I’m not sure what “designating” Antifa as a “major terrorist organization” actually means. Unlike Canada, with our terrorist entity listing process, the U.S. does not (to the best of my knowledge) have any mechanism for formally designating domestic groups as terrorist organizations, major or otherwise. I understand it to be a First Amendment free speech issue. So, all of our discussion here about the merits of any such designation notwithstanding, in the U.S. there’s a much more fundamental issue of what law do they purport to do that under? Kinda has a “Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy” feel to it right now.

 

[Genetk44]

But they act and behave like the definition of terrorists conducting terrorism.

They're not placed on a terrorist entity list because they lack structure and official organization.

You have a very low bar of what meets the definition of a terrorist group.
In my opinion they are not anywhere close to meeting the threshold of being a terrorist group.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Actually Antifa generally tries to avoid using violence….but that does not mean they absolutely never use violence. Various Antifa spokespersons do acknowledge the use of violence especially when violently attacked. Meanwhile the Right has made the very amorphous Antifa into this huge evil, boogeyman by constantly calling it terrorist,violent and communist, to frighten the general undecided public. Pretty similar to what they have done to Soros, Gates the Rothschilds et al.
And meanwhile the undoubted biggest threat to modern western democracy was not perpetrated by Antifa,the Left or any of those people it was caused on January 6th by the"The Proud Boys"; The Oath Keepers, White Nationalists hardcore Maga supporters and other right-wing organizations.

And now Trump has pulled out "The Proud Boys"; The Oath Keepers and White Nationalists out of the "terrorism" registry!

The people that attack ANTIFA are typically Law Enforcement. Are those Antifa leaders advocating violence against law enforcement?

You complain that the Right is unfair to Antifa, yet next paragraph you do the exactly same to the right. You're opinion is unqualified and biased. Just your opinion garnered, as you say, from your preferred social media.

The POTUS is in a much better position to make that decision. He has experts, intelligence and others actively working the file. You have your preferred social media. Don't be stacking your sandbags for the Sept 6 democrat fantasy trial. That investigation is far from over or proven. As an example, yesterday in Patel's Q&A, in front of the Senate, a democrat senator stated that over 100 Capitol police were beaten by the right on Sept 6.

You can have whatever opinion you want, but if you're going to simply flip the narrative from left to right, it makes your discussion weak and far from factual.

 

[Genetk44]

The people that attack ANTIFA are typically Law Enforcement. Are those Antifa leaders advocating violence against law enforcement?

You complain that the Right is unfair to Antifa, yet next paragraph you do the exactly same to the right. You're opinion is unqualified and biased. Just your opinion garnered, as you say, from your preferred social media.

The POTUS is in a much better position to make that decision. He has experts, intelligence and others actively working the file. You have your preferred social media. Don't be stacking your sandbags for the Sept 6 democrat fantasy trial. That investigation is far from over or proven. As an example, yesterday in Patel's Q&A, in front of the Senate, a democrat senator stated that over 100 Capitol police were beaten by the right on Sept 6.

You can have whatever opinion you want, but if you're going to simply flip the narrative from left to right, it makes your discussion weak and far from factual.

I assume rather than Sept 6. you were meaning January 6th when the US Capitol building was violently attacked, broken into and damaged? There is nothing to debate on that. The witness record,video records and audio records make very clear what happened or why.
This POTUS has proven over and over what he wants, the guy telegraphs his intentions and motives so you can see them coming a month in advance. As for your opinions on my position…..you’re making erroneous assumptions…..for subjects such as we are discussing here, I don’t use social media. I use the main news media, CTV,FOX,CNN and BBC to pick up news events….If I want to dig deeper in a particular news story or subject I search out reputable,non-partisan and verifiable documentation to clarify the situation.
The people that typically or most often attack any protesters, be they peaceful or violent, Antifa or Neo-Nazis, lefty or righty, pro or anti-government protestors are the police, you are correct. Police typically use force to disperse protestors….and very often those protestors fight back. The police aren’t always the good guys in these situations unfortunately.

 

[Navy_Pete]

I’m perplexed by Trump’s announcement. I’m not sure what “designating” Antifa as a “major terrorist organization” actually means. Unlike Canada, with our terrorist entity listing process, the U.S. does not (to the best of my knowledge) have any mechanism for formally designating domestic groups as terrorist organizations, major or otherwise. I understand it to be a First Amendment free speech issue. So, all of our discussion here about the merits of any such designation notwithstanding, in the U.S. there’s a much more fundamental issue of what law do they purport to do that under? Kinda has a “Michael Scott declaring bankruptcy” feel to it right now.

Well the are using it as justification for blowing up a boat full of people they claim are part of Tren de Aragua instead of arresting, them, so based on their actions to date, think ignoring fundamental rights, extrajudicial actions and otherwise ignoring basic rights and Constitutional protections, as well as dumping them in torture camps isn't outside the realm of the possible.

They have repeatedly called people gang members and deported them to 3rd countries with zero proof (or ignoring proof they aren't) so as long as their side buys the narrative why wouldn't they simply expand the scope, especially now that ICE is bigger then the FBI (who is run by a completely unqualified conspiracy theory podcaster).

