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US Presidential Election 2024 - Trump vs Harris - Vote Hard with a Vengence

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brihard said:
You have this weird notion that I get gleeful about anything to do with Trump. Far from it. There’s nothing enjoyable about watching a closely allied country on whose stability we depend trying to excise the political equivalent of a late stage cancer. A comment like Cheney’s merely merits a ‘wow’ with slightly raised eyebrows.
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There's irony right there. Big, heaping gobs of it. Nothing enjoyable in watching our ally excise Trump as a cancer. Where is you concern for the 21 million (estimated) illegal alien cancer ruining the US, sanctioned by the democrats? Where is your concern for the cancer of inflation and debt the democrats are ruining their country and people with? Where is your concern for the two tiered justice system that is a cancer on the US judicial system. Where is your concern for the cancerous wars the democrats are responsible for, and the money Canada must now spend to prop up the cancerous democrat war machine (Cheneys). I could go on, but it'll just make your response all that much longer and tedious. Not that'll change anything. You'll still cheer every Trump gotcha moment that comes down the pike and continue supporting the great cancerous job the democrats are doing.

I'll remain comfortable making suggestions if I think someone has badly lost the plot.
 
brihard said:
Maybe check the back of your closet for that thicker skin you offered someone the other day. I’ll remain comfortable making suggestions if I think someone has badly lost the plot.
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I don't need extra. I've been dealing with you for years.
 
Fishbone Jones said:
There's irony right there. Big, heaping gobs of it. Nothing enjoyable in watching our ally excise Trump as a cancer. Where is you concern for the 21 million (estimated) illegal alien cancer ruining the US, sanctioned by the democrats? Where is your concern for the cancer of inflation and debt the democrats are ruining their country and people with? Where is your concern for the two tiered justice system that is a cancer on the US judicial system. Where is your concern for the cancerous wars the democrats are responsible for, and the money Canada must now spend to prop up the cancerous democrat war machine (Cheneys). I could go on, but it'll just make your response all that much longer and tedious. Not that'll change anything. You'll still cheer every Trump gotcha moment that comes down the pike and continue supporting the great cancerous job the democrats are doing.
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I’m sorry - did I miss the part where Afghanistan and Iraq were started by the Dems?
 
dimsum said:
For someone who frequently says something to the tune of “it’s my opinion”, getting mad about other people’s opinions is an interesting step.
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Nope. Not mad. And confident I made the right decision about your profile.
 
Fishbone Jones said:
There's irony right there. Big, heaping gobs of it. Nothing enjoyable in watching our ally excise Trump as a cancer. Where is you concern for the 21 million (estimated) illegal alien cancer ruining the US, sanctioned by the democrats? Where is your concern for the cancer of inflation and debt the democrats are ruining their country and people with? Where is your concern for the two tiered justice system that is a cancer on the US judicial system. Where is your concern for the cancerous wars the democrats are responsible for, and the money Canada must now spend to prop up the cancerous democrat war machine (Cheneys). I could go on, but it'll just make your response all that much longer and tedious. Not that'll change anything. You'll still cheer every Trump gotcha moment that comes down the pike and continue supporting the great cancerous job the democrats are doing.

I'll remain comfortable making suggestions if I think someone has badly lost the plot.
Click to expand...

There, doesn’t that feel better?
 
Remius said:
Ugh…I hate that I have to defend the guy but looks like his quote was taken out of context. Or at least exagerated from what I think he was trying to say.
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Agreed. He was talking about the current situation in the US, not that he wants it to be that way.

I’m still not for higher security in schools if it means teachers have to be armed (for all sorts of reasons - not least because teachers aren’t trained to defend against active shooter scenarios).
 
Remius said:
Ugh…I hate that I have to defend the guy but looks like his quote was taken out of context. Or at least exagerated from what I think he was trying to say.
Click to expand...
Agreed, mostly. He was essentially saying he regrets that school shootings are a fact of life. He talked about physical security for schools and, from what I saw, doesn’t have much interest in discussing disrupting potential school shooters any earlier than when they show up with a gun.

