Liberal (Minority/Majority) Government 2025 - ???

[MilEME09]

Would be nice to see some movement on dealing with criminals like this.

Personally we I think we should just put them down. We put uncontrollable and violent dogs down, these criminals should be no different.

Build a dozen new prisons so we have the space to lock these people up. Im all for the death penalty is extreme cases, still gotta put them somewhere till you can do it though.

 

[ArmyRick]

Natures trends towards homeostatis, of course things change. But when we emit enough carbon in a couple hundred years to reach levels similar to what was found in the miocene epoch (400ish ppm) compared to the pre-industrial 280ish ppm - youre going to have some effects. These cycles you and Rick reference take hundreds of thousands, if not millions of years to chnage things, not a few human life spans.

One other thought to touch on - someone mentioned that concerns about atmospheric carbon are ridiculous since carbon is essential for life. Thats the wrong observation drawn from a true statement. The real issue is what kind of life is that good for? We evolved as a species in a period of global cool temperatures during the late pliocene, as did most extant mammals. Start rapidly reverting to the conditions from other epochs and a lot of nature probably cant keep up. I like a biodiverse world - probably not a bad thing to express caution when messing with natural systems we dont fully comprehend.

Volcanoes expel roughly 130 to 440 million metric tons of carbon into the atmosphere

Wild Fires expel roughly 2500 to 10,000 metric tons per 100 acre into the atmosphere

Everything with a set of lungs expels carbon dioxide every time they breath

When the ocean heats up, it off gases Carbon into the atmosphere (courtesy of the sun)

Just four examples right there.

How much carbon is sequestered through plant growth, ocean cooling, ocean plant growth, etc? No one knows for sure.

Again, it is hubris to blame man for every ounce of carbon in the atmosphere, and no one knows how much different the carbon level in the atmosphere would change if we waved a magic wand and made every single piece of man made technology that emits carbon disappear.

You still see rising and falling atmospheric carbon levels.

 

[ArmyRick]

This now the de facto climate change thread, here we go

For you alarmist, have a read at failed predictions, just a few

Doomsday Addiction: Celebrating 50 years of Failed Climate Predictions

Politicians, scientists, and celebs assure us the apocalypse is tomorrow, and if not, the day after will do. Buckle up for a look at 50 years of cataclysmic predictions.

www.agweb.com

Wrong Again: 50 Years of Failed Eco-pocalyptic Predictions - Competitive Enterprise Institute

Modern doomsayers have been predicting climate and environmental disaster since the 1960s. They continue to do so today. None of the apocalyptic predictions with due dates as of today have come true. What follows is a collection of notably wild predictions from notable people in government and...

cei.org

Many climate change scientists do not agree that global warming is happening - PMC

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Lets get to the bottom line that you ALARMIST are getting before you find your "experts" and "stats" to disagree with me.

What energy alternatives do you propose? Seems you folks want to shit all over oil and gas. Even if Canada has some of the greenest oil on the planet.

Why are you guys against nuclear energy?

Solar and wind are not going to cut it by a long shot. And EVs without government subsidies are going to only be a small niche thing in Canada.

Lets hear it, what are your energy proposals? Or do you seek to drive people out of Canada?

 

[suffolkowner]

This now the de facto climate change thread, here we go

For you alarmist, have a read at failed predictions, just a few

Doomsday Addiction: Celebrating 50 years of Failed Climate Predictions

Politicians, scientists, and celebs assure us the apocalypse is tomorrow, and if not, the day after will do. Buckle up for a look at 50 years of cataclysmic predictions.

www.agweb.com

Wrong Again: 50 Years of Failed Eco-pocalyptic Predictions - Competitive Enterprise Institute

Modern doomsayers have been predicting climate and environmental disaster since the 1960s. They continue to do so today. None of the apocalyptic predictions with due dates as of today have come true. What follows is a collection of notably wild predictions from notable people in government and...

cei.org

Many climate change scientists do not agree that global warming is happening - PMC

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Lets get to the bottom line that you ALARMIST are getting before you find your "experts" and "stats" to disagree with me.

What energy alternatives do you propose? Seems you folks want to shit all over oil and gas. Even if Canada has some of the greenest oil on the planet.

