Some Weird Swerve About Deployments [from the Coronavirus thread]

[stellarpanther]

Do you see anything wrong with that?

Yes and no.  A common thing we often hear is "if you don't like it quit".  In this case the Career Manager has the right to post you where they need you but you also have the right to release with either with 30 days depending on time in or with 6 months.  That's what's happening.  If they fake an injury to get our of something I would have an issue with that.

 

[Infanteer]

Stellarpanther, everything I hear running out of your mouth is "I heard" or "my friend said" or "word is."  Quite frankly, you don't appear to know much, and just spew rumour and innuendo into the threads.  In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if you were a seasoned WO trolling the forum.

In either case, you should refrain from posting unless you can back your statement up with fact.  Otherwise, you're adding static to the net.

PS.  Ask your career manager for a posting to 3 RCR.  It'd do you some good.

 

[stellarpanther]

I am calling out your bubble of you and "friends" that clearly don't know the reality but are just an echo chamber.  It isn't an insult against you, but rather the premise behind your posts that is largely a self perpetuating bubble driven by like minded folks even though it doesn't match reality.

The people I hear this from are not just my friends.  I hear from people I've known that are now in places like Pet or Edmonton and they say similar things.

 

[Jarnhamar]

[quote author=Infanteer]

PS.  Ask your career manager for a posting to 3 RCR.  It'd do you some good.
[/quote]
3 RCR will send cooks clerks and vehicle techs on their jump course if they want it.

 

[stellarpanther]

Stellarpanther, everything I hear running out of your mouth is "I heard" or "my friend said" or "word is."  Quite frankly, you don't appear to know much, and just spew rumour and innuendo into the threads.  In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if you were a seasoned WO trolling the forum.

In either case, you should refrain from posting unless you can back your statement up with fact.  Otherwise, you're adding static to the net.

PS.  Ask your career manager for a posting to 3 RCR.  It'd do you some good.

What I notice on this forum is that when someone doesn't agree with a poster, they go on the attack against that person which is what's happening here.  Either way you are the only one adding static because in you post you didn't contribute anything positive except harass a poster for their believes.  And you are directing staff.  Wow.  You and some others disagree with my way of thinking which is more common than you think.  I'm not going to try to spend time to find stats or reports that backup what I say because I don't have the desire to prove myself to someone I don't even know or who may have been retired for several years and doesn't realize the military isn't the same as it was when they left.  If you knew where I worked and what reports I see, maybe you would think different but it doesn't really matter.  My opinion is based on what I hear from others, what I have seen and what reports I've read and I've read a lot.  Not all HRA's just do pay and enter leave passes.  You might be surprised what we see and do.  You are entitled to your opinion and that's all it is.  Your opinion is no more valuable than anyone else on here.  If you like going to the field or like going on numerous ex's and deployments that's great for you but it doesn't mean everyone in the military likes that sort or thing or that they should like that sort of thing.  As for your comment about going to 3 RCR, why would I do that if I have no interest in that sort of thing?

 

[stellarpanther]

Lots of people don't want to deploy, or sail or fly.  They should do the honourable thing and stop wasting the Queens money and time.  If you include yourself in that boat, you should also get out.  Nothing worse than lazy, cowardly slovenly people in uniform.

Riders in an organization that is 100% dependent on team work for mission success should do everyone a favour and get out.  They should also be forced or coerced out if necessary but that's for another discussion.

I believe it's part of the "journey" but are you aware that the many people in the top leadership including the CDS don't agree with you which is why there is active planning (or at least before COVID) to create 3 separate groups which are deployable, full time non-deployable and part time?  They have also greatly increased the threshold for medical releases. 

 

[PPCLI Guy]

As for your comment about going to 3 RCR, why would I do that if I have no interest in that sort of thing?

Hmm.  So some other person has to go there?  Not you?  Because why? 

"That sort of thing" is called service.  Not the type you provide your "clients".  The type that you provide to your country, in exchange for a decent salary, a disability pension while you are still serving and earning full wages, and a great defined benefit pension at the end of it all.  You know.  Paying for the deal you are getting now. 

It is also about sharing the burden with your team mates.  Going on exercise.  Serving in an actual field unit.  Doing a tour.  Taking a less than ideal posting.  The stuff that makes us, the military, who we are.  A team.

Or not.

You are right when you said:

Your opinion is no more valuable than anyone else on here.

The same can not be said of the breadth of one's experience, or the quality of one's service.  Some people's is more valuable than others.

 

[Remius]

Sounds like regular force, public service and reserves.

Personally we should have full time and part time.  If you are full time you are full time you are deployable.  That includes all class B.

If you are non deployable (unless for TCATS) then you should be a PS.

Edit: Modified for IPad Skynet spell checker

 

[mariomike]

If you are full time you are full time you are deplorable. 

 

[Remius]

Stupid IPad...

 

[stellarpanther]

Sounds like regular force, public service and reserves.

Personally we should have full time and part time.  If you are full time you are full time you are deplorable.  That includes all class B.

If you are non deployable (unless for TCATS) then you should be a PS.

The actually plan is well underway although it could be another 5-8 years away.  It's a way to hopefully help with retention and moral.  Over the past couple years, several bases have been having town halls with the Junior ranks and asking mbr's what changes they want to see.  Two that I went to that surprised me was the amount of people that don't want to be promoted higher than Corporal but they would like to see the pay level go higher than IPC 4.  Others didn't want to have deployments and others were saying that enough people volunteer for tours so don't force the ones who don't want to go.  These are comments I've heard people say with my own ears.  Another comment was postings.  Many felt that if someone is the same rank and has the same qualifications, don't take the person who doesn't want to go.  I don't see this one happening but one guy said postings should be based on seniority and that should decide if you get posted or not posted.  All of these things are being taken back to the Armed Forces Council.

edited to add: and moral.