The Onion nailed it a decade ago. ‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens
 
Another useful article from Foreign Affairs, this time by Francis Fukuyama:

Part 1

----------​

The Year of Elections Has Been Good for Democracy​

But the Biggest Test Will Come in America​

By Francis Fukuyama September 4, 2024​


Liberals have engaged in a lot of catastrophic thinking during this “year of elections.” Many feared that authoritarian and populist politicians, from Hungary’s Viktor Orban to India’s Narendra Modi, would consolidate their gains by increasing their shares of the vote. According to Freedom House’s February 2024 Freedom in the World analysis, the world has been in a phase of democratic backsliding for nearly two decades, exacerbated by the rise of authoritarian great powers such as China and Russia, hot wars in Ukraine and the Middle East, and the ascendance or advancement of populist nationalists in countries that seemed to be securely democratic—Germany, Hungary, India, and Italy.

For liberals who want to preserve a world safe for democracies, perhaps the most alarming point came in mid-July, when Republicans confirmed former President Donald Trump as their party’s presidential nominee and ultra-MAGA JD Vance as his running mate. Although Trump tried to overturn the 2020 U.S. election, he was nonetheless the enthusiastic choice of his party. He had just survived an assassination attempt; his raised fists and call to “fight, fight, fight” drew a sharp contrast with the elderly sitting president, Joe Biden, whose debate performance the previous month made him a clear underdog.

But liberals’ fears that this year would reflect the global triumph of illiberal populism have so far been proved wrong. Although authoritarian ideologies have made clear gains in several countries, democracy in many parts of the world has shown surprising resilience and may yet prevail in the United States. Their belief in the trend of democratic decline has led many liberals to wring their hands and ask despairingly whether they can do anything to reverse it. The answers to this question are simple and boring: go out with your fellow citizens and vote or, if you are more actively inclined, work hard to mobilize like-minded people to help democratic politicians win elections. Liberal democracy is all about personal agency, and there is little evidence that traditional political engagement no longer works.

THE YEAR OF ELECTIONS​

The year of elections is so named because an all-time-high number of citizens worldwide went to the polls; nearly 30 countries are holding elections that are both defining and competitive. This pivotal year really began in late 2023, most critically with the Polish election on October 15 that dethroned the populist Law and Justice party (PiS) and replaced it with a coalition of liberal parties. Law and Justice had been following a path blazed by Hungary’s right-wing Fidesz party, but the strong cooperation between Poland’s Civic Platform and other left-of-center parties—whose members worked hard to overcome their past differences and held massive rallies to get out the vote—drove a 41-seat loss for PiS, which also lost its majority in Poland’s lower house of parliament, the Sejm. This represented a major setback for populism in Europe, depriving Hungary of a major ally within the EU. The only other country in eastern Europe to move in a populist direction was Slovakia, as Robert Fico returned as prime minister in October and vowed to end his country’s strong support for Ukraine. Slovakia’s pro-Western president, Zuzana Caputova, declined to run for a second term and was succeeded this June by Fico’s ally Peter Pellegrini, who, like Fico, is more sympathetic to Russia. Although populists made gains, Slovakia remains a deeply polarized nation; in May, a would-be assassin shot Fico because of the prime minister’s opposition to military aid for Ukraine.

In November 2023, Javier Milei defeated Sergio Massa in the second-round presidential vote in Argentina. Many in the United States understood Milei to be an Argentine Trump, given his antiestablishment personal style and embrace of the former U.S. president. But Milei was riding a wave of popular disgust with the ruling Peronists, who had led the country into deep economic stagnation. Although many populists embrace a strong state bent on enforcing conservative cultural values, Milei is a genuine libertarian. The early success of his economic stabilization program allowed him to retain his popularity despite having a weak base in the Argentine National Congress. The chief danger Milei poses is not that he will move in an authoritarian direction but that he will go too far in weakening the Argentine state.

Early 2024 saw mixed results for democracy. In January, Taiwan’s Democratic Progressive Party defeated the pro-Chinese Kuomintang, and Finland remained in a solidly democratic camp. In both cases, the winning parties had worked quietly but vigorously to build their legislative majorities. On the other hand, the following month, El Salvador’s Nayib Bukele was reelected president with a remarkable 85 percent of the vote—a reward for having dramatically decreased crime by using extrajudicial means to incarcerate a large part of the country’s gang leadership. In running for a second term, Bukele flouted the Salvadoran constitutional prohibition against consecutive reelection; he may well remain in power for years to come. The trend toward rewarding strongmen continued with the election of Prabowo Subianto to the Indonesian presidency. Human rights groups have accused Prabowo, a former special forces commander, of committing war crimes during Indonesia’s occupation of Timor-Leste in the 1980s and 1990s; he had been banned from traveling to the United States from 2000 until 2020, when Trump’s State Department granted him a visa. But his victory may not have reflected anything more than the enormous popularity of his predecessor, Joko Widodo, whose legacy Prabowo has claimed he will perpetuate.

