General Election: Oct 21, 2019

[Remius]

Do you think a practicing Muslim would be able to be prime minister?

if Mayor Nenshi can be elected as Mayor of Calgary then I think it is possible. 

But if he mixes politics and his personal faith, less so. 

 

[FJAG]

...
What is this horseshit about not being able to hold conservative views and be PM?  What is Justin Trudeau's personal view on abortion?

My point isn't the individual. It's the social conservative movement in the party as a whole that's the issue. Any one person is welcome to their own beliefs but when a whole sector in the party is moving that way then the average Canadian has a lack of trust. As I said before; just look south of the border if you want to see what a social conservative movement can do. That scares the hell out of me personally and a lot of other "progressive" conservatives.

:cheers:

 

[Brad Sallows]

I'm jaded.  People have been having anxiety attacks about "so-cons" since Reagan was supposed to initiate nuclear war to bring on Armageddon on behalf of the televangelists.  The people who sincerely think a "handmaid's tale" is imminent are one of the current symptoms of the (mental) disease.

 

[FJAG]

I'm jaded.  People have been having anxiety attacks about "so-cons" since Reagan was supposed to initiate nuclear war to bring on Armageddon on behalf of the televangelists.  The people who sincerely think a "handmaid's tale" is imminent are one of the current symptoms of the (mental) disease.

Brad. You cite two extremist views neither of which is held by the vast majority of the people concerned with social conservatism. Social conservatists' desire to place restrictions on same sex marriage and other LGBTQ rights, comprehensive sex education in public schools and abortion stand out as the principle issues that set social conservatists apart from the more centrist and progressive members in Canadian society. These concerns are not "current symptoms of the (mental) disease" as you so cavalierly phrase it. They are a very real concern by many in our society and unless the CPC comes to grip with that understanding rather than dismissing it out of hand, we might never be able to get rid of the LPC -- and maybe we don't deserve to.

Again. Look south. The lessons are there for all to see.

:cheers:

 

[AbdullahD]

Do you think a practicing Muslim would be able to be prime minister?

Well, if their is a practicing Muslim, who is in any way competent.. he would be an amazing choice for the CPC next election

But right now I have not seen a capable Muslim politician in Canada.. so no

But politics and religion should remain seperate.. so yes...

Interesting question once thought upon deeper.
Abdullah

 

[Sub_Guy]

Again. Look south. The lessons are there for all to see.

:cheers:

I disagree. We are nothing like our neighbours to the south. 

The Conservatives ran this country for what? Nearly a decade? I don’t recall anything being mentioned about the party, (not individual MPs) having a desire to change abortion laws, same-sex marriage, or LGBTQ rights. It’s always a 3rd party claiming the Conservatives have a “hidden agenda”.  Canadian media does a great job helping the LPC as well, every time they interviewed a Conservative candidate they made sure to work the topic of abortion into the conversation. It seemed like everyone except the Conservative party was bringing the subject up.

Two very different countries. 

 

[Brad Sallows]

>You cite two extremist views neither of which is held by the vast majority of the people concerned with social conservatism.

Certainly not extreme.  Reagan-will-unleash-Armageddon was an occasionally recurring feature in the MSM (since back in those days, all I had was MSM as a font of information), and the "The Handmaid's Tale" was essentially unremarked upon until people started circulating their weird anxieties in today's left-leaning portion of the MSM.  Some people hold it up as an example of what they fear will come to pass.  Those people are unmoored from reality.

The point isn't that a large majority has to believe each particular piece of nonsense.  Those are two examples of bizarre concerns from a long list of imaginary futures that people keep in their heads.  The point is that a large number of people are overwrought over things they imagine which are highly unlikely to occur.  No-one that anxious is completely healthy.  Of course, they might know full well they are behaving hysterically purely as a rhetorical device - 1) Republicans, 2) ???, 3) Handmaid's Tale!.  That's still unhealthy, but differently so.

Most infringements of rights and liberty in general will emerge from the political left as it continues its war on thought and expression and property, not because some private member's bill emerges in the House to try and fight its way past the House, Senate, and courts.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

But right now I have not seen a capable Muslim politician in Canada.. so no

https://muslimlink.ca/news/muslim-canadians-who-won-in-the-2019-federal-election

There are 12 Muslim politicians after this election out of 338 seats - so 3.5% of all elected Federal politicians.  2 of them were Ministers in the last government - s close to 6% representation.

