- Reaction score
- 9,860
- Points
- 1,360
ArmyVern said:
If they are CAF members, what they did was very stupid and they should be charged.
"Pour encourager les autres"
"Canadian Forces warns members affiliated with radical groups"
- Thread starter gryphonv
- Start date
If they are CAF members, what they did was very stupid and they should be charged.
"Pour encourager les autres"
- Reaction score
- 6,059
- Points
- 1,160
Proud Boys are a hate group simply because that's what the lefties and the press are calling them. Please stop reinforcing the false narrative.
Unfortunately, it is not illegal to desecrate the Canadian flag. If you get into a physical altercation with the idiot with the match, you run the chance of being charged. Don't expect the CoC to have any sympathy for being patriotic. Years ago, there was a fellow in a bar that was talking down the military including a certain Regiment I was with. I took his glasses off, put them in his pocket and drove him in the face. That was it. One punch. When the RSM marched me into the old man, I was asked why I did it. Straight out told him the guy was insulting the CAF and Regiment. That just seemed to make matters worse with the boss. That was back in the '70's. The CoC is much more CYA than it was then. If they have to hang a few sailors to save themselves, they will.
Unfortunately, it is not illegal to desecrate the Canadian flag. If you get into a physical altercation with the idiot with the match, you run the chance of being charged. Don't expect the CoC to have any sympathy for being patriotic. Years ago, there was a fellow in a bar that was talking down the military including a certain Regiment I was with. I took his glasses off, put them in his pocket and drove him in the face. That was it. One punch. When the RSM marched me into the old man, I was asked why I did it. Straight out told him the guy was insulting the CAF and Regiment. That just seemed to make matters worse with the boss. That was back in the '70's. The CoC is much more CYA than it was then. If they have to hang a few sailors to save themselves, they will.
ballz
Army.ca Veteran
- Reaction score
- 444
- Points
- 910
The Charter of Rights and Freedoms is designed to limit the government's powers. It guarantees that the *government* will not infringe upon your freedom of speech / expression etc... in other words, creating a law that could put you in jail for expressing yourself. It does *not* guarantee you against the social consequences of your actions.
These members, whether on duty or not, whether in uniform or not, whether they identified themselves as CAF members or not, conducted themselves in a manner that is below the standard of our profession. It's the same reason we put people on remedial measures for conduct when they commit a crime. Just like in the civilian world, this can have consequences.
http://www.mediaite.com/online/man-fired-over-fck-her-right-in-the-pssy-tv-confrontation/
Let's see, if one of these members were in the above article, would we be defending their "right" to go out and be and idiot? If it was one of my troops and they were identified as CAF members and it was on the news bringing the CAF into disrepute, I'd put them on a remedial measures in a heartbeat. Grievance? Go ahead. It's administrative law and there is video evidence of you doing said act. It's not hard to justify that this is below the standard expected of a CAF member conducting themselves outside of work. This is an easy win for the CoC.
These members, whether on duty or not, whether in uniform or not, whether they identified themselves as CAF members or not, conducted themselves in a manner that is below the standard of our profession. It's the same reason we put people on remedial measures for conduct when they commit a crime. Just like in the civilian world, this can have consequences.
http://www.mediaite.com/online/man-fired-over-fck-her-right-in-the-pssy-tv-confrontation/
Let's see, if one of these members were in the above article, would we be defending their "right" to go out and be and idiot? If it was one of my troops and they were identified as CAF members and it was on the news bringing the CAF into disrepute, I'd put them on a remedial measures in a heartbeat. Grievance? Go ahead. It's administrative law and there is video evidence of you doing said act. It's not hard to justify that this is below the standard expected of a CAF member conducting themselves outside of work. This is an easy win for the CoC.
- Reaction score
- 1,503
- Points
- 1,260
ballz said:
Hydro One rehires man fired after FHRITP incident
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/hydro-one-rehires-man-fired-after-fhritp-incident-1.3300059
See also,
Harrasment in public..Hydro One fires "jerk" for reporter prank
https://army.ca/forums/threads/119361.25
8 pages.
George Wallace
Army.ca Dinosaur
- Reaction score
- 182
- Points
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recceguy said:
Agreed. One of the individuals identified himself as being Cree. Metis was also brought up. Labeling these guys as members of a "far-right ultra-nationalist group" is really grasping at straws.
[Edit.....Lost connection and had to resubmit.]
gryphonv
Sr. Member
- Reaction score
- 338
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- 780
In the end these guys are mostly guilty of annoying/offending people who are professional crap disturbers.
I'm actually surprised they had as much restraint that I know I wouldn't of had seeing the protesters defacing the Canadian Flag, on Canada day no less. They claim the group of 5 'proud boys' were being inflammatory, intimidating, etc. To me what they did the flag is all of that and more.
