Operational Service Medals?

[teenwolf]

The OSM-Exp is listed on my MPRR, but I haven't physically received the medal yet.

 

[misratah500]

No one I know has been issued that medal physically yet. Same goes with the Libyan operation medal. They still haven't decided on that yet. I was told there is a delay in the OSM's. And if I was a betting man I would say the delay is that the mint is too busy minting 60000 queens diamond jubilee medals.

So far they have managed to decorate Gen Bouchard three times for his work but have yet to recognize the crews of Charlottetown, Vancouver or the aiwring. The good General has recieved the Meritorious Service Cross, Legion of Merit (US), and he will get the Order of Canada. jeez. And whatever medal they decide to give out for op mobile. That's four medals in the year he retires. Hell they will probably throw him a QDJM just for the hell foot too. Old Boys network???

 

[aesop081]

No one I know has been issued that medal physically yet. Same goes with the Libyan operation medal. They still haven't decided on that yet. I was told there is a delay in the OSM's. And if I was a betting man I would say the delay is that the mint is too busy minting 60000 queens diamond jubilee medals.

So far they have managed to decorate Gen Bouchard three times for his work but have yet to recognize the crews of Charlottetown, Vancouver or the aiwring. The good General has recieved the Meritorious Service Cross, Legion of Merit (US), and he will get the Order of Canada. jeez. And whatever medal they decide to give out for op mobile. That's four medals in the year he retires. Hell they will probably throw him a QDJM just for the hell foot too. Old Boys network???

You're not the only one waiting so relax.

You got paid today so the world isn't ending.

 

[Nfld Sapper]

You got paid today so the world isn't ending.

We get paid?

;D

 

[dimsum]

You got paid today so the world isn't ending.

Duh, everyone knows it ends on Dec 21, 2012!  :bowing:

 

[GAP]

We get paid?

;D

It's not all Joy you know...... :nod:

 

[jollyjacktar]

Duh, everyone knows it ends on Dec 21, 2012!  :bowing:

Not Harold Camping.  :bowing:

 

[dimsum]

Not Harold Camping.  :bowing:

That reminds me:  I passed by some huge highway signs in Utah and Idaho proclaiming that May 2011 was the end (I think it was those guys?) when I was on my road trip in the States.  I think they were just too embarrassed to ask the ad agency to take them down  :nod:

 

[jollyjacktar]

Yes, they would be the dumb asses who contracted those signs.  I'd be embarrassed as well, I hope he is.

 

[MARS]

As for the OSM, I was told by my last unit that the paperwork for my OSM as part of OP Caribe was being delayed in Ottawa....I should go see my new unit OR now I guess and see what they can figure out for me.

NS

I received part of an email chain indicating the same thing.  Some issue with the in/out-chop dates for CARIBBE, as entered by CANADACOM, has resulted in the ceasing of minting/issuing CARIBBE OSMs for the moment.  The Fleet Chief is on it, though.

 

[aesop081]

I received part of an email chain indicating the same thing.  Some issue with the in/out-chop dates for CARIBBE, as entered by CANADACOM, has resulted in the ceasing of minting/issuing CARIBBE OSMs for the moment.  The Fleet Chief is on it, though.

Most units and deployment dates do not show up in the system. My OR pulled up the list and my unit does not show up despite having deployed 3 times to OP CARIBBE.

 

[misratah500]

So were thinking CANADACOM screwed up or something?

 

[jollyjacktar]

Can happen at any level.  From what I am told, our information had not even left the ship at 3 months after returning from OP CARIBBE.  Your medal will get to you when it gets to you as always.  But then, I had to initiate my GCS upon my return from the sandbox as we fell through the cracks admin wise in KAF.

 

[NavyShooter]

OSM -Caribe for one of my guys who sailed last January is finally arriving tomorrow.

Mine from 2008...still in the air....because I was posted off during the middle of that deployment, but my COS was shifted to accomdate completing that trip....so my OR is looking into it.  *sigh*  No rush...it's interesting, they can send you away for 6 months on 26 hours notice, but take months after you get back to figure out how to recognize that service...

 

[CountDC]

Navyshooter - seems some things never do change.  There is a simple way for that to be done - it is called attach posting  being published in the system so that there is a record.  Unfortunately over the years the Navy has had a very bad record on this and many of our people have unrecognized service as there is no record other than their own memories.  I remember when I first reported to a ship there was a basket stacked with attach posting messages that had never been entered as they were not considered important. I was so shocked until I saw some of the other practices.  Two events that have made this stand out was the Sea Pay audits and the SSM calculations.  So many times the official record showed the member was with ship X while they remembered being with ship Y as a loaner for a few months.

In your case was the COS shifted or was it the RFD that was shifted? COS are usually easier to verify as they are done by the CM while RFD are often done between units via emails/phone calls.