I find Omar Alghabra to  be both personable and effective.  He was the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of International Trade Diversification.  I was fortunate enough to sit next to him at a dinner with him last year, and I found him to be knowledgeable, interested, and well-informed about the world, Canada's place in it, and even the role of the military.

There is also this guy:

Ziad Aboultaif, Conservative Member of Parliament for  Edmonton Manning
Lebanese Canadian Ziad Aboultaif co-managed Axxess Furniture Inc., an Edmonton-based furniture distribution business, for 12 years.

Elected in 2015, Ziad Aboultaif proposed the failed Private Member's Bill C-223 aimed at establishing a Canadian Organ Donor Registry. In 2003, Aboultaif made a partial-liver donation. Since 2017, he has served as the Official Opposition Shadow Minister for International Development. In this role, he has had the opportunity to travel to many countries that receive development assistance from Canada, such as Nicaragua, Lebanon, Jordan, Senegal, Nigeria, and Bangladesh

This fella looks interesting:

Sameer Zuberi, Liberal Member of Parliament for Pierrefonds-Dollard
Sameer Zuberi, a 39-year old father of two, holds degrees in law from Université du Québec à Montréal (UQAM) and mathematics from Concordia University. He has worked in the areas of university administration, law, media relations, human rights, and served in the Canadian Forces Reserves.

Interesting Fact: Sameer is of mixed race Pakistani-Italian-Scottish heritage.

So I guess it is indeed possible....and of course the religion of an MP is completely immaterial.

 

[Remius]

I disagree. We are nothing like our neighbours to the south. 

The Conservatives ran this country for what? Nearly a decade? I don’t recall anything being mentioned about the party, (not individual MPs) having a desire to change abortion laws, same-sex marriage, or LGBTQ rights. It’s always a 3rd party claiming the Conservatives have a “hidden agenda”.  Canadian media does a great job helping the LPC as well, every time they interviewed a Conservative candidate they made sure to work the topic of abortion into the conversation. It seemed like everyone except the Conservative party was bringing the subject up.

Two very different countries.

I agree with most of this.  But the conservatives do themselves no favours when someone like Trost who ran for the leadership put abortion and gay marriage front and center in his leadership bid.  Or that there were elements of the party trying to get at least 50 pro life members elected.  There is a segment of the party that wants to get enough influence to reopen that debate.  I don’t think the agenda is hidden or what not.  Just a conflict within the party that isn’t resolved. 

I fully expect the social conservatives to come out in force if there is a leadership race.

 

[Jarnhamar]

I agree with most of this.  But the conservatives do themselves no favours when someone like Trost who ran for the leadership put abortion and gay marriage front and center in his leadership bid. 

So, I guess I dont know as much about politics as I thought. I've never heard about social conservatives before reading it here yesterday.

Are the majority of conservatives these social conservatives that are against gay marriage, are pro-life * and generally how they're described on Wikipedia? Or would social conservatives be a smaller  more extreme type group?

We really need a middle party. All the moderates from each political partys get together and find a way to work together to find balanced ways to deal with stuff. We need to unseat the Liberal/Conservative mafia.




*I think the pro-choice/pro-life argument can extend beyond religious aspects so not just religion driven.

 

[GR66]

I disagree. We are nothing like our neighbours to the south. 

The Conservatives ran this country for what? Nearly a decade? I don’t recall anything being mentioned about the party, (not individual MPs) having a desire to change abortion laws, same-sex marriage, or LGBTQ rights. It’s always a 3rd party claiming the Conservatives have a “hidden agenda”.  Canadian media does a great job helping the LPC as well, every time they interviewed a Conservative candidate they made sure to work the topic of abortion into the conversation. It seemed like everyone except the Conservative party was bringing the subject up.

Two very different countries.

Speaking as someone who voted CPC (with some reservations) I can see where some socially progressive Canadians might have some reservations about the Conservatives under Scheer.  You are 100% correct about the Conservatives under Harper not having a "hidden agenda" and I had no fear of any kind of rights rollback under him as PM. 

