Infantry training in Air Force

[QV]

Any consideration needs to include the CAF requirement for deployable security as well.

I feel like my solution to this solves several problems:

Provides domestic force protection
Provides deployable force protection
Actually have SME doing the force protection and not somebody's secondary duty
Free up all other trades to focus on primary role
Units free to manage disciplinary matters
Crime properly dealt with by outside police force not under command of CAF - there is your arms length
Gives RCMP another federal mandate (as contract policing may be on a downward spiral)
Would be a pretty cool job with all the specialties that branch off from it

 

[OldSolduer]

I feel like my solution to this solves several problems:

Provides domestic force protection
Provides deployable force protection
Actually have SME doing the force protection and not somebody's secondary duty
Free up all other trades to focus on primary role
Units free to manage disciplinary matters
Crime properly dealt with by outside police force not under command of CAF - there is your arms length
Gives RCMP another federal mandate (as contract policing may be on a downward spiral)
Would be a pretty cool job with all the specialties that branch off from it

Similar to an RAF Regiment?

 

[Blackadder1916]

Similar to an RAF Regiment?

And they can also use them for drill and ceremonial . . .

WATCH: Britain's Most Impressive Drill Regiment?

One of the most anticipated performers over the years at the Royal Edinburgh Military Tattoo has been the Queen's Colour Squadron - an RAF regiment which has become known for its flawlessly polished drill routines...

www.forces.net

 

[QV]

And they can also use them for drill and ceremonial . . .

WATCH: Britain's Most Impressive Drill Regiment?

One of the most anticipated performers over the years at the Royal Edinburgh Military Tattoo has been the Queen's Colour Squadron - an RAF regiment which has become known for its flawlessly polished drill routines...

www.forces.net

Praetorian Guard crossed with Household Division - I'm in.

 

[quadrapiper]

Any consideration needs to include the CAF requirement for deployable security as well.

Might there not be a good argument for the base security force to be structured in a way that makes it awkward to deploy, to avoid it being used as a handwave solution for both requirements?

 

[dapaterson]

Might there not be a good argument for the base security force to be structured in a way that makes it awkward to deploy, to avoid it being used as a handwave solution for both requirements?

That's a valid concern, but at the same time there's value in building relationships between supported and supporting units well in advance of deployed operations. Finding that balance...

 

[SeaKingTacco]

That's a valid concern, but at the same time there's value in building relationships between supported and supporting units well in advance of deployed operations. Finding that balance...

One organization that has both a deployable and stay at home element?

 

[daftandbarmy]

Might there not be a good argument for the base security force to be structured in a way that makes it awkward to deploy, to avoid it being used as a handwave solution for both requirements?

Having done the job before (in the base and off the base) it is not rocket science, seriously, or we couldn't have done it.

Any military organization could easily do a guard force for an airfield, or any other kind of fixed installation. Yes, even the Navy

Like anything else the military does, however, people need some proper training, support services (police attached, for example) and equipment.

Again, this should not be impossible to do outside the scope of what we currently have already.

And, yes, I think this job is completely within the range of possibility for a reserve Brigade to manage, assuming they get enough Class B/C positions allocated.

 

[brihard]

Taking 'police' out of the Military Police would be the best COA. The MPs should be folded into DGDS and be the deployable and domestic Force Protection unit of the CAF providing everything from airfield security, WASF, BASF, closed base security, to convoy escorts and camp/FOB security and defence in theatre. They would still have or increase their specialized functions such as TASO, CP, dog handling, etc, perhaps absorb the maritime security gig also. But ditch the policing and turn that over to the RCMP. Unit disciplinary matters are handled by the unit and crime is handled by the RCMP. The CAF could then significantly reduce it's reliance on the Commissionaires and save big dollars.

Done. No more AVN Techs pulling a night shift at the WASF guard shack while fighter maintenance suffers.

Still need a deployable policing capability too- criminal investigations on deployed ops/OUTCAN.

Disagreed with defaulting to RCMP for all CAF policing. There’s nothing inherently federal about a domestic assault or a mental health crisis in the PMQ patch, or drug trafficking within a unit. For most stuff, local police of jurisdiction should be fine. Fund a couple positions for Pembroke OPP, or Halifax Police, or what have you. Some would obviously end up RCMP anyway, but purely by virtue of contract policing.