Why are you guys against nuclear energy?

Solar and wind are not going to cut it by a long shot. And EVs without government subsidies are going to only be a small niche thing in Canada.

Lets hear it, what are your energy proposals? Or do you seek to drive people out of Canada?

does anyone need to? Science can be separate from policy
for something to be true does not mean that something need or ought to be done about it

 

[mariomike]

Im all for the death penalty is extreme cases, still gotta put them somewhere till you can do it though.

Shouldn't take too long.

The last executions in Canada were back-to-back at the Don, same year as the murders occurred.

 

[PrairieFella]

Volcanoes expel roughly 130 to 440 million metric tons of carbon into the atmosphere

Cool - we're emitting that weekly.

EDGAR - The Emissions Database for Global Atmospheric Research

edgar.jrc.ec.europa.eu

Wild Fires expel roughly 2500 to 10,000 metric tons per 100 acre into the atmosphere

Everything with a set of lungs expels carbon dioxide every time they breath

Yes and?

When the ocean heats up, it off gases Carbon into the atmosphere (courtesy of the sun)

CO2 is not a product of water warming up? H2O splits into H2 and O2. Unless youre referring to increased energy levels in the water dissolving minerals more rapidly that are settled on the seafloor.

Just four examples right there.

How much carbon is sequestered through plant growth, ocean cooling, ocean plant growth, etc? No one knows for sure.

Correct - not enough to offset growth in emissions.

Again, it is hubris to blame man for every ounce of carbon in the atmosphere, and no one knows how much different the carbon level in the atmosphere would change if we waved a magic wand and made every single piece of man made technology that emits carbon disappear.

Also correct. Didnt say it was. But using your volcano rebuttal - volcanoes arent erupting 24/7 365 in every country on Earth. Its also hubris to claim we're having no effect on natural climate systems.

You still see rising and falling atmospheric carbon levels.

Where do you see falling carbon levels? Year over year its been increasing since the industrial revolution. We can see that in ice cores. Certainly isnt 280 anymore like would have been in 1500 as an example. Its not Its not 350 like it was in 1988. Its not 400 like it was in 2016. Its expected to hit 450 in 2032. Pretty much a consistent increase YoY.



Im all in on nuclear btw - its good baseload and renewables are fantastic for spikes. The Chinese realized this and their renewals are kicking the collective west in the ass. I see no reason molten salt or pumped hydro cant act as a battery for renewable generation as examples.

 

[suffolkowner]

the oceans are absorbing CO2 not off gassing

 

[ArmyRick]

the oceans are absorbing CO2 not off gassing

Yes, the ocean can off-gas carbon dioxide. This exchange operates like a giant soda can: when the partial pressure of \(CO_{2}\) in the atmosphere is higher than that in the water, the ocean absorbs carbon. If the atmospheric concentration drops below the ocean's levels, the water will release (or off-gas) \(CO_{2}\) back into the air. [1, 2]

How the Process Works:

• Natural Exchange: The transfer happens through simple molecular diffusion at the surface. It is a continuous "inhale and exhale" driven by temperature and local concentration gradients. [1, 2]
• Temperature Matters: Colder waters dissolve and hold more gas, making high-latitude oceans (like those in the North Atlantic) giant carbon sinks. Conversely, as surface waters warm in tropical regions, their capacity to hold \(CO_{2}\) decreases, frequently leading to localized off-gassing. [1, 2, 3, 4]
• The Current Crisis: While localized off-gassing occurs, overall, the oceans are currently acting as a massive net sink, absorbing about 25-30% of human-driven \(CO_{2}\) emissions. This excess carbon absorption is driving severe, making the oceans roughly 30% more acidic than they were at the start of the industrial era. [1, 2, 3]

 

[ArmyRick]

Im all in on nuclear btw - its good baseload and renewables are fantastic for spikes. The Chinese realized this and their renewals are kicking the collective west in the ass. I see no reason molten salt or pumped hydro cant act as a battery for renewable generation as examples.

Glad your all in on nuclear. However many of your green zealot allies are dead against it.

Solar is awesome to augment and supplement power. I run all my electrical fences on solar powered chargers for example and it works great.

