• Thanks for stopping by. Logging in to a registered account will remove all generic ads. Please reach out with any questions or concerns.

Indirect Fires Modernization Project - C3/M777 Replacement

If the whispers I've heard about new energetic storage and processing infra are true then Canada will be well served.
Oh please god yes. Apply that same thinking to Naval Ordinance onboard ships.
The expansion to support units is also long overdue.
I will stand by my belief there are tooany ammo techs and what we need are better trained supply techs that can make a career track out of ammo.
From the officer side they finally recognized that Naval Combat Systems Engineers don't need to take half the ammo courses the Log O's do for their Ammo Officer qualifications. It will reduce their training time by half or something like that. Mainly because they get that training elsewhere already (ammo safety quals for example).
 
If the whispers I've heard about new energetic storage and processing infra are true then Canada will be well served.
The expansion to support units is also long overdue.
I will stand by my belief there are tooany ammo techs and what we need are better trained supply techs that can make a career track out of ammo.

I did write a memo/service paper suggesting this shortly after I got back.
The senior ATO at the time, understandably, pointed at Supply Tech levels which were in the shitter and said it was a non starter.

Interesting.
 
Oh please god yes. Apply that same thinking to Naval Ordinance onboard ships.

From the officer side they finally recognized that Naval Combat Systems Engineers don't need to take half the ammo courses the Log O's do for their Ammo Officer qualifications. It will reduce their training time by half or something like that. Mainly because they get that training elsewhere already (ammo safety quals for example).

The RCN does ammo so silly on ships.

Ammo accountability has been abysmal in every ship I have inspected. I have another ship and a sub this week to inspect.
 
The RCN does ammo so silly on ships.

Ammo accountability has been abysmal in every ship I have inspected. I have another ship and a sub this week to inspect.
The RCN also blew up Halifax a couple of times...(ok, only once was actually our fault.) So, Vol 3 ships is based on not letting that happen again.

Let's put heavy mats at the foot of the ladders as we move small arms ammo onboard....then in case someone drops a can, they won't damage the deck nor the ammo can.

The rules I was given to consider were....overboard....so I twitted with them at one point. I was asked for my plan to re-ammo the ship with 680 rounds of SAA once as a part of our FP ammo loadout. Moving it from D-40 to the jetty.

The 'safe' method was to have the ship's truck swapped with a properly placarded vehicle borrowed from CFAD, escorted by a fire truck to ensure the ammo didn't spontaneously combust.

The 'backup' plan was to walk through the yard with the ammo can in hand, followed by a sailor carrying a water based fire extinguisher.

Those were COA 1 and COA 2. COA 3 was that I'd walk over, pick up the can, and bring it back to the ship.

All 3 COAs went to Formation Ammo, and they 'let' me do COA 3.

Realistically, you can stub out a cigarette with a 5.56 round and it won't go off.
 
The RCN also blew up Halifax a couple of times...(ok, only once was actually our fault.) So, Vol 3 ships is based on not letting that happen again.

Let's put heavy mats at the foot of the ladders as we move small arms ammo onboard....then in case someone drops a can, they won't damage the deck nor the ammo can.

The rules I was given to consider were....overboard....so I twitted with them at one point. I was asked for my plan to re-ammo the ship with 680 rounds of SAA once as a part of our FP ammo loadout. Moving it from D-40 to the jetty.

The 'safe' method was to have the ship's truck swapped with a properly placarded vehicle borrowed from CFAD, escorted by a fire truck to ensure the ammo didn't spontaneously combust.

The 'backup' plan was to walk through the yard with the ammo can in hand, followed by a sailor carrying a water based fire extinguisher.

Those were COA 1 and COA 2. COA 3 was that I'd walk over, pick up the can, and bring it back to the ship.

All 3 COAs went to Formation Ammo, and they 'let' me do COA 3.

Realistically, you can stub out a cigarette with a 5.56 round and it won't go off.

Not really what I was getting at.

My intent is more about the material accounting practices and processes.
 
The RCN also blew up Halifax a couple of times...(ok, only once was actually our fault.) So, Vol 3 ships is based on not letting that happen again.

