Well put. The West Bank is full of examples reaching too far and pushing too hard. It's illogical to expect that the West Bank citizens won't push back. I know I would in a similar circumstance if Minnesotans for example began illegally demolishing towns and colonizing Southern Manitoba. Israel needs a total ban on West Bank settlements and to comply with their agreements.
Leave to where? No one wants them and it's almost impossible for them to get visas to the developed world, if they could afford the application to begin with.
So stay where you are and die. Great plan.
I think the main difference is that there aren’t bombs falling (on good targets or not) in those other countries.
Gonna look a malnourished 8 year old Palestinian with PTSD in the face and say that? About half of Gazans now weren't born when Hamas was elected in 2006. There is something to be said about their out of control birth rates, poor education and poor economic policy that created and maintains this hellscape, view it through that lens and you may find some empathy for the people in Gaza. People, not subhumans, orcs even who are guilty to a man. This isn't to excuse the terrorists who support Hamas but broad strokes aren't useful.
Starting at what age? What makes an individual Palestinian start being morally culpable in the eyes of Quirky for everything that goes on there? What are the criteria whereby any given individual Palestinian loses any righteous claim to innocent victimhood?
the eternal questions aren't they. Were German soldiers responsible for the atrocities committed by the Gestapo? Were the citizens in neighbouring centres responsible for the crimes committed in adjacent camps? Are Russian citizens liable because their army is executing pow's. The answer to all is morally yes. But it takes a brave man to stand up to their government or leaders and say that they are wrong and then refuse the orders. Could you do it?
Probably voting age, as long as they're still allowed to vote for their government.
Participates in something wrong, or expresses approval.
What if they vote against Hamas? Or abstain from voting out of fear should they vote against them?
Completely fair.
Absolutely. But I wouldn’t pose that question to you because you wouldn’t set the line up in the first place. Quirky likes to deal in absolutes, sometimes some pretty inhumane ones. I’m just curious if he can articulate complete consideration of the fact set on this one. I don’t imagine he’ll approach the level of nuance I know you’re capable of, but I wonder if he can be coherent?
Ultimately it's still their government, and they're accountable for what it does, the same way I as a Canadian taxpayer and citizen am accountable for everything the Government of Canada has done, does, and will do. I can't opt out of outrages or apologies, misappropriations or compensations.
This article here disputes that line of thinking.
reason.com
It's not a binary. We have some degree of responsibility between "none" and "complete".
Your statement was binary though.
maybe Gazans should try not attacking Israel for a generation and see how that works out?
Yes, for extraordinarily broad values of "accountable".
Parties interested in the welfare of Palestinians could privately raise funds to pay them to be docile, and given the relative power of various economies and currencies it would probably not cost very much. Instead they let countries like Iran play sugar daddy.
Surely you’re not trying to suggest your average Gazan can safely criticize their government the way you or I can?