However there is great length discussion about solar and wind, its strengths and limitations.

You would not use a tiny smart car to haul 10,000 lbs of gravel, you use a dump truck. Right tool for the job.

The solar and wind is being forced to be a "dump truck" in energy production when it is not.

 

[suffolkowner]

Yes, the ocean can off-gas carbon dioxide. This exchange operates like a giant soda can: when the partial pressure of \(CO_{2}\) in the atmosphere is higher than that in the water, the ocean absorbs carbon. If the atmospheric concentration drops below the ocean's levels, the water will release (or off-gas) \(CO_{2}\) back into the air. [1, 2]

How the Process Works:

• Natural Exchange: The transfer happens through simple molecular diffusion at the surface. It is a continuous "inhale and exhale" driven by temperature and local concentration gradients. [1, 2]
• Temperature Matters: Colder waters dissolve and hold more gas, making high-latitude oceans (like those in the North Atlantic) giant carbon sinks. Conversely, as surface waters warm in tropical regions, their capacity to hold \(CO_{2}\) decreases, frequently leading to localized off-gassing. [1, 2, 3, 4]
• The Current Crisis: While localized off-gassing occurs, overall, the oceans are currently acting as a massive net sink, absorbing about 25-30% of human-driven \(CO_{2}\) emissions. This excess carbon absorption is driving severe, making the oceans roughly 30% more acidic than they were at the start of the industrial era. [1, 2, 3]

the ocean absorbs a net 2.6 gigatonnes of carbon a year

 

[ArmyRick]

Green zealots, I ask again, we need the so what

Lets hear it, what are your energy proposals? Or do you seek to drive people out of Canada?

ENERGY. We have to discuss
-Transportation, transportation and transportation. Fine for Bobby and Sue Berkenstock to drive their solar powered car from one end of TO to the other, but we move food, material and people in mass daily.
-Heating. Heat pumps are not viable in many, many part of Canada
-Infrastructure such as hospitals, jails, schools, buildings, etc. need massive amounts of energy.

Nuclear is certainly a big key but I see oil and gas going NOWHERE

 

[ArmyRick]

the ocean absorbs a net 2.6 gigatonnes of carbon a year

Don't look now, but your hyper focusing on details. Go ahead if you want, but lets be real and discuss big picture and real world practical path forward.

 

[suffolkowner]

Don't look now, but your hyper focusing on details. Go ahead if you want, but lets be real and discuss big picture and real world practical path forward.

thats literally the big picture

 

[RangerRay]

And your pocket book these days...

It’s so depressing that I have a good job and can’t afford to buy a good steak to put on the grill.

 

[ArmyRick]

It’s so depressing that I have a good job and can’t afford to buy a good steak to put on the grill.

I end up trading a lot of beef (since many people can't afford it and my prices are now lower than stores) for help on the farm.

 

[ArmyRick]

thats literally the big picture

No, its not.

How does modern society function? Live? Exists? Sustain itself?

Or are you going to sit there lecturing the world how we need all oil and gas and basically modern technology is bad, and humans can suffer without it?

 

[suffolkowner]

No, its not.

How does modern society function? Live? Exists? Sustain itself?

Or are you going to sit there lecturing the world how we need all oil and gas and basically modern technology is bad, and humans can suffer without it?

seems like another strawman

 

[ArmyRick]

seems like another strawman

Or we can actually get to the bottom line, brass tax.

So lets hear it. It aint a strawman argument.

How does society function? We are sick of complainers (especially when much of it is not factual or only partly based in facts). Results? Lets hear it.

 

[suffolkowner]

Or we can actually get to the bottom line, brass tax.

So lets hear it. It aint a strawman argument.

How does society function? We are sick of complainers (especially when much of it is not factual or only partly based in facts). Results? Lets hear it.

what specific problem are you trying to identify and solve?

 

[ArmyRick]

Let me steer this back to current Liberal government

ENOUGH of the "climate action" (half assed or all the way), "net zero" will not move our products or people,

We need nuclear, we need oil and gas and at this point, we still need coal (China still buying lots from us).

Hydro is some parts is also an excellent energy source

Solar and wind, is good to supplement and augment but is not base load