Now, fair question to ask- could the MPs sustain something like CFNIS without local MP detachment policing as a farm team? I don’t know enough about MP career development, but I expect they learn the basics of investigation from small detachment level files. One way or another CAF will need deployable investigative peace officers, and I don’t see the RCMP voluntarily accepting a task-dump of what would essentially just new contract policing. CAF might not like the bill, either.

 

[RangerRay]

If only there were a “Security Branch”…

 

[Furniture]

Having done the job before (in the base and off the base) it is not rocket science, seriously, or we couldn't have done it.

Any military organization could easily do a guard force for an airfield, or any other kind of fixed installation. Yes, even the Navy

Like anything else the military does, however, people need some proper training, support services (police attached, for example) and equipment.

Again, this should not be impossible to do outside the scope of what we currently have already.

And, yes, I think this job is completely within the range of possibility for a reserve Brigade to manage, assuming they get enough Class B/C positions allocated.

The problem is, if we have the airfields defended by full-time part-time soldiers, why not just make it a full-time job for full-time people?

It's not like we couldn't have a full-time civilian airfield/base security force in Canada, and train reserve/regular forces to fill the role as required on deployed Ops. The RCN found a way to create the NST, so I suspect the CA and RCAF can come up with something similar.

 

[ueo]

The airport Special Constables did their training in Regina but it was a shorter course. They were paid less than a regular and were hired for specific locations; i.e., someone who signed up for Gander International Airport couldn't be posted to Calgary International without their agreement. When the program first started in the early 1970s, their enrolment standards were also lower; could be shorter, wear glasses and be married (back then prospective mounties - and a lot of other police, e.g. Nfld Constab - needed to be much bigger, fitter, single and male). Some used it as a stepping stone and later transferred to the regular ranks which required them to go back to depot to upgrade so that they could wear the scarlet.

This article from the Globe and Mail back in 1972 was about the switch at PIA.

New force is planned for airport. (1972, Dec 11). The Globe and Mail (1936-) Retrieved from https://www.proquest.com/historical-newspapers/new-force-is-planned-airport/docview/1241643907/se-2

Maybe policing is within the close perimeter of the terminals while protection (military) is te perimeter and onsite threats.

 

[ueo]

The problem is, if we have the airfields defended by full-time part-time soldiers, why not just make it a full-time job for full-time people?

It's not like we couldn't have a full-time civilian airfield/base security force in Canada, and train reserve/regular forces to fill the role as required on deployed Ops. The RCN found a way to create the NST, so I suspect the CA and RCAF can come up with something similar.

What, comissionaires?

 

[AmmoTech90]

What, comissionaires?

Commissionaires at CFAD Dundurn were armed in the 90s when I was there.

 

[Quirky]

Commissionaires at CFAD Dundurn were armed in the 90s when I was there.

You don't want that now. Given the geriatrics that are common throughout the commissionaire world, the most they should get is a wooden gun, maybe a whistle.

Airfield security could be made simple through the use of technology (camera and motion detection monitoring) and better perimeter fencing and walls.

Again, it's an investment that only a serious country and military would make if they were serious about security. We are not.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Commissionaires at CFAD Dundurn were armed in the 90s when I was there.

That is the issue: not supported by legislation.

 

[AmmoTech90]

That is the issue: not supported by legislation.

Is it the security guard regulations that were 8ntroduced a few years ago?

Or was it just shenanigans at the time? I didn't really question it as I had seen the armed security guards in CFE.

 

[dapaterson]

Commissionaires at CFAD Dundurn were armed in the 90s when I was there.

You show up and suddenly they need armed guards, you leave and the armed guards go away?

Hmmm... Correlation is not necessarily causation, but...

 

[AmmoTech90]

You show up and suddenly they need armed guards, you leave and the armed guards go away?

Hmmm... Correlation is not necessarily causation, but...

I was pretty angry at our wasted time when the depot's shipper and I had to take the morning to go into Saskatoon to pay the sales tax on two tractor trailers of TOW that had showed up the night before.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Is it the security guard regulations that were 8ntroduced a few years ago?

Or was it just shenanigans at the time? I didn't really question it as I had seen the armed security guards in CFE.

It has been a while since I looked into this in any detail, but either the regulations changed or there never was a regulatory framework and somebody just did it…