Author Topic: The Canadian Commando Course  (Read 109576 times)

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Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #50 on: January 02, 2007, 14:34:12 »
Not sure if these courses equate to battle school, but the outline of two British Courses is described in the links below. Again, these specifically designed to select and prepare candidates for operations with - respectively -  the Parachute Regiment and the Royal Marines, and their respective brigades.

Pre-Parachute Selection
http://www.army.mod.uk/para/pegasus_p_company.htm

RM Commando Course (see 'Training' in this article)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Marines
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline pipesnake

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #51 on: January 02, 2007, 15:44:50 »
Old school Battle school, maybe.

What is Battleschool something lesser these days?

Offline geo

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #52 on: January 03, 2007, 11:07:26 »
Battleschools are constantly in a state of change... responding to the demands and expectations of the CF.  At present, there are plenty of lessons learned in Afghanistan that have been & will be integrated into the training of our troops.
Chimo!

Offline spottyjohn

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #53 on: July 19, 2007, 04:41:48 »
My grandfathger was a commando in WW2 and they say it skips a generation.
All be ****ed if you will use me though.

Offline spottyjohn

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #54 on: July 20, 2007, 17:59:29 »
I wanted to apologize for my comment.

I do respect those that keep us safe. I know that withought the armed forces we wouldn't live in a great nation like we have.
Because of the police and the armed forces we live in a free and peaceful nation. My grandfather was a comando in WW2 and he
did an important job. We all know that Hitler had to be stopped.When I was younger I was in the reserves.

I did apply to be in the USA army a few years ago but they said that I had to get a green card.
I applied to the Canadian forces and they called me several times but I had trouble getting my
Core Documents together. The biggest challenge was my birth certificate.

In the end my wife "found" my birth certificate.
She is a pacifist mennonite and know doubt wanted to make sure I didn't join.
So I do security gaurd work.

Anyway I do not disrespect what you people do.
In fact sometimes I pray for you people and wish I could be with you all.

I wish you all the best.
 

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #55 on: July 20, 2007, 18:27:50 »
???

“Never retreat. Never explain. Get it done and let them howl.”

Benjamin Jowett, 1819-1893

"No F-ing Prisoners!"

LCol Hew Pike, 3 PARA, 1982
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline Greymatters

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #56 on: July 20, 2007, 18:55:50 »
If you talk to any WW2 veterans you will find that alot of stuff we consider 'special' training these days was SOP for the combat arms, and especially the infantry, back then. Slim, for example, was fond of saying that any unit in the 14th Army could perform as well or better than a 'special' unit. This would be a good goal for us: to build and maintain a small, but extremely high quality, army.

A lot of this stuff is the same type of thinking we used to discuss back in late 1980's when I first got in.  However at the time the power that be did not believe we needed that kind of training.  Its only nowadays that higher-ups are realizing that we really need this kind of training and are starting to support it.   

Offline 3rd Herd

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #57 on: July 20, 2007, 20:04:05 »
A lot of this stuff is the same type of thinking we used to discuss back in late 1980's when I first got in.  However at the time the power that be did not believe we needed that kind of training.  Its only nowadays that higher-ups are realizing that we really need this kind of training and are starting to support it.   

No, they are the ones twenty years ago advocating this kind of training BUT didn't have the rank and now do.
"if he was to be hanged for it, he told his brother, he could not accuse a man whom he believed had meant well, and whose error was one of judgment, not of intention"
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Offline commando gunner

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #58 on: July 20, 2007, 22:07:33 »
My grandfathger was a commando in WW2 and they say it skips a generation.
All be ****ed if you will use me though.

What skips- an inability to spell?

Offline Greymatters

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #59 on: July 21, 2007, 21:10:12 »
No, they are the ones twenty years ago advocating this kind of training BUT didn't have the rank and now do. 

Hmmm, yes, that would be more accurate.

Offline Lockbo

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French Commando Re: Older Posts
« Reply #60 on: June 02, 2012, 17:46:38 »
I did the French Commando course in 1986 with 2 VP in Germany , then onto the Jump Course in 1987, both the same length of time and both can bust your balls. I agree with # 7, I was at #4, great course but now a badge on the wall that we can't wear. I am sure there are a lot of other specialty courses out there that the troops can't wear, no sense showing anyone what we have done on our uniforms. Thanks to the talking heads in Ottawa for policies that reflect their issues with troops having some distinction that shows the desk jockeys up....just sayin..

