Liberal Minority Government 2021 - ????

[Remius]

an additional 6 months won't do a thing to change that. If (when) he walks back on his intent to vote non-confidence his party will bleed out whatever support he had to the extent that maybe even Manitoba would abandon him. Plus giving Trudeau's successor a chance to introduce legislation could be extremely risky. Right now, he might gain some support from the liberal side a few bread crumbs scattered by the new broom will definitely swing that support back.

Right it won’t. But they will stretch it out as long as it benefits them.

 

[ArmyRick]

But they will stretch it out as long as it benefits them

What benefit? They are only losing more supporters as time draws on. Yeah they can't afford an election right now however its only going to get worse. The support peaked while Trudeau was still in power. The polls are showing the NDP on a decline and the Liberals gaining it from them (not the CPC).
If Singh plays games on parliament's return, he will kill the NDP. They will gain nothing as the Liberals will take all the credit of any new bill added in (Carney is definitely much smarter than Trudeau and will not hesitate to exploit Singh) .

Those very votes the NDP had accumulated as Trudeau fumbled, will be completely gone by fall.

 

[Lumber]

If you really think about it, Singh just might be the most patriotic and selfless Canadian political leader in a long time.

Consider, whether you agree or not, Jagmeet believes that a CPC government would be bad for Canada. He has, and has had for a long while now, the power to prevent that by propping up the LPC. However, doing so is costing him his political capital, and could eventually lose him his job, and long term reputation. Yet he still persists in preventing a CPC government.

So, looking at it from his position, he's fighting really hard and even sacrificing himself for the sake of Canada.

Good on you, Jagmeet.

 

[Remius]

What benefit? They are only losing more supporters as time draws on. Yeah they can't afford an election right now however its only going to get worse. The support peaked while Trudeau was still in power. The polls are showing the NDP on a decline and the Liberals gaining it from them (not the CPC).

They likely don’t see it that way. They could be looking at it from a time perspective. 6 more months to fundraise. They may also be biding their time hoping someone like Carmey might flub or eff up. More time there means more chances that could happen. Also might be banking on the CPCs attempt to paint Carmey as an elite insider banker type thinking it could attract some socialists back. While they are picking up some NDP support the LPC also seem to be slowly getting a small amount from the CPC. Both though may just be fed liberal supporters that had left because of Trudeau.

If Singh plays games on parliament's return, he will kill the NDP. They will gain nothing as the Liberals will take all the credit of any new bill added in (Carney is definitely much smarter than Trudeau and will not hesitate to exploit Singh) .

Possible. It didn’t really work for them last year for sure. But they did get a lot of what they wanted done.

Those very votes the NDP had accumulated as Trudeau fumbled, will be completely gone by fall.

I think that is very possible. Maybe sooner.

 

[Remius]

If you really think about it, Singh just might be the most patriotic and selfless Canadian political leader in a long time.

Consider, whether you agree or not, Jagmeet believes that a CPC government would be bad for Canada. He has, and has had for a long while now, the power to prevent that by propping up the LPC. However, doing so is costing him his political capital, and could eventually lose him his job, and long term reputation. Yet he still persists in preventing a CPC government.

So, looking at it from his position, he's fighting really hard and even sacrificing himself for the sake of Canada.

Good on you, Jagmeet.

And maybe if the CPC learned to play nice with the other parties, they could have assembled a coalition to defeat the LPC sooner.

Instead it’s insults and demanding letters. I can totally see why Singh would tell PP to take a hike.

 

[Halifax Tar]

If you really think about it, Singh just might be the most patriotic and selfless Canadian political leader in a long time.

Consider, whether you agree or not, Jagmeet believes that a CPC government would be bad for Canada. He has, and has had for a long while now, the power to prevent that by propping up the LPC. However, doing so is costing him his political capital, and could eventually lose him his job, and long term reputation. Yet he still persists in preventing a CPC government.

So, looking at it from his position, he's fighting really hard and even sacrificing himself for the sake of Canada.

Good on you, Jagmeet.

I would say that sentiment is definitely in the minority; if NDP polling numbers are to be believed, but you are correct there are always more than one way things can been seen.