 

[ArmyRick]

Not that I agree with everything the orange haired orantuan does but some things he gets right

https://www.cnn.com/2025/09/17/politics/antifa-terrorist-designation-trump

 

[RangerRay]

The POTUS is in a much better position to make that decision. He has experts, intelligence and others actively working the file.

No he doesn’t. He purged all of the experts and replaced them with loyalist hacks.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I assume rather than Sept 6. you were meaning January 6th when the US Capitol building was violently attacked, broken into and damaged? There is nothing to debate on that. The witness record,video records and audio records make very clear what happened or why.
This POTUS has proven over and over what he wants, the guy telegraphs his intentions and motives so you can see them coming a month in advance. As for your opinions on my position…..you’re making erroneous assumptions…..for subjects such as we are discussing here, I don’t use social media. I use the main news media, CTV,FOX,CNN and BBC to pick up news events….If I want to dig deeper in a particular news story or subject I search out reputable,non-partisan and verifiable documentation to clarify the situation.
The people that typically or most often attack any protesters, be they peaceful or violent, Antifa or Neo-Nazis, lefty or righty, pro or anti-government protestors are the police, you are correct. Police typically use force to disperse protestors….and very often those protestors fight back. The police aren’t always the good guys in these situations unfortunately.

Yes Jan 6. Brain fart.
As for the rest, the info you base your opinion on is flawed. I'm not going to redebate it, we already have a thread. Needless to say, if you aren’t willing to look beyond the MSM, Democrat narrative, you are missing large parts of the story.

I see you missed the CBC. CTV bought and paid for liberal propaganda outlet. FOX a hard right narrative, CNN seriously? BBC is hard to nail down. It seems to depend on the day.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

No he doesn’t. He purged all of the experts and replaced them with loyalist hacks.

You mean like obama and biden weaponizing the 3 letter agencies?

Meh, opinions

 

[Genetk44]

Yes Jan 6. Brain fart.
As for the rest, the info you base your opinion on is flawed. I'm not going to redebate it, we already have a thread. Needless to say, if you aren’t willing to look beyond the MSM, Democrat narrative, you are missing large parts of the story.

I see you missed the CBC. CTV bought and paid for liberal propaganda outlet. FOX a hard right narrative, CNN seriously? BBC is hard to nail down. It seems to depend on the day.

Then please by all means direct me to the thread so I can inform myself. Ah so MSM is all Democrat narrative? And then two sentences later you call Fox a hard right narrative... you seem confused. Pretty much everything you said about the news services I mentioned is just a repeat of all the worn out MAGA right wing conspiracy accusations. And you chose to ignore the fact that I try to get a broad, across the spectrum picture by watching everything from hard right to left and everything in between. I do watch CBC but I prefer my local CTV station, it has a better format.

 

[Brad Sallows]

I guess the real question is what is antifa. I have to see any actual evidence, beyond some new services reporting all left wing protestors as antifa, that anything resembling an organized group called Antifa exists.

When people show up equipped to riot, particularly with printed signs and things to throw, there's usually coordination beforehand. There are a few things like that to look for. There are, of course, people who flat out claim to be "antifa", but that is a self-declared affiliation with an idea or movement, not a particular organization.

Regardless, the loose definition of terrorism at the least should be applied, particularly that there be violence with a political nexus.

Trying to designate "antifa" as an organization will be like nailing jello to a wall without documentation that shows collusion, but treating participants who fit "violent and political" as candidates for terrorist charges can be done without a designation.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Then please by all means direct me to the thread so I can inform myself. Ah so MSM is all Democrat narrative? And then two sentences later you call Fox a hard right narrative... you seem confused. Pretty much everything you said about the news services I mentioned is just a repeat of all the worn out MAGA right wing conspiracy accusations. And you chose to ignore the fact that I try to get a broad, across the spectrum picture by watching everything from hard right to left and everything in between. I do watch CBC but I prefer my local CTV station, it has a better format.

Go to Ground News. https://ground.news/
It's all in one spot.

 

[Lumber]

Go to Ground News. https://ground.news/
It's all in one spot.

This is the single best reference/new source you have shared on this site. Ever.

I love it. Bookmarked.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

This is the single best reference/new source you have shared on this site. Ever.

I love it. Bookmarked.

I have shared it a number of times already. I think it's probably the single most educational news site out there.

 

[Lumber]

I have shared it a number of times already. I think it's probably the single most educational news site out there.

But, do you realize that what it does it just automate what most of us on this site already do? We'll check out the same story on numerous MSM sites to get a sense for how much of each version is just the facts and how much is sensationalism/bias.

Why is it then that when we say we use CNN/FOX/CBC, etc, you cry foul, but yet you laud this website which effectively does the same thing?

 

[Sprinting Thistle]

In fact, Antifa is a violent ideology. At its core violence is viewed as self-defense and many Antifa activists will argue that fascism is inherently violent and must be resisted directly. The slogan Antifa often uses is “By any means necessary.” so, they often narrate their actions, the street fights, the riots, the destruction of property, as preventive self-defense against fascist violence. They also reject pacifism and will often criticize purely peaceful protest as ineffective against fascists. They will argue that direct action, which includes force, has historically been necessary.