If they(protesters) never went and DOX the 5 guys (which is illegal in Canada), this would of probably blown over. But again I go back to my point of them being professional crap disturbers.
I'm actually surprised they had as much restraint that I know I wouldn't of had seeing the protesters defacing the Canadian Flag, on Canada day no less. They claim the group of 5 'proud boys' were being inflammatory, intimidating, etc. To me what they did the flag is all of that and more.
If they(protesters) never went and DOX the 5 guys (which is illegal in Canada), this would of probably blown over. But again I go back to my point of them being professional crap disturbers.
Eye In The Sky
Army.ca Legend
- Reaction score
- 3,780
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ArmyVern said:
If this particular one has been challenged (freedom of speech, or association or peaceful assembly...whichever this would be...I am not a LawOp so...), I'd be very interested to read the ruling. (Seriously)
Maybe FJAG will stumble into this one... 8)
I, for one, am getting tired of all the double-standard in this country lately, this one included.
ballz
Army.ca Veteran
- Reaction score
- 444
- Points
- 910
mariomike said:
He may have been rehired while the arbitration was ongoing, he may have even won arbitration, but that doesn't mean he didn't face social consequences of his actions despite not facing *legal* consequences (which is what the Charter protects your from... which was my point).
Regardless, you can be held accountable by your employer for your off-duty conduct. This website amplifies and provides a list of real examples...
http://www.hrreporter.com/columnist/canadian-hr-law/archive/2015/05/19/whats-the-deal-with-off-duty-conduct/
People often forget that "freedom of association" is also a right for a very good reason.
J
jollyjacktar
Guest
I won't be surprised to hear these guys get hung, drawn and quartered by the system. At any rate, they're in for a few one way conversations come tomorrow, no doubt.
- Reaction score
- 1,503
- Points
- 1,260
ballz said:
Accountable? Our mayor was on crack. But, they couldn't get rid of him.
Meanwhile, guys where I worked were getting fired over juvenile stuff they posted on social media.
Another guy I knew was let go for an off-duty meeting with teenage girls involving beer and cigarettes.
http://www.hrreporter.com/sharedwidgets/systools/_printpost_.aspx?articleid=853
"Certain jobs require a high level of skill and a high level of trust from both employers and the public. For employees working in those types of positions, it’s possible that off-duty behaviour can call into question that trust, if it demonstrates poor judgment. And if an employer no longer has confidence that an employee has the judgment to perform a job of high skill and responsibility, the result could be dismissal."
They call it, "Professional conduct outside of profession".
I believe what saved the FHRITP guy was that his job was not one of "those types of positions".
He had some sort of technical engineering job with the power company.
ie: As long as the lights go on, electricity comes out of the wall sockets, and the elevators, air-conditioners and subways remain powered, are customers likely to complain?
That seems to be the way the arbitrator saw it.
That could apply to other employers and employees, depending on the type of position they hold.
Pfftt, 5 guys walking around with an old flag. Stern talking too, carry on. Charter rights are foundation law. As for this whole "we are a profession" thing, we don't punish people for on duty violations let alone have the time to go after folks for thought crimes.
I am more worried about you guys who think that being part of a racial group requires you to look the part, is ancestry not the primary determinate of race?
Just SJW fakenews media feeding frenzy? Imagine call folks names long enough and they start to push back...........
I am more worried about you guys who think that being part of a racial group requires you to look the part, is ancestry not the primary determinate of race?
Just SJW fakenews media feeding frenzy? Imagine call folks names long enough and they start to push back...........
- Reaction score
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I've seen no shortage of the "they're alt-right" narrative, but where are you seeing the "centrist/western values" read of the group? Honestly not poking, but interested.recceguy said:
I've only been able to find that sort of narrative on the U.S. PB FB page ...
... and the Canadian PB FB page:
milnews.ca said:
Someone might tell them the 1A and 2A are Yank things and never existed in constitutional monarchies. Drug war is a waste of money beyond border security which is itself a joke, it's harder to get salami into Canada than an illegal. Everything else is quite agreeable in my personal opinion. Certainly better than the smash a NAZI ANTIFA crowd who seems to define Nazi as everyone who is not them and are willing to use violence first rather than last.
- Reaction score
- 4,243
- Points
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And that end of the political spectrum continues to get scarier over time ...Lightguns said:
Blackadder1916
Army.ca Fixture
- Reaction score
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And now it seems that all five of the "Proud Boys" are military.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/proud-boys-canadian-military-indigenous-protest-disrupted-1.4189615
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/proud-boys-canadian-military-indigenous-protest-disrupted-1.4189615
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