Canadian Political Downward Spiral [Split from Reconstitution]

[RangerRay]

Pay MPs the equiv of a Cpl.

I’m only half-joking.

I know you’re joking, but I would just point out that that would guarantee only the wealthy could afford to run and hold office. No one would go through all the shit and abuse and responsibility of being an MP/MLA if they are going to receive a middling pay and benefits package or a pay cut.

Also, if you want corruption to flourish, pay government officials peanuts. They will be more highly incentivized to accept bribes.

 

[TacticalTea]

It's not just the Maritimes. Anywhere outside of Montreal and Toronto knows you're but a drop in the bucket. Ontario is a sea of Blue until you hit Whitby.

I sincerely wish for proportional representation in my lifetime.

What?

That's only going to make it worst.

As it stands, rural areas have more weight per vote. Ridings aren't all equal.

Proportional representation would give pretty much ALL the power to the metropolitan areas.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I know you’re joking, but I would just point out that that would guarantee only the wealthy could afford to run and hold office. No one would go through all the shit and abuse and responsibility of being an MP/MLA if they are going to receive a middling pay and benefits package or a pay cut.

Also, if you want corruption to flourish, pay government officials peanuts. They will be more highly incentivized to accept bribes.

I think your post highlights more problems that need to be solved in our political system.

 

[WLSC]

There's also arguments to be made about duplication of effort and prodding provinces into actually doing things for their residents.

As for expecting, say, free top-quality health care, I think it's understood (though expectations might be a bit high due to our neighbour's even more egregious situation) by a fair chunk of the population (including people who don't think of themselves as "left") that the very richest block of the population and of corporate entities could certainly pay [more/their] taxes without harming the economic success of Canada overall.

Absolutetly and we need those also. Let's take Health, there's an obvious need for standardisations from USQUE AD MARE. That's where the federal should play that federative role. You want kindengarden, great. Now negociate with the provinces and let them do their job. When it's unilateral, that's where the rift is build.

I know, it's completely utopic and ask for good will on all parts.

 

[ArmyRick]

Personally (and it will never fly), I really think we need elimination of Political Parties.

The Political Party is the ultimate self serving monster that consumes more power and loyalty from its members.

One only need look at the Trudeau Party (Its not really the Liberals, as some ex-liberals have said, if Trudeau walked, the party would collapse as it his brand still selling it) as a current example of this.

I would love to see a parliament consisting only of MPs that represent their ridings and that is it. With recall legislation available within each riding. Vote for the PM/Deputy PM separately.

I know I hear all cries about the parties used for promotion/campaigning, etc. However I kind of feel we need a functioning and "boring" nation. I really feel the Political Parties and their pitch of the "Other guys are bad..." ends up being the ultimate destructive force in governing.

Many of you know, I only temporary allegiances to political parties and sometimes NONE at all (I have voted for independent MP and MPP candidates many times). So if the party system of forming government would disappear, it wouldn't break my heart.

 

[TacticalTea]

Personally (and it will never fly), I really think we need elimination of Political Parties.

The Political Party is the ultimate self serving monster that consumes more power and loyalty from its members.

One only need look at the Trudeau Party (Its not really the Liberals, as some ex-liberals have said, if Trudeau walked, the party would collapse as it his brand still selling it) as a current example of this.

I would love to see a parliament consisting only of MPs that represent their ridings and that is it. With recall legislation available within each riding. Vote for the PM/Deputy PM separately.

I know I hear all cries about the parties used for promotion/campaigning, etc. However I kind of feel we need a functioning and "boring" nation. I really feel the Political Parties and their pitch of the "Other guys are bad..." ends up being the ultimate destructive force in governing.

Many of you know, I only temporary allegiances to political parties and sometimes NONE at all (I have voted for independent MP and MPP candidates many times). So if the party system of forming government would disappear, it wouldn't break my heart.

I think having the executive constituted from the legislative, as it is, precludes any movement away from partisan parliamentarianism.

The American system is better in that sense, but reverts to bipartisanship due to other failure points.

 

[IKnowNothing]

Personally (and it will never fly), I really think we need elimination of Political Parties.

..... However I kind of feel we need a functioning and "boring" nation.

That function is the biggest bar to getting rid of parties. Who sets the agenda? Tables budgets?

Then, say you scrapped all organized parties, and worked out the bureaucratic functional issues. How does anything get done with the hundreds of MP's chasing their own priorities on behalf of their own ridings? Absolute gridlock. No function. To break the gridlock they find common cause with like minded MP's from like minded ridings, loose associations and power blocs form, over time get more formalized and we're back on the road to parties.

 

[JLB50]

I don’t like JT even for one bit (I even don’t like calling him JT, it is derogatory toward the Jeep Gladiator ). I don’t like PP just the same. No Stateman on and over the horizon, non, nanda, zip, nothing.

