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CEOTP (Continuing Ed Officer Trg Plan) 2003-2018 [Merged]

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Unknown21

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RobOfstie said:
There are some logistical details still being ironed out, yes.  However the rest of the program is coming together quite nicely.  AFAIK there are roughly 20 or so Seneca Candidates that were recruited to start at Seneca this fall.  We are the AB-Initio batch of students, so there aren't any RCAF Pilot-candidates at Seneca yet.  The training system is currrently firing on all cylinders so it would appear that the tight timelines for the program are not completely unreasonable.  They are having us complete the majority of our smaller courses this spring/summer prior to starting Seneca this fall.  AMT, Sea Survival, Land Survival, and Phase 1 in Portage prior to the start of the school year.  It's great because there is very little time sitting around on OJT.  Seneca in September for one school year, then Phase 2 & 3 back to back starting next spring.  Upon wings grad you return to Seneca for your final semesters while waiting for your OTU, which depending on what community you're in can be very long.  It's actually an excellent use of time/rsources as far as I'm concerned, and should definitely reduce the wait/cost of Pilot training in the CF, which was the idea behind the creation of this program. 

There's a quick overview of the program, if you have any questions let me know.

Cheers

Does anyone know if there will be more than one group or more than 20 applicants?

Based on what was said it sounds like they have a group already (and even started), so are no longer looking to recruit for this upcoming fall?

Anyone able to verify? Wondering as I just got merit listed and am wondering if I wont hear anything until next year now.... (if I'm competitive enough)
 

RobOfstie

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Sorry for the delayed response, it's been busy with all the courses happenings quickly.  To answer some of your questions; AFAIK NO, previous credit will granted towards the completion of the Seneca program.  The program is tailor made for the RCAF and you will be required to take all the same courses as everyone else.  As far as housing goes this is where the guessing game begins.  We have all been told to wait out on this, as Ottawa has yet to make a decision on whether it will be a full posting or a just TD in which case we would most likely live in Residence.  At this point it's anyone's guess so no pointing speculating.  As far as the number of people enrolled this year, there were 40 slots allocated for the Seneca program but they were only able to fill just over 20.  I would assume for this fiscal year the intake number would be around 40 as well with the group starting school Fall of 2014.  Interestingly enough I've Heard Seneca wanted min 20 students to run the program and there have already been a number of training failures at PFT with the new syllabus being so short.  The attrition rate there lately has been insane.  I don't know how many Seneca candidates are left but I guess we'll. See in the fall, provided I make it through PFT over the next 6 weeks haha. 

Zoomie-. I'm not too sure how it works in other communities, but here in TacHel guys are coming off phase 3 helo in droves and the wait for the OTU in Gagetown is now almost a year for most of them.  Since they aren't TAFO qualified that means they are sitting around not flying.  Perhaps the other communities are different??

Hopefully that answers some of your questions

Cheers
 

sebastian.s

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Hello everyone,
I have no idea if this is the right place to post but... I am looking to join the air force as a pilot (Transport or Fighter) and am deciding on which entry plan to use (ROTP or CEOTP-pilot). I am currently in grade 11. Could somebody tell me the specifics of both, as I'm not sure which is best for me. I am planning on doing my private pilot's license next summer (2014) through air cadets, which begins on July 1st and ends August 17. This means I cannot apply to CEOTP-pilot next year (officer training begins somewhere in July), which happens to be the year I graduate high school. Should I wait and take this entry plan the next year, or go to university/collage and then ROTP? Or should I drop the idea of the PPL as I will be trained anyways? Will it help me in any way? Again, sorry if this is in the wrong board, I'm new.
Edit: Source I used: http://www.forces.ca/en/job/pilot-32#education-3
 

Loachman

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This has been discussed here before.

Spend some time reading old threads and exploring via the Search Function.

If you cannot do some simple research on your own, y'ain't going to make t very far in the Pilot training programme.
 

hootbag

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Any updates on the program?  Have they decided on TD or posting for Seneca?  Any word on accommodations?  Will the program be moving to Seneca's new facility in Peterborough?

Thanks!!
 

RobOfstie

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Just a quick update for those who are interested / enrolled in this program.  We got the word about a month ago that we would be responsible for our own rations & quarters.  It's a prohibited posting to Toronto, which means you cannot move any furniture or effects, and you're not entitled to PLD or house hunting trip or any of the benefits that come along with a full posting.  We were told to very strongly consider living in Residence, and given that we cannot move any of our belongings or household items, it's really the only viable option.  Oh and by the way, Residence at Seneca Newnham Campus costs $1450.00/month each, including food & parking.  Certainly not cheap.

