Saluting Foreign Officers

[Pusser]

What if they don't hold a commission at all?  What about US Warrant Officers...  do we as Canadian Forces pers salute them?  I'm inclined to say no, as we don't salute our own.

Canadian and US warrant officers are not on the same plane and should not be regarded as equivalents.  In simple terms, our warrant officers mess with the sergeants, whereas American warrant officers mess with the officers. 

 

[George Wallace]

What if they don't hold a commission at all?  What about US Warrant Officers...  do we as Canadian Forces pers salute them?  I'm inclined to say no, as we don't salute our own.

We don't salute US Warrant Officers, but that is a hard call as you have to be inches away to see the cutouts in their rank bars........so in the end they often do get saluted.

 

[GAP]

If it moves "Salute it".....apologize to the fuzzy caterpillar later.... ;D

 

[jeffb]

We don't salute US Warrant Officers, but that is a hard call as you have to be inches away to see the cutouts in their rank bars........so in the end they often do get saluted.

There was a US WO in the officers mess here in Pet a few months ago and it took the group of us probably 5 minutes to figure out the rank. Sure, he was standing about 15 feet away but guesses ranged from Lt to Maj General.

 

[George Wallace]

There was a US WO in the officers mess here in Pet a few months ago and it took the group of us probably 5 minutes to figure out the rank. Sure, he was standing about 15 feet away but guesses ranged from Lt to Maj General.

Now this quote will just add to some of the confusion, as ranks don't always translate over to a foreign nation all that well.  I remember that MCpls were ranked equal to US E6s (Sgts) while in Germany (Germany story).  So, at times, that had MCpls in the Snr NCO messes there.

 

[Haggis]

What if they don't hold a commission at all?  What about US Warrant Officers...  do we as Canadian Forces pers salute them?  I'm inclined to say no, as we don't salute our own.

The USMC, US Army, USCG and US Navy Chief Warrant Officers are commissioned officers.  They also have Warrant Officers which are not commissioned.  Interstingly, US Warrant Officers are drawn from the E7- E9 ranks (WO to CWO here) in a manner somewhat similar to our Special Requirements Commissioning Plan.

Being they are all former senior NCO, if you salute the wrong one, you are quite likely to find out about it in short order.

 

[GAP]

Now this quote will just add to some of the confusion, as ranks don't always translate over to a foreign nation all that well.  I remember that MCpls were ranked equal to US E6s (Sgts) while in Germany (Germany story).  So, at times, that had MCpls in the Snr NCO messes there.

Well, it was the CF that screwed that up. You now have 3 versions of private, no "Lance Corporal" then you go and insert a rank in between Cpl and Sgt.....  :nod:

 

[Haggis]

Well, it was the CF that screwed that up. You now have 3 versions of private, no "Lance Corporal" then you go and insert a rank in between Cpl and Sgt.....  :nod:

I'll point out that MCpl is not a rank one may be promoted into.  It's an appointment.

From Queens Regulations and Orders, Chapter 3.08:

3.08 – MASTER CORPORAL APPOINTMENT
   
(1) The Chief of the Defence Staff or such officer as he may designate may appoint a corporal as a master corporal.
  (
(2) The rank of a master corporal remains that of corporal.
   
(3) Master corporals have seniority among themselves in their order of seniority as corporals.
   
(4) Master corporals have authority and powers of command over all other corporals.

Yes, I'm from NDHQ and I'm here to help.

 

[dapaterson]

And "MCpl is not a rank" is very important in disciplinary situations, as a Sgt reduced in rank becomes a Cpl, not a MCpl.

 

[Haggis]

And "MCpl is not a rank" is very important in disciplinary situations, as a Sgt reduced in rank becomes a Cpl, not a MCpl.

  Correct - as defined in QR&O 3.08 para 2.

 

[aesop081]

What if they don't hold a commission at all?  What about US Warrant Officers...  do we as Canadian Forces pers salute them?  I'm inclined to say no, as we don't salute our own.

http://usacac.army.mil/cac2/wocc/woprogram.asp#gradestructure

The Army warrant officer corps is comprised of over 25,000 men and women of the active Army and reserve components. Warrant officers are technical experts that manage and maintain increasingly complex battlefield systems. They enhance the Army's ability to defend our national interests, and to fight and win our nations wars. Candidates who successfully complete Warrant Officer Candidate School are appointed in the grade of Warrant Officer One. When promoted to Chief Warrant Officer Two, warrant officers are commissioned by the President and have the same legal status as their traditional commissioned officer counterparts. However, warrant officers remain single-specialty officers whose career track is oriented towards progressing within their career field rather than focusing on increased levels of command and staff duty positions

 

[a_majoor]

What if they don't hold a commission at all?  What about US Warrant Officers...  do we as Canadian Forces pers salute them?  I'm inclined to say no, as we don't salute our own.

Read and become familier with this chart: https://www.natoschool.nato.int/new_www/multimedia/army_rank.pdf

 

[Towards_the_gap]

As gap said, if it moves salute it, if in doubt salute it, if really in doubt turn around, cross the street, walk into a lamppost or otherwise avoid saluting it, or at last resort, throw up a salute and watch for a reaction from the salutee - if you see the spark of anger quickly turn the salute into a weird scratching of your right eyebrow and say 'good morning'.

Bob is your fathers brother.

 

[fraserdw]

Saluting officers of other nations demonstrates that your superior discipline, most such officers take that away when they return home.

 

[AmmoTech90]

We don't salute US Warrant Officers, but that is a hard call as you have to be inches away to see the cutouts in their rank bars........so in the end they often do get saluted.

That is incorrect.

US Warrant Officers are saluted.  They are commissioned (sometimes a differing ranks depending on their branch of service), but their remit is to conduct specialized technical duties that are much more narrowly focused than other commissioned officers but still require the authority and responsibility of an officer.  The fact that many of them are ex-Sr NCOs is irrelevent, they are now commissioned officers, they simply learnt their specialized skills are NCOs.  Most I have met do not care if they are saluted, but they are due one.

See below for a quote from the US WO School:
When promoted to Chief Warrant Officer Two, warrant officers are commissioned by the President and have the same legal status as their traditional commissioned officer counterparts. However, warrant officers remain single-specialty officers whose career track is oriented towards progressing within their career field rather than focusing on increased levels of command and staff duty positions

 

[SupersonicMax]

Saluting officers of other nations demonstrates that your superior discipline, most such officers take that away when they return home.

For real!?

 

[Pusser]

For real!?

Absolutely, in the same way that the way I'm treated by the members of other nations' armed forces affects my impression of those armed forces and indeed their nation when I come home to Canada.

 

[aesop081]

See below

See reply #30  ;D

 

[armyvern]

Absolutely, in the same way that the way I'm treated by the members of other nations armed forces affects my impression of those armed forces and indeed their nation when I come home to Canada.

I'd personally harken that to "professionalism" vice "discipline". And, as those nations salute as well - and return them too!! - it certainly does absolutely diddly-squat to demonstrate "our superiority" over anyone else.

For real.

 

[my72jeep]

I was working full time at the Borden Cadet Training Center when we started teaching the former Com block officers at the Language school. now those were trying times. For a bit I was having Serb generals saluting my newly donned Captains.