 

[Pusser]

The problem is that NDHQ (the centre of the universe) assumes everyone does everything the same same way.  When an Army unit deploys, every member of that that unit (the ones that are going that is) is individually attach posted to the deployment location/operation.  Ships, on the other hand are simply assigned and there is no real requirement to attach post anyone because nothing actually changes.  Ships are self-contained in that they take everything with them (files, admin office, pay office, etc).  Even their mailing address doesn't change.  In a previous life, everytime NDHQ published rules for a new benefit, I had to call and remind them that unless they really wanted to deny the benefit to deployed ships, they had to adjust the wording to include those other than whom were "attach posted" to an operation.

 

[dapaterson]

The problem is that NDHQ (the centre of the universe) assumes everyone does everything the same same way.  When an Army unit deploys, every member of that that unit (the ones that are going that is) is individually attach posted to the deployment location/operation.  Ships, on the other hand are simply assigned and there is no real requirement to attach post anyone because nothing actually changes.  Ships are self-contained in that they take everything with them (files, admin office, pay office, etc).  Even their mailing address doesn't change.  In a previous life, everytime NDHQ published rules for a new benefit, I had to call and remind them that unless they really wanted to deny the benefit to deployed ships, they had to adjust the wording to include those other than whom were "attach posted" to an operation.

No, the problem is that the navy thinks in terms of ships and not in terms of people.

There is a requirement to track where people are, not just ships.  Attach posting a person to a ship means the official records state that "Pusser was aboard HMCS Retentive from 15 July through 18 September 2007" - so ten years from now when it's discovered that HMCS Retentive was, in fact, infested with cooties, we can track down Pusser and ensure he gets his shots.

Right now, if I understand CountDC, the problem is that many sailors are brought aboard to fill empty billets but their pers files are never properly annotated - so once the HMCS Retentive cooties scare comes up, "the system" shows that Pusser was at his desk in Jonquiere as N1-5-7-12 at that time and he may not receive the medical attention he requires.


Associating benefits with attach-posted status is a different issue.


(And the current CF method of attach-posting to a deployed UIC has other, more interesting impacts, since the "units" never deploy - meaning a true pedant would observe that CinC commendations can't be given, since the unit that forms the core of the battle group never deployed - its personnel did, but the unit itself did not... but that's another discussion better suited for a stand-up table in the mess)

 

[Pusser]

No, the problem is that the navy thinks in terms of ships and not in terms of people.

Yes it does, but what is the point of attach posting someone to the unit to which they are already posted?  Ships ARE different, because when they deploy, they deploy completely.  There is no rear party.  There are no offices in the home port to do the ship's business.  The folks who are left behind are sent to other units or sections to be employed, but the ship is still responsible for all their administration.

Please note that I am not making excuses for poor personnel administration.  When folks make "pier-head jumps" or report for duty on dates other than those on their posting messages, these things need to be recorded and properly accounted for.  The tools exist.  We just need to get better at using them.  Attach posting everyone is not the solution, but neither is failing to attach post some of them.

 

[CountDC]

The problem I refer to is not in regards to the crew posted to the ship.  the problem is the navy likes to loan crew across ships (attach post) and not publish them.  Sometimes it is that a message is generated (ie a basket full of them) but not published into the system.  Sometimes it is a last minute "Freddie is sailing today and needs another Bosn so take one from Athab" with no message cut.

An example I dealt with for a member going on Ops and having to calculate his points (can't remember the actuals so I will make them up but the case is real):

MPRR states member was with Athab Oct 2001 to Sep 2003 at which time the ship did not sail so no points

Check of his pers file shows an att-pst to Iroq Jan 2002 to Jan 2003 which according to the points msg gave him a couple but not enough to increase the OPS FSP.

Member though insist that he was further loaned from the Iroq to Freddie as a last minute replacement prior to doing a NATO Apr 2002 to Sep 2002.  This would not only give him enough points to jump to the next level of OPS FSP but it would increase again while on the op. 

Piece everything together between his records, medal(which also was not recorded on his rcds), Div Notes, etc I was able to prove that he was with Freddie for that time and give him the higher OPS FSP.

If everything had been done properly it would have been 5 minutes of checking the mprr and pers file and entering the information into the calculation sheet.  Instead I spent 2 days compiling everything to put together an air tight case for the member.

I have seen a member be loaned from one ship to another which loaned him to another which in turn loaned him to another (yes 4 ships) and not recorded properly.  Looking at his MPRR he was still with the first ship the entire time.

 

[jollyjacktar]

A request for an under the table "loan" like that was made for CHA recent trip.  My Chief, told them if they did not want to cut a proper request/message etc, No Dice.  He said that if I was there under the radar and ended up hurt, I would be SOL as I was not really there now was I...  Needless to say, I'm not there and someone who was not so fussy is.