The program is based at the Newnham Campus.  The civilian aviation students will do their flying at the Buttonville Airport I believe.  For the RCAF students we are only doing academic studies while here so we will spend the majority if not all our time at Seneca Newnham.

There's the latest information, I'll update this thread as more information becomes available, since nobody seems to know anything about this program except those that are in it.  Even then we only get limited information, sporadically it seems. 

Cheers,

Rob 

 

 

aviatrixx

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I'm currently attending Seneca as part of the first class under the new AEAD program. There was a lot of speculation about this program as it was so new, that many facts were unanswered, essentially until we arrived on the ground here in Toronto.

I'm a former MARS officer with a few years in, so my application process was different than someone coming off the street. That said, if anyone has any particular questions about that please post them.

Last I checked there was little on the DIN or the website and the information between recruiting offices has differed, through no fault of their own but this program is just that new. The kinks are still being worked out.

It's important to note that since we're the first course, the program may change between now and next September, but for the time being this is how things are being done here.

1) 12 of the 13 members were prohibited posted to the school, (13th was prohib posted but on IR) this means PLD and a costed move was NOT provided, nor is a house hunting trip if you'd like to live off campus. Be prepared to pay the going rate for rent in Toronto unassisted while you are here. Basic living expenses in residence end up equating to roughly 60-65% of your net income as a 2Lt. I can't give you an exact number because everyone is a little different. But please be aware of this fact!

Food is your own cost (loosely worked in to the percentage above), but whether you choose to cook on a hot plate in your room or pay a meal plan is up to you. I think all of us are cooking. It's far cheaper. Again R&Q arrangements may change by 2014.

2) Residence is run to a civilian standard and is...ok. It's loud, but they are decent enough. Military members are housed two to a dorm and our rooms are clustered together so that makes studying easier.

3) Have money ready for ancillary fees, parking, books, gym pass and the like, (about 800$). Some fees and obviously your books are claimable but September is the busiest month for the admin cell so, you may not get your claims back right away. Again, no fault of their own. They are admittedly understaffed. You could ask for an advance, but it's just easier to have the money on hand so you're not left waiting without books etc.

4) This is a civilian school and you MUST be proactive with your learning. You're 1 of some 90 students (military is mixed in with civvies) in the program. IF you have problems you MUST sort them out quickly and on your own initiative.

5) We are not taking all the same classes as the civvie students. Classes for semester 1 are:

-Mechanics for Engineers (MEC110),
-Single Variable Calc (MTH110),
-Chemistry (CHEM300),
-Electronics (ELE100) and
-French (FSL100).

We were NOT able to apply for advanced standing in any courses (regardless of far along you may be in university, I was in 3rd year of a BSc). The only course that could be substituted was French. We are supposed to be taking some CAFJOD courses but there has been a delay in commencing those courses.

I would suggest looking up the courses on the Seneca site to see what you will cover. I've noticed the people straight out of highschool seem to be fine but people like me that haven't been in highschool for 11 years or in post sec sciences for 5 years are rusty!  I HIGHLY recommend either buying a used copy the text book or doing your own review based on the course material.  The age range of students is 17 to 33, with 20years old being about the average.

6) There is NO flying here, some students were told there would be. Though, the program chair is is trying to get us checked out on the King Air simulator they have at this campus.

7) Academic failures: you stop the Seneca program immediately and it will decided (by who I'm not sure) whether or not you can pursue another degree via regular CEOTP at a different Uni.

8 ) There's rumours that I've heard that you don't have to do PFT first. That's false.

9) You do two semesters here, then go to Moose Jaw for Ph2 and complete Ph3 (MJ or Portage) then finish 3 more semesters back here in Toronto and you're done!

10) Promotions are tied to the MOC qualification as per normal.


All in all once the kinks get worked out of the program it will be pretty awesome. But it's my personal opinion that this is an entry plan really suited to younger applicants. Being a mature student in this environment is, well, tiring! Again that's just a personal statement. Getting a CT is a gamble, so I decided it was best to jump at the chance,  chance of a life time really, than to risk it despite being pretty very close to finishing another degree.

Best of luck to anyone in the process, and I'm happy to provide you with any info I can.
 