In Bangladesh, the corrupt Awami League party led by Sheikh Hasina held on to power in January amid countrywide protests against her rule. Her success, however, would prove to be transitory, as renewed protests after the election led Hasina to flee the country in early August. Whether Bangladesh can reclaim a democratic mantle is not certain, but it is clear that a huge number of citizens were fed up with a ruler who had been in power for 20 of the last 28 years.

POPULIST REMEDIES REJECTED​

The middle of the year brought two important elections, in South Africa and Mexico, that did not fit easily into the populist-versus-liberal framework. In South Africa, the African National Congress, which had dominated the country’s politics since it transitioned to democracy in 1994, lost 71 seats and its majority in the National Assembly. The rise of a new party, uMkhonto weSizwe (MK), associated with the country’s corrupt former president Jacob Zuma, was troubling, but in the aftermath of the election, the ANC went into a coalition not with MK but with the Democratic Alliance, a party that tends to represent white and so-called colored, or mixed race, voters. The DA gained three parliamentary seats, and the radical left-wing Economic Freedom Fighters party lost five. For all the corruption scandals and economic decline that South Africa has experienced in the past decade, the 2024 election was in some ways reassuring. Voters held the ANC accountable for its corrupt stewardship of the country and did not turn wholeheartedly to populist remedies.

Mexico similarly demonstrated the strength of its democratic culture. Liberal analysts have characterized the country’s sitting president, Andrés Manuel López Obrador, as a Latin American populist, but he was popular against the backdrop of a corrupt and ineffective establishment. In daily speeches, he railed against the corrupt oligarchy that had ruled Mexico for decades. He dialed back the war against narcotraffickers, which brought a momentary reduction of violence while failing to solve an underlying problem that will plague Mexico for years to come. And he initiated a number of pro-poor policies while largely maintaining fiscal discipline. As the country’s first decidedly left-wing president since the 1920 Mexican Revolution, he became extremely popular, and his successor, Claudia Sheinbaum, won the presidency in June by more than 30 points over her conservative rival. Sheinbaum’s party, Morena, also won a supermajority in the Mexican Congress, giving it the option of changing the constitution after she takes office. López Obrador displayed many illiberal tendencies during his presidency, and his parting gift to the country will be a so-called reform of Mexico’s judiciary that, in fact, will severely weaken the institution’s independence. But it is not clear how Sheinbaum will use her substantial power once she comes into office. She does not seem to have inherited any of López Obrador’s zealotry. Barring any surprises, she is better thought of as a left-of-center Latin American politician than a left-wing populist.

Another pivotal election was in India, where the vote occurred in stages between mid-April and early June. Prime Minister Modi—a charter member of the populist-nationalist club who had weakened his country’s media, courts, and civil liberties—was expected to increase the Hindu nationalist Bharatiya Janata Party’s majority in India’s lower house, the Lok Sabha. Instead, the BJP lost its majority and was forced to enter into a coalition with other parties. Its losses were particularly great in its former northern Indian heartland, where it shed 49 seats, including 29 in the poor state of Uttar Pradesh.

Less globally influential but still significant was the election in Mongolia at the end of June. Wedged between Russia and China, the country has been the only state in central Eurasia to realize and maintain a democracy after exiting Moscow’s orbit following the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991. But the ruling Mongolian People’s Party, the successor to the Soviet-era Communist Party, turned in an increasingly authoritarian and pro-Russian direction between 2022 and 2024. The election, however, saw the opposition Democratic Party more than double its seat count as voters rejected a system pervaded by corruption. This outcome did not make headlines in the West, but it demonstrated the power ordinary voters can wield to defend democracy.