 

[Kat Stevens]

What I notice on this forum is that when someone doesn't agree with a poster, they go on the attack against that person which is what's happening here.  Either way you are the only one adding static because in you post you didn't contribute anything positive except harass a poster for their believes.  And you are directing staff.  Wow.  You and some others disagree with my way of thinking which is more common than you think.  I'm not going to try to spend time to find stats or reports that backup what I say because I don't have the desire to prove myself to someone I don't even know or who may have been retired for several years and doesn't realize the military isn't the same as it was when they left.  If you knew where I worked and what reports I see, maybe you would think different but it doesn't really matter.  My opinion is based on what I hear from others, what I have seen and what reports I've read and I've read a lot.  Not all HRA's just do pay and enter leave passes.  You might be surprised what we see and do.  You are entitled to your opinion and that's all it is.  Your opinion is no more valuable than anyone else on here.  If you like going to the field or like going on numerous ex's and deployments that's great for you but it doesn't mean everyone in the military likes that sort or thing or that they should like that sort of thing.  As for your comment about going to 3 RCR, why would I do that if I have no interest in that sort of thing?

One of the big reasons guys (and girls and other) don't want to go is they just got back from their third deployment in four years because some cubicle dweller with a photocopier strapped to his ass and a five doughnut a day habit refuses to step up and take his bite of the shit sammich, and is plain burned out.

 

[BeyondTheNow]

Field I can buy, but CA-wise at least in the bubble I work in we have no issues filling spots on tours.  Our problem is not having enough of certain trades at times but if we have the people the spots are generally filled. 

The shortages are there, mostly because the ill thought out HRA/FSA split combined with entrenched HRA/FSAs that have sat in one location too long not willing to help spread out the deficits so they do exactly what you describe and jump ship the moment the ship asks them to do their part. There is some value in looking at the reasons why people don't want to leave areas, I have long said that it will become more and more important to folks to not have to move around willy nilly.

Yup, our unit got screwed over pretty badly with this. The incoming CClk decided they didn’t want to leave Ottawa. Literally last minute they VR’d. I’ve honestly lost track of hearing of the number of times this has happened.

 

[Jarnhamar]

What I notice on this forum is that when someone doesn't agree with a poster, they go on the attack against that person which is what's happening here.

I don't see it that way.

You've sort of set yourself up as a bit of an ambassador for down trodden hard-done-by troops. The amount that these troops are being percecuted is questionable Imo.

 

[stellarpanther]

Just thought I'd add that I am posted out of Ottawa very shortly.  On HHT right now.  Not saying where and it certainly isn't to 3 RCR.  I actually asked for options to leave Ottawa partly because my wife wants to go to a smaller city where we can afford a house and hopefully less COVID but that was only a small consideration as it won't go on forever.  I think I'll be happy where I'm going after talking with the new Sgt and WO. 

 

[PuckChaser]

A complaint in Petawawa is the people who are on T-Cat flood the CDU to get off their categories when deployments come up. Or flood the CDU to try and get surgeries early and get lingering issues cleared up so they can go.

Lets be careful here, you've described 2 polar opposite people and lumped them into the same group. Someone trying to get off a TCat to get a deployment but not to go to Wainwright are taking advantaged of the medical system for personal gain. Someone going to the CDU to get pushed up on a surgical wait list/clear a lingering issue are motivated folks looking to get themselves fit to fight as fast as possible. We should not lump people who are legitimately hurt stuck in a glacial medical system in the same group as those using that glacial medical system to hide until the next cool course or deployment comes up.

 

[BeyondTheNow]

Stupid IPad...

So the question then becomes how often you’ve typed the word “deplorable.”  ;D

 

[stellarpanther]

When I joined the CAF I was very honest with the recruiter about my opinions etc.  One thing I mentioned and I've mentioned it to my other CoC's is that if told I am being sent on tour, I would not try to get out of it by faking an injury or whatever but I am not someone who is going to volunteer to go either.  Every one of my CWO's, MWO's and WO's have said they have no problem with that sort of thinking.  A couple of them said they've heard several others say the same thing.  I don't think that makes me or others who think like that any less of a Soldier, Airman or Sailor for that way of thinking.

edit: cleared up grammar.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

I served in Kandahar with an awesome 58 year old Finance Major (she joined quite late).  When I asked why she deployed, she said "because financial support to deployed operations is what I do, and because it is my turn".

 

[PuckChaser]

Every one of my CWO's, MWO's and WO's have said they have no problem with that sort of thinking.

You have a serious leadership problem in your trade then, or they're lying to you. You are describing the attitude of a civilian public servant, and I'll be perfectly blunt with you, it very much does (IMHO) make you less of a soldier, sailor or airperson for that way of thinking. Unfortunately we have too many people in the CAF with your way of thinking, but at least you're professional enough not to malinger to get out of deploying where others are missing that set of ethics.

I served in Kandahar with an awesome 58 year old Finance Major (she joined quite late).  When I asked why she deployed, she said "because financial support to deployed operations is what I do, and because it is my turn".

Perfect example in attitude difference between a soldier/sailor/airperson and a civilian public servant.