Offline George Wallace

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Re: French Commando Re: Older Posts
« Reply #61 on: June 02, 2012, 19:54:34 »
I did the French Commando course in 1986 with 2 VP in Germany , then onto the Jump Course in 1987, both the same length of time and both can bust your balls. I agree with # 7, I was at #4, great course but now a badge on the wall that we can't wear. I am sure there are a lot of other specialty courses out there that the troops can't wear, no sense showing anyone what we have done on our uniforms. Thanks to the talking heads in Ottawa for policies that reflect their issues with troops having some distinction that shows the desk jockeys up....just sayin..

Ummmmmm.   Not to be condescending, but we are not the Boy Scouts.  Do we really need to wear "Merritt Badges" to show off to others what we have/may have done?
DISCLAIMER: The opinions and arguments of George Wallace posted on this Site are solely those of George Wallace and not the opinion of Army.ca and are posted for information purposes only.
Unless so stated, they are reflective of my opinion -- and my opinion only, a right that I enjoy along with every other Canadian citizen.

Offline ArmyRick

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #62 on: June 02, 2012, 20:53:16 »
How about an MIR Commando badge? I would have qualified from my time on TCAT in 2008....
I am NOT a privileged white man by virtue of being male or white. I am privileged because I am alive and exercising my right to be who I am!

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #63 on: June 02, 2012, 21:33:04 »
Lets get rid of all our trade badges, branch/Corps badges.  Cornflakes for all.  All Mess Kits will look the same.  No skill or qual badges. 
Everything happens for a reason.

Sometimes the reason is you're stupid and make bad decisions.

Offline George Wallace

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #64 on: June 02, 2012, 21:40:47 »
Lets get rid of all our trade badges, branch/Corps badges.  Cornflakes for all.  All Mess Kits will look the same.  No skill or qual badges.

Come on!  I know you don't want to give up your spurs.   ;D
DISCLAIMER: The opinions and arguments of George Wallace posted on this Site are solely those of George Wallace and not the opinion of Army.ca and are posted for information purposes only.
Unless so stated, they are reflective of my opinion -- and my opinion only, a right that I enjoy along with every other Canadian citizen.

Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #65 on: June 03, 2012, 01:45:38 »
Lets get rid of all our trade badges, branch/Corps badges.  Cornflakes for all.  All Mess Kits will look the same.  No skill or qual badges.

Paul? Paul Helleyer? Is that you?  ;D
"The most important qualification of a soldier is fortitude under fatigue and privation. Courage is only second; hardship, poverty and want are the best school for a soldier." Napoleon

Offline PrairieThunder

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Re: French Commando Re: Older Posts
« Reply #66 on: June 03, 2012, 01:53:17 »
Ummmmmm.   Not to be condescending, but we are not the Boy Scouts.  Do we really need to wear "Merritt Badges" to show off to others what we have/may have done?

Merritt is a nice town, I'd wear one  ;)

Offline ArmyRick

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #67 on: June 03, 2012, 11:48:55 »
Anybody remember that Dr Seuss cartoon where some of the dudes had stars on their bellys and the others did not? Than they paid a dude and went through a machine that gave them stars on their bellies so they could all look the same.... I guess the ones without stars envied the ones with stars (Hmmmm, sound familiar, kind of like "how come they get a cool badge and I don't?")

Maybe we should bin defence ethics training and have everybody watch Dr Seuss videos...
I am NOT a privileged white man by virtue of being male or white. I am privileged because I am alive and exercising my right to be who I am!

Offline Scott

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #68 on: June 03, 2012, 12:17:17 »
One of those boat people will read this and stroke out...the heresy. But not before mashing the reply button to tell us to leave the curls alone.
Be nice for no reason.

Offline Jungle

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #69 on: June 03, 2012, 15:12:36 »
Lets get rid of all our trade badges, branch/Corps badges.  Cornflakes for all.  All Mess Kits will look the same.  No skill or qual badges.

We could also remove rank badges... I bet we would see a lot of distressed people; some people wear their rank, for others, it's the rank that carries them.
"I am a Canadian, free to speak without fear, free to worship in my own way, free to stand for what I think right, free to oppose what I believe wrong, or free to choose those who shall govern my country. This heritage of freedom I pledge to uphold for myself and all mankind."
- John G. Diefenbaker. July 1, 1960. From the Canadian Bill of Rights.

aesop081

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Re: French Commando Re: Older Posts
« Reply #70 on: June 03, 2012, 15:16:59 »
their issues with troops having some distinction that shows the desk jockeys up....just sayin..