Andrew Scheer isn't Stephen Harper though.  Harper and his core team had very firm control over the party and its agenda.  I don't think many Canadian believe that Andrew Scheer would have anywhere near that kind of control over some of the more socially conservative elements of the party.  Add to that his own comments in the past about his personal beliefs on these matters and a level of doubt is allowed to creep in on the issue. 

With the weight of the electorate in more socially liberal urban areas in Canada I think any attempt to roll back any existing rights would be political suicide for the Conservatives so don't believe in a million years that ANY CPC leader would do anything like that.  But that tiny seed of doubt that Andrew Scheer has allowed to creep in may have been one more reason for people to put their vote elsewhere this time around.

:2c:

 

[Journeyman]

Interesting Fact: Sameer is of mixed race Pakistani-Italian-Scottish heritage.

No interest in his religious beliefs, but I'm intrigued by the potential dinner offerings.  op:

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

Obviously, curried spaghetti with haggis-balls sauce.

;D

 

[Blackadder1916]

Halal Haggis Ravioli

https://www.nytimes.com/2002/11/19/world/edinburgh-journal-haggis-the-food-of-poets-well-one-scottish-poet.html

Mr. Crombie said he also had begun to make halal haggis, prepared in accordance with ritual slaughter, for Muslim customers, and Mr. Macsween produced a list of recipes for red peppers stuffed with haggis, ''wee cocktail haggis'' canapés and pasta fillings. ''You haven't lived until you've had haggis ravioli,'' he said.

 

[AbdullahD]

...

2 things in this thread have confirmed, I live under a rock.

Proud of the Muslim MP's, from my heart. Thanks for pointing them out.

Halal haggis eh? I thought I was safe from that stuff since I converted... time to torture the kids ^^

Abdullah

 

[ballz]

It is clear that the poster is speaking of his opinion, and that of others.  Having an opinion different than yours does not a troll make.  The negative response from other posters does however seem to confirm his opinion of conservatives....

First off, I'm not conservative. Nor did I vote CPC (or PPC or libertarian for that matter) this time round. I couldn't vote for any of the clowns, and since my riding was going to be a slam dunk for the CPC anyway I showed up and scratched my ballot.

I read his posts as the thread developed and genuinely believe there is someone on the other end that is deliberately making comments about Scheer in areas where Trudeau is actually the worst offender of the same/similar character offense by ten-fold, in order to get others wound up. The fact that it is subtle / believable is why it's "master" level, as the best trolling goes undetected. That's why I never responded, because it looks like legit trolling.

I.e. Commenting on how dishonest Scheer is and cannot be trusted, while simultaneously actively supporting Trudeau who is a documented liar on something with seriously grave consequences to Canadians...

Commenting on how Scheer "may have" broken the law re: insurance licensing which is a "big deal," while simultaneously actively supporting Trudeau who has broken 2 ethics laws and likely committed a breach of trust...

Commenting on how Scheer has no idea what it's like to grow up in the "real world" and has no "real world experience," while in the same sentence giving Trudeau a pass despite that he was born into political royalty.

His comments towards CPC voters were not exactly astute, re: how tight the election is... "What's wrong with voters?"


If it's not trolling, oh well... I'm just calling it as I see it, and choosing not to let those types of weird arguments (trolling or just genuinely oblivious) get me wound up and suck time away from discussing more credible differences between the leaders. Particularly since I wasn't exactly in love with Scheer either.

 

[Jarnhamar]

[quote author=Ballz]

Commenting on how Scheer "may have" broken the law re: insurance licensing which is a "big deal," while simultaneously actively supporting Trudeau who has broken 2 ethics laws and likely committed a breach of trust...

[/quote]

You forgot sexually assaulted a reporter.

 

[mariomike]

You forgot sexually assaulted a reporter.

Shocking. How could anyone be a cheerleader for an individual like that?

"I don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything. Grab them by the pu--y. You can do anything."

 

[AbdullahD]

Is this satire? Get 15k for being fired??? What about UI, like us plebs?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/house-of-commons-transition-services-1.5335399

 

[mariomike]

Is this satire? Get 15k for being fired??? What about UI, like us plebs?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/house-of-commons-transition-services-1.5335399

Politicians are not employees. E.g. They couldn't fire Rob Ford. Can they fire federal politicians?