 

[ArmyRick]

They likely don’t see it that way. They could be looking at it from a time perspective. 6 more months to fundraise. They may also be biding their time hoping someone like Carmey might flub or eff up. More time there means more chances that could happen. Also might be banking on the CPCs attempt to paint Carmey as an elite insider banker type thinking it could attract some socialists back. While they are picking up some NDP support the LPC also seem to be slowly getting a small amount from the CPC. Both though may just be fed liberal supporters that had left because of Trudeau.

Possible. It didn’t really work for them last year for sure. But they did get a lot of what they wanted done.

I think that is very possible. Maybe sooner.

oddly enough, I think you may be right. The NDP seems to be relying on "hoping" things to happen. They need a real political strategist in that party who knows to strike when the iron is hot.

 

[QV]

If you really think about it, Singh just might be the most patriotic and selfless Canadian political leader in a long time.

Consider, whether you agree or not, Jagmeet believes that a CPC government would be bad for Canada. He has, and has had for a long while now, the power to prevent that by propping up the LPC. However, doing so is costing him his political capital, and could eventually lose him his job, and long term reputation. Yet he still persists in preventing a CPC government.

So, looking at it from his position, he's fighting really hard and even sacrificing himself for the sake of Canada.

Good on you, Jagmeet.

What he believes and what the majority of Canadians believe seem to be divergent. He is not fighting for Canadians, he's fighting for himself.

 

[Remius]

What he believes and what the majority of Canadians believe seem to be divergent. He is not fighting for Canadians, he's fighting for himself.

There certainly seems to be a lot of self before country going around.

 

[Lumber]

What he believes and what the majority of Canadians believe seem to be divergent. He is not fighting for Canadians, he's fighting for himself.

I agree with the first part. I'm not sure no fan of him. But if everything else about him is true, and that is decisions are leading both his party and himself into calamity, how is this "for himself"?

 

[brihard]

oddly enough, I think you may be right. The NDP seems to be relying on "hoping" things to happen. They need a real political strategist in that party who knows to strike when the iron is hot.

Strike what, exactly? Why do you continue to think it’s to the NDP’s advantage to trigger events that in short order inevitably (at the moment) lead to a CPC majority?

 

[QV]

I agree with the first part. I'm not sure no fan of him. But if everything else about him is true, and that is decisions are leading both his party and himself into calamity, how is this "for himself"?

How is it "for country" if it continues to lead the country into calamity?

He may think he's doing the country good, but he's wrong. And his failure to recognize that likely has much to do with ego and a lack of self reflection. The only benefit for him that I can see is extending his time as leader of the NDP and as a sitting parliamentarian, while gaining what little concessions the current government tosses their way. I think they (LPC/NDP) are hoping and praying for a major event that will turn the polls around and the longer they can drag this out the better.

 

[ArmyRick]

Strike what, exactly? Why do you continue to think it’s to the NDP’s advantage to trigger events that in short order inevitably (at the moment) lead to a CPC majority?

And what position could the NDP have had? They could have formed the leader of the opposition a few months ago. That would be a big step forward.
What do they gain by keeping the LPC in power? Nothing but losing constituents. Delaying the CPC from gaining a majority by sinking your own party? That is stupid beyond belief. Now they have dicked around and wasted time half assed standing up to the LPC but not really and the results? Trudeau gone (Trudeau as PM was their best gift coming into the next election) and most likely Carney will take over (He is FAR more craftier and strategic thinking than Trudeau and he will in my opinion, snatch up the votes the NDP could of had).

If you didn't see the opportunity they missed, I can't help you. Hell even Vassy K. asked them over and over why they keep propping up the dead LPC.

 

[ArmyRick]

I think they (LPC/NDP) are hoping and praying for a major event that will turn the polls around and the longer they can drag this out the better.

Kind of like when Bart Simpson prayed to god in the middle of June for a snow storm or anything to avoid taking the final exam.

 

[Remius]

And what position could the NDP have had? They could have formed the leader of the opposition a few months ago. That would be a big step forward.

To what end though? What sort of legislation can they get passed with a CPC Majority being in opposition? They get to influence the government, and have a bigger say on committees with a minority liberal gvt. In short they can influence way more in the position they are in than if the CPC were in power. There is also the risk that they would not be forming official opposition at all. And maybe that is what their interbank polling was saying.