DAA

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aviatrixx said:
Last I checked there was little on the DIN or the website and the information between recruiting offices has differed, through no fault of their own but this program is just that new. The kinks are still being worked out.

Glad to see someone from the program making themself available to answer questions.

There is a CANFORGEN available on this program that came out in early 2012, which CFRC's have/were sent and they also have several presentations and information guides at their disposal so they can explain CEOTP/AEAD Pilot to applicants.  Why they don't read these and provide this information, is anyone's guess.  It's probably just easier to say "I don't know!"    :(
 

aviatrixx

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DAA,

They made some of the documentation available, but I only had access to it because I was already in, you know? I also had an agreeable chain that  sent queries on my behalf. But honestly, other than that the program was a go I had scant details until early August 2013; I took my transfer in Nov 2012. By the time I left BC, my local recruiting centre, try as they might didn't have any more details.

Oh well, a new program is always going to have hiccups!
 

SkyHeff

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Thanks for the update. I've had a number of senior applicants inquire as to getting into pilot via the AEAD program. The timeframe is very appealing to them, but we usually get a few questions on the life & environment.

Thanks again for passing it on.
 

aviatrixx

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Heff, my pleasure. This forum served me well in the past when I was looking for info. It's the least I can do!
 

MikeD

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Thank you for the information.

You said you were a 2Lt. Is everyone else in the course one as well? I was thinking everyone would be an officer cadet?
 

aviatrixx

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Yup. Everyone is a 2Lt. I just held my rank when I  CT'd from the NavRes (mere weeks away from S/Lt, but oh well, they probably wouldn't have let me keep it anyway!)

I'd imagine this is so because upon the completion of Basic in the Reg Force, obviously you are commissioned.  And since basic and PFT are requirements for the Seneca program, you're a 2Lt throughout your training. I think you're given back pay to the date you were eligible for Lt, but the next promotion you see is Captain once you've got your wings. **Not sure on this...**

Regardless, unless they decide to start withholding commissions until completion of additional training like Reserve MARS, you won't stay an OCdt like a lot of CEOTP program entrants. Which is nice!

Thanks!
 

MikeD

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Thanks a lot for the information. Do you have to be in uniform for school? Also, are you staying at the Newham campus for the duration of your education? I know that the aviation program is moving to Seneca's new Peterborough campus next year but since this is a special program I wasn't sure if students of this program had to move as well?
 

aviatrixx

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MikeD,

You are indeed in your 3's for class, except on Fridays when flight suits are permitted.

We will stay in Newnham for classes, as far as I can tell. The move to Peterborough only affects the civvie students in second year and beyond as they commence their flying at that time. We don't do any flying with the school, so we stay at the main campus.

Hope this helps!
 

MdB

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Actually, all CFRCs have received the documentation on AEAD. Those who answer that they don't know is because they did not prepare adequately.

It's good to hear from someone who is actually in the program. There is few positions and CAF did have a hard time to fill them because of the selection process.

The program is very streamlined and offers noticeable advantages over ROTP, but if you fail, you cannot change to any other CEOTP because none are available, but for Nursing Officer, all others are currently closed. The program offers no leeway whatsoever because all courses are prerequisites for the next ones. The remaining option when you fall off the imposed academic calendar is to go NCM trade.
 

s2184

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Hi Aviatrixx, I am in Seneca; doing commercial pilot program. What is included in your curriculum? How many and what courses you have to finish in Seneca? Thank you!
 

aviatrixx

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Hi, the courses mentioned in the post are what we are required to take for this semester. Next semester is the roughly the same though this hasn't been confirmed.  When we get back from Moose Jaw after our first two semesters, we're here for another year and a bit but I can't confirm what we will be taking nor how many credits we will be required to complete. Sorry, that info just ins't available; to me anyway!
 

s2184

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Thank you for your information. Today I saw around 7/8 students (with their uniform) in Markham campus. The courses you are taking are part of the Aviation Technology full-time program (is moved to Peterborough). http://www.senecac.on.ca/fulltime/FPR.html
 

aviatrixx

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Thanks S2184,

Well I'm aware of the program than I'm in but thanks for the link!  ;) However, we're not following that outline exactly nor are we in Peterborough for any portion of our training. We don't take electives, so for semester 2 we are taking:

Mechanics 200
Math 200
Physics 200
Material Sciences 300
Electronics 200

If you see us again, come say hi!
 
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