I’m with you in that there’s a political vacuum that sucks like a Hoover (not necessarily the late U.S. president).

 

[Eye In The Sky]

That function is the biggest bar to getting rid of parties. Who sets the agenda? Tables budgets?

Then, say you scrapped all organized parties, and worked out the bureaucratic functional issues. How does anything get done with the hundreds of MP's chasing their own priorities on behalf of their own ridings? Absolute gridlock. No function. To break the gridlock they find common cause with like minded MP's from like minded ridings, loose associations and power blocs form, over time get more formalized and we're back on the road to parties.

Based on the last several years, I’m not convinced the current way is better.

 

[QV]

I don’t like JT even for one bit (I even don’t like calling him JT, it is derogatory toward the Jeep Gladiator ). I don’t like PP just the same. No Stateman on and over the horizon, non, nanda, zip, nothing.

Still, as of today I'll take PP over JT if it comes down to it. Without a blink.

 

[JLB50]

Another instance of Canada taking a downward spiral pertains to the Canadian attitudes toward the monarchy. I’m not trying to argue for against having the monarchy in this country. Yet many people want to replace it without realizing how complicated or costly it would be. On top of that, what do they want to replace it with? A republic like what those folks down south have? What we do or don’t do will have a profound effect on this country over the next few years.

We, as a nation, are more diverse but also far more fragmented than I’ve ever seen it. So what does Canada as a nation and what do its people really want? Basically, what do you get when you look into the soul of this country? Do you even see a soul (as George Bush might say)?

 

[WLSC]

I’m with you in that there’s a political vacuum that sucks like a Hoover (not necessarily the late U.S. president).

I would never associate Hoover (the late POTUS) and sucker. Kinda not goes together at all

 

[suffolkowner]

The Chinese stuff is just another straw on the camels back eventually too much to ignore.

Ive always thought we should appoint people to the Senate from the voters roll serve a 6 yr term or whatever with 1/3 turned over every 2 yrs, an experiment for sure but how bad could it be?

Why our MPs dont turf the PM like they do in the UK and Australia is beyond me

 

[WLSC]

Still, as of today I'll take PP over JT if it comes down to it. Without a blink.

JT and PP, same battle different angles. One at least work before politics. PP is as pessimist/agressive than the JT is sunny ways and that make me sick. None of them want or have any incline to listen to the other sides and make political compromise. In the opposition, you are suppose to lay what you would do, give option, nothing in that direction either, JT was like that and PP is the same. Nothing in both man is State hood level.

 

[JLB50]

I would never associate Hoover (the late POTUS) and sucker. Kinda not goes together at all

Hoover was a terrible president…yeah, yeah, I know many of the problems leading to the Depression started with Coolidge. And Hoover did a few things that FDR got credit for. But, still, he didn’t do much good during his years in office. In other words, he SUCKED…okay, like a Dyson.

 

[WLSC]

Hoover was a terrible president…yeah, yeah, I know many of the problems leading to the Depression started with Coolidge. And Hoover did a few things that FDR got credit for. But, still, he didn’t do much good during his years in office. In other words, he SUCKED…okay, like a Dyson.

To be fair, the POTUS before him were under the shadow of Lincoln in the sense that they add way less freedom of action. The taste for strong POTUS was not great. Teddy kinda start breaking that mold. That what I understand of my limited (compare to probably a lot of people here) of US history.

 

[JLB50]

I basically agree with you. I grew up in the U.S. educational system and, yes, I would say that Teddy Roosevelt really changed things. Wilson, Harding, Coolidge (I used to know his grandson) and Hoover were not what I’d call great leaders. Wilson was probably better suited to being the idealistic university chancellor he had been. The other presidents I mentioned were so-so at best. Mind you, I think FDR was, despite some of his missteps, one of the greatest leaders the U.S. ever had or will likely ever have.

 

[Halifax Tar]

The Chinese stuff is just another straw on the camels back eventually too much to ignore.

Ive always thought we should appoint people to the Senate from the voters roll serve a 6 yr term or whatever with 1/3 turned over every 2 yrs, an experiment for sure but how bad could it be?

Why our MPs dont turf the PM like they do in the UK and Australia is beyond me

I like it!

Hold a lottery perhaps ? Of only individuals making 100K or less a year ? Make it's something like jury duty but with decent pay and benefits, perhaps some job protection as well.

 

[QV]

I like it!

Hold a lottery perhaps ? Of only individuals making 100K or less a year ? Make it's something like jury duty but with decent pay and benefits, perhaps some job protection as well.

I'll do it if the senate assumes my remaining pension contributions during my term. I don't even need to go back after!

 

[YZT580]

Term limits. No one should spend their whole lives in politics doing nothing but that.

Make it attractive but not attractive enough to become complacent and a perpetual incumbent.

how about no one runs for office until they have actively served in the armed forces as was with the Spartans