End of Part 1​

 
Part 2

----------​

UNSETTLING SHIFTS​

Elections to the European Parliament took place in early June. Populist parties such as the Freedom Party in Austria, Marine Le Pen’s National Rally (RN) in France, the Alternative for Germany, the Party for Freedom in the Netherlands, and Giorgia Meloni’s Brothers of Italy all made gains. Across the 27-member bloc, the biggest losers were the Socialists and the Greens. This shift was unsettling but did not amount to the earthquake that some had predicted. Center and center-right parties such as Germany’s Christian Democratic Union and Poland’s Civic Platform hung onto or even increased their vote shares. Poland’s Law and Justice party lost seats, as did Fidesz in Hungary, where a dissident party member, Peter Magyar, split the vote by forming his own party following a corruption scandal in Fidesz.

The European Parliament election’s two most disturbing results came in France and Italy. Le Pen’s RN party swamped French President Emmanuel Macron’s centrist coalition, winning more than twice the vote share. This caused Macron to declare a snap national election at the end of June. The RN gained 37 seats, and the leftist alliance, the New Popular Front, added 32; for a moment, it looked as if the RN’s young standard-bearer, Jordan Bardella, was headed toward the prime minister’s office. But in the second round of voting in early July, the center and left parties withdrew their weaker candidates, and the RN was once again locked out of power. This happened only because the left-wing parties’ cooperated to streamline their candidates—the boring but necessary work of politics that previous coalitions had failed to do.

In Italy, the situation is less promising. In the European Parliament elections, Meloni’s populist Brothers of Italy increased its vote share substantially, and her right-wing coalition holds a comfortable majority in the Italian parliament. Meloni, who became prime minister in late 2022, initially portrayed herself as a centrist. Early in her tenure, she broke with pro-Russian populists such as Orban and Fico by expressing strong support for Ukraine, and many commentators speculated that she would back European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen’s bid for a second term. But after the EU parliament vote, she shifted to the right, and her party voted for only conditional support for Ukraine and opposed von der Leyen’s reelection.

The one large European country to hold an election without the threat that a rising populist party would gain power was the United Kingdom, where in early July, the Labour Party achieved a decisive victory over the Conservatives. The Tories had been in power for 14 years under five prime ministers and had led the country into prolonged economic stagnation by, among other things, supporting Brexit. When the Labour Party replaced its far-left leader, Jeremy Corbyn, with the more moderate Keir Starmer, voters responded favorably. Populist firebrands such as Nigel Farage were still around; his right-wing Reform UK party won 14 percent of the vote, more than the Liberal Democrats, who secured 12 percent. But Britain’s first-past-the-post electoral system kept him far from power.

DEMOCRATIC RESISTANCE​

There are still a number of important elections to come: in Moldova, where the liberal President Maia Sandu is likely to win reelection, and in Georgia, where the pro-Russian Georgian Dream party has a good chance of retaining power. But the most important election by far is the one occurring on November 5 in the United States between Trump and the Democratic candidate, Vice President Kamala Harris. At the time of the Republican National Convention in mid-July, a Trump victory against an aging Bidenlooked likely, but with Biden’s decision to step aside, the Democrats have been suddenly energized. Numerous polls, both nationally and in many of the critical swing states, now show Harris ahead of her opponent.

The outcome of the American election will have huge implications both for American institutions and for the world. Trump has expressed strong admiration for authoritarian leaders such as Russia’s Vladimir Putin and China’s Xi Jinping, and at home, he has promised to weaken checks on executive power. He will almost certainly end U.S. support for Ukraine and has expressed great skepticism about the value of alliances such as NATO. He has vowed to end trade relations with China and to impose a ten percent across-the-board tariff on all foreign-produced goods. The Republican Party has decidedly abandoned the libertarian policies of the Ronald Reagan years and pledges to wield state power in the service of conservative ends.

But thus far, the year of elections has not been a terrible one for democracy worldwide. Populist and authoritarian parties and leaders have made gains in some countries, but they have lost in others. Citizens have expressed their opposition to authoritarian governance in other ways, as well. In July, Venezuelans voted overwhelmingly in favor of the opposition candidate Edmundo González, leading the regime of Nicolás Maduro to commit massive fraud in declaring him the winner. Maduro’s regime can survive only by turning openly authoritarian and abandoning any shred of democratic legitimacy. And in Myanmar, where a military junta abolished elections following a coup in 2021, an armed insurgency that allies the junta’s democratic opposition to a number of ethnic militias is making substantial territorial gains.