What do they gain by keeping the LPC in power?

See above.

Nothing but losing constituents. Delaying the CPC from gaining a majority by sinking your own party? That is stupid beyond belief.

Maybe a CPC majority scares them more than an LPC one.

Now they have dicked around and wasted time half assed standing up to the LPC but not really and the results? Trudeau gone (Trudeau as PM was their best gift coming into the next election) and most likely Carney will take over (He is FAR more craftier and strategic thinking than Trudeau and he will in my opinion, snatch up the votes the NDP could of had).

If you didn't see the opportunity they missed, I can't help you. Hell even Vassy K. asked them over and over why they keep propping up the dead LPC.

Asking why is definitely legit.

 

[ArmyRick]

To what end though? What sort of legislation can they get passed with a CPC Majority being in opposition? They get to influence the government, and have a bigger say on committees with a minority liberal gvt.

What did they influence? Partial dental coverage (thats all it is) for about 1 million Canadians? $10 a day child care? Yeah and watching day cares close down or totally step away from that shit heap. Free medicare? OK, some people get coverage on diabetes medication and some will get coverage on some forms of birth control.

The Canadian people aren't "YAY NDP!" over this. If they were, they wouldn't be plummeting down in the polls. I said it before and I will say it again (Not angry or enraged), the NDP singed their own death warrant by not calling an election last year. Whats the point of keeping the LPC in power for any reason when their is a serious risk they don't exist after the next election?

Piss off the voters and you pay for it at the polls

Ontario Liberals found out in 2018
Ignatieff Liberals found out in 2011
Mulroney/Campbell Conservatives found out in 1993.

Maybe Jagmeet Singh should study political history a bit.

 

[ArmyRick]

Anymore discussion on this, lets take it to the Jagmeet Singh thread.

 

[Remius]

What did they influence? Partial dental coverage (thats all it is) for about 1 million Canadians? $10 a day child care? Yeah and watching day cares close down or totally step away from that shit heap. Free medicare? OK, some people get coverage on diabetes medication and some will get coverage on some forms of birth control.

From an NDP perspective those are relatively big things they have pushed for decades.

The Canadian people aren't "YAY NDP!" over this. If they were, they wouldn't be plummeting down in the polls.

Never said they were.

I said it before and I will say it again (Not angry or enraged), the NDP singed their own death warrant by not calling an election last year. Whats the point of keeping the LPC in power for any reason when there is a serious risk they don't exist after the next election?

It’s possible, I think though we might be seeing a realignment on the left and center left. I would not be surprised if we saw an eventual merge. My guess is they will lose seats but I doubt they get wiped out. Though small and limited they still have a very loyal base.

 

[YZT580]

To what end though? What sort of legislation can they get passed with a CPC Majority being in opposition? They get to influence the government, and have a bigger say on committees with a minority liberal gvt. In short they can influence way more in the position they are in than if the CPC were in power. There is also the risk that they would not be forming official opposition at all. And maybe that is what their interbank polling was saying.

See above.

Maybe a CPC majority scares them more than an LPC one.

Asking why is definitely legit.

have you thought of the time line? Parliament resumes in late March and rises for the summer in June. All the legislation that was before parliament is dead unless there is majority consent to bring it back to the table. Good luck with that in two months. When Parliament returns after the summer break it will have no more than a week or two including throne speech and its inevitable debate before an election must be called. No, if he carries on with this threat, he has written off the NDP

 

[Remius]

have you thought of the time line? Parliament resumes in late March and rises for the summer in June. All the legislation that was before parliament is dead unless there is majority consent to bring it back to the table. Good luck with that in two months. When Parliament returns after the summer break it will have no more than a week or two including throne speech and its inevitable debate before an election must be called. No, if he carries on with this threat, he has written off the NDP

As opposed to making the government fall last October when said legislation would die as well?

Like I said, it is likely a whole combination of stuff.

But I understand why conservatives are upset. Singh took away the chance to defeat the gvt when it was the right time for them. Singh clearly didn’t think it was right time for him and his party.