Yes, all of us riding desks in Ottawa have nothing better to do than worry about troops looking more hardcore than us.

 ::)

Offline X Royal

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Re: French Commando Re: Older Posts
« Reply #71 on: June 04, 2012, 03:28:40 »
Yes, all of us riding desks in Ottawa have nothing better to do than worry about troops looking more hardcore than us.

 ::)
I suspect that would depend on if "riding desks in Ottawa" is a stop on your career path or a career in it's self.

MikeL

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #72 on: January 02, 2013, 14:24:57 »
I know the discussion is old and it would appear that such a course most likely won't be developed.  Although I believe it would be a great course where soldiers can challenge themselves and learn new skills as well as build upon skills/knowledge they already have.   Plus not all members want to be in CANSOF,  but still want to strive to be the best at what they do.

There actually was a "Commando course" run not too long ago in August of 1988 .... 40ish candidates only 5 succeeded and can actually say they are graduates of the "Commando Course".

IMO a attrition rate like this would be counter productive.  The course shouldn't be easy,  but it shouldn't have the majority of the course RTU'd for injuries and failing POs.

Keeping the course realistic/relevant for the Army as it isn't training members for SOF,  but giving them skills that will be beneficial for the regular Army.

From the original article,  there is a few things that can probably be removed IMO such as flamethrowers and the portions below


Quote
c. Combat Survival including resistance to interrogation
AFAIK this is what CAC Lvl C is for


Quote
f. Combat Medicine including IVs, CPR, practical gunshot training and drug administration (2.5%1 16 hours).
This is also covered during First Aid/Combat First Aid and TCCC.

Quote
g. Foreign Weapons including training on all Russian company level small arms, RPGs and automatic grenade launchers, G3, MG-31, M-60, SA-80, Steyr AUG, MPS, FNC1‘ and FAMAS Fl. (10%1 62 hours).
Not sure how easy it would be to get some of these weapons,  as well as ammo for them.  As well,  the Russian/Soviet Bloc weapons are covered during unit training/work up training.

Quote
j. Tank Hunting with M72, RPG-7, V, mines and expedient weapons (4.50 %/ 28 hours).
IMO it might be better to stick with weapons already in use by the CF for this.


As well,  this isn't a PLQ course but students should be put in leadership portions during the field portion;  perhaps even having a MCpl or Sgt acting as the Platoon Commander, etc.  I think a course like this would have a mixture of CQB/FIBUA training(with some CQC) as well as patrolling in urban and rural areas,  raids, ambushes,  selecting/marking HLZs,  basic mountaineering/rappelling(focused on conducting combat operations in a mountain enviroment),  employing helicopters and zodiacs for insert/extract(start and end of FTX),  leadership skills, PT(runs,  long ruck marches, circuit training/HIT, swimming),etc.  Reinforcing and adding to Infantry/combat skill sets.  Making sure of course that this "Commando" course is unique and isn't too similar to already existing courses such as Basic Recce, Basic Mountain Ops, etc.

Students would be physically fit,  confident in the use and employment of weapons used in a Infantry platoon,  land nav(map/compass and GPS), how to talk on a radio/Voice Procedure,  etc.  Open to NCMs and Officers of the Combat Arms some Combat Support/CSS pers(such as Sigs an Medics), etc.  Open to both Regular Force and Reservists.

I am far from a SME on the subject,  these are just my thoughts from reading the article and comments.



« Last Edit: January 02, 2013, 17:04:22 by -Skeletor- »

Offline KevinB

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #73 on: January 02, 2013, 16:25:41 »
The short lived Commando course was prior to JTF-2 and the later creation of CANSOFCOM and its subunits.

  Want a Commando course now --> SOAC or the CSOR course  (which is SOBQ right?)


 


Students would be physically fit,  confident in the use and employment of weapons used in a Infantry platoon,  land nav(map/compass and GPS), how to talk on a radio/Voice Procedure,  etc. 



Infantry Battle School?

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MikeL

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Re: The Canadian Commando Course
« Reply #74 on: January 02, 2013, 16:35:01 »
Want a Commando course now --> SOAC or the CSOR course

Not everyone wants to go CANSOF, or pass selection/SFC/SOAC.

or the CSOR course  (which is SOBQ right?)

SOBQ was the CSOR Operator course name,  but it is now called SFC. 


Infantry Battle School?

Are you saying the pre-reqs would be skills possessed by those who have completed Infantry DP1?
« Last Edit: January 02, 2013, 17:07:45 by -Skeletor- »