Elections by themselves do not guarantee good policies or outcomes. What they provide is the opportunity to hold leaders accountable for policy failures and to reward them for perceived successes. Elections become dangerous when they elevate leaders who do not just seek to impose questionable policies but also hope to weaken or undermine basic liberal and democratic institutions. In this respect, the United States has become something of an outlier. In no European or Asian democracy has a leader recently arisen who has blatantly refused to accept the outcome of an election or provoked popular violence to avoid stepping down from power. The willingness of many Republican voters to normalize the events of January 6, 2021, is a symptom of weakening democratic norms in the world’s leading democracy—a signal that will be picked up by like-minded populists (such as the supporters of former Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, who imitated the January 6 rioters when they stormed their Congress in 2023) if Trump returns to the White House in November.

The lesson to be drawn from the year of elections so far is that the rise of populist and authoritarian politicians is not inevitable. Democratic backsliding can and has been resisted in many countries that hold elections. But democratic norms cannot be secured with violence, judicial remedies (for example, the use of the 14th Amendment to disqualify Trump), the rise of a new charismatic leader, or any other quick fix. What remains effective is the steady, often boring work of democratic politics: making arguments, convincing and mobilizing voters, adjusting policies, building coalitions, and, if necessary, making compromises where the best gives way to the possible. Even in a dispiriting time for global democracy, citizens still have agency to move toward better futures.

----------​

This bit, at the end stood out for me:

"Elections by themselves do not guarantee good policies or outcomes. What they provide is the opportunity to hold leaders accountable for policy failures and to reward them for perceived successes. Elections become dangerous when they elevate leaders who do not just seek to impose questionable policies but also hope to weaken or undermine basic liberal and democratic institutions ... [and] ... The lesson to be drawn from the year of elections so far is that the rise of populist and authoritarian politicians is not inevitable. Democratic backsliding can and has been resisted in many countries that hold elections. But democratic norms cannot be secured with violence, judicial remedies (for example, the use of the 14th Amendment to disqualify Trump), the rise of a new charismatic leader, or any other quick fix. What remains effective is the steady, often boring work of democratic politics: making arguments, convincing and mobilizing voters, adjusting policies, building coalitions, and, if necessary, making compromises where the best gives way to the possible. Even in a dispiriting time for global democracy, citizens still have agency to move toward better futures."

That applies in 🇨🇦 just as much as its does in the 🇺🇲.
 
Fishbone Jones said:
People are gullible. Anyone that believes Harris is doing a 180 on her lifelong communist doctrine and motives is an idiot. The US is at a tipping point. Four more years of open borders, social program expansion, reparations, tax hikes, natural resource reduction and democrat catch and release for violent offenders, overseen by Soros paid AGs and DAs, will end up either, or a combination of, civil war, a banana republic, an end to the great experiment and state control of every aspect of life. And while people spend their time vilifying Trump and supporting the lawfare being used against him, Harris is cruising to a win that will destroy the US. Partisan short sightedness at its finest.
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If so, Harris will share her moral low ground with many a Republican as well it would seem…
https://twitter.com/x/status/1026150926271143936
 
Say what you want about Steve Crowder, but the video doesn't lie.

DOJ Chief Admits Trump Indictments a Politically Motivated ‘Perversion of Justice​

rumble.com

DOJ Chief Admits Trump Indictments a Politically Motivated ‘Perversion of Justice’

Join Mug Club TODAY for $20 off with promo code LAWFARE: https://mugclub.rumble.com/support/promo/LAWFARE DOJ Chief of Public Affairs Admits Trump Indictments are a Politically Motivated ‘Perversion o
rumble.com rumble.com
 
Last edited:
Fishbone Jones said:
Say what you want about Steve Crowder, but the video doesn't lie.

rumble.com

DOJ Chief Admits Trump Indictments a Politically Motivated ‘Perversion of Justice’

Join Mug Club TODAY for $20 off with promo code LAWFARE: https://mugclub.rumble.com/support/promo/LAWFARE DOJ Chief of Public Affairs Admits Trump Indictments are a Politically Motivated ‘Perversion o
rumble.com rumble.com
Click to expand...
And Biase’s apology for said comments

cbsaustin.com

DOJ official calls Trump prosecutions 'perversion of justice' in undercover video

Nicholas Biase of the Department of Justice claimed in the clip the cases against Trump have backfired by making him 'more relevant.'
cbsaustin.com cbsaustin.com
 
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