Let's put heavy mats at the foot of the ladders as we move small arms ammo onboard....then in case someone drops a can, they won't damage the deck nor the ammo can.

The rules I was given to consider were....overboard....so I twitted with them at one point. I was asked for my plan to re-ammo the ship with 680 rounds of SAA once as a part of our FP ammo loadout. Moving it from D-40 to the jetty.

The 'safe' method was to have the ship's truck swapped with a properly placarded vehicle borrowed from CFAD, escorted by a fire truck to ensure the ammo didn't spontaneously combust.

The 'backup' plan was to walk through the yard with the ammo can in hand, followed by a sailor carrying a water based fire extinguisher.

Those were COA 1 and COA 2. COA 3 was that I'd walk over, pick up the can, and bring it back to the ship.

All 3 COAs went to Formation Ammo, and they 'let' me do COA 3.

Realistically, you can stub out a cigarette with a 5.56 round and it won't go off.
The biggest problem with ammo movement on ships comes from the fact that for a long time there was little understanding of the difference between safe handling alongside an ammunition jetty at an ammo facility, and safe handling onboard ship.

Understandably ammo facilities are much more stringent with the rules. As an Ammo Safety Officer it was my job to point out that those same rules don't actually apply to ships not alongside an ammo jetty. Sea Training came out with an msg that pointed out the same. Much of the overcautiousness was removed. It was done to break the previous assumptions and educate CO's who've through their whole career saw it done a certain way. also force lazy Ammo Safety onboard ship to actually read their own damn documents. Examples of changes:

You can smoke on ship, just not within 3m of the transfer route.
You can wear a hat if you like.
Just have to be HERP safe for the particular ammunition and only if the ammo is exposed outside its packing, not fully shut down electronically.
No phones while transferring but that's not for HERP safety its because that's a general safety policy when moving heavy things.

The new one is no cannabis 24hrs before handling ammo. I always make an announcement the day before to remind folks.

And you can transfer ammo in harbour, its not a big deal for 20mm and below sizes, and certainly not a big deal for pyro though people act like its the end of the world when you propose it. I've just had a truck pull up instead of going all the way to the ammo jetty sometimes (for small orders).

Right now for ammo the biggest concern is JSS. The NEQ for that ship is quite large at full load. Though with the energetic/ignition changes of modern explosives I have questions on the validity of NEQ as it currently exists as a proxy for risk. @AmmoTech90 probably can speak better on this.
 
The biggest problem with ammo movement on ships comes from the fact that for a long time there was little understanding of the difference between safe handling alongside an ammunition jetty at an ammo facility, and safe handling onboard ship.

Understandably ammo facilities are much more stringent with the rules. As an Ammo Safety Officer it was my job to point out that those same rules don't actually apply to ships not alongside an ammo jetty. Sea Training came out with an msg that pointed out the same. Much of the overcautiousness was removed. It was done to break the previous assumptions and educate CO's who've through their whole career saw it done a certain way. also force lazy Ammo Safety onboard ship to actually read their own damn documents. Examples of changes:

You can smoke on ship, just not within 3m of the transfer route.
You can wear a hat if you like.
Just have to be HERP safe for the particular ammunition and only if the ammo is exposed outside its packing, not fully shut down electronically.
No phones while transferring but that's not for HERP safety its because that's a general safety policy when moving heavy things.

The new one is no cannabis 24hrs before handling ammo. I always make an announcement the day before to remind folks.

And you can transfer ammo in harbour, its not a big deal for 20mm and below sizes, and certainly not a big deal for pyro though people act like its the end of the world when you propose it. I've just had a truck pull up instead of going all the way to the ammo jetty sometimes (for small orders).

Right now for ammo the biggest concern is JSS. The NEQ for that ship is quite large at full load. Though with the energetic/ignition changes of modern explosives I have questions on the validity of NEQ as it currently exists as a proxy for risk. @AmmoTech90 probably can speak better on this.
Is there a no alcohol 24hrs before handling ammo in place as well?
 
Back
Top