Author Topic: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1% stay  (Read 63837 times)

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Offline George Wallace

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #25 on: June 24, 2016, 08:12:49 »
It will not be an instantaneous split.  It is going to take quite a while to negotiate the separation, and in the meantime it may prove to be the best for the EU as member nations come together to renegotiate terms of inclusion to improve the EU, correcting many of its faults.
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Offline Altair

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #26 on: June 24, 2016, 08:13:21 »
Now I haven't been following this over extensively, however from what I have been reading they believe it will take at least 2 years to unravel this.

It would then make sense would it not for Britain to have a second vote once everything has been figured out?
No. Once article 50 (leaving the EU) is triggered the British and EI have two years to negotiate but once triggered it's irreversible from my understanding
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Offline Lightguns

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Re: Brexit Vote Today
« Reply #27 on: June 24, 2016, 08:21:40 »
As did Gibraltar.  This made me wonder if there may now be a movement for Gibraltar to go its' own way and leave their unique position as a British Overseas Territory.

Not likely, there is still the Spanish threat.  I doubt the EU would have any teeth to keep the Spanish from fifth columning an independent Gibraltar.  The big worry for Gibraltar is British retirees who fear being isolated at the tip of Europe. 
Done, 34 years, 43 days complete, got's me damn pension!

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #28 on: June 24, 2016, 08:59:55 »
As I have mentioned before, for all the sabre rattling, Spain is not in an economic position to refuse the money from well off British citizen within or without its borders, so I see little risk there. Nor can Gibraltar really make it on its own. It's sole economic product is it's valuable military location -so!!!

In any event, I think that no one in these forum can actually say with any certainty (or with more than wild speculation) what will happen or how things will unfold, especially considering the fact that negotiations - and negotiation positions - on either side have not even been developed yet and that I am certain no one in these fora have ever bothered to actually read the pile of treaties - some bigger than a bible - that have been entered into in the last 60  years to end up with the EU. These will have to be somehow undone .

All we can say is that the next ten to twenty years will be interesting to watch in Europe and it will be stuff for the history books.

At this point in time however, the best advice comes, as usual, from Star Trek:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4XPTmmvVow
« Last Edit: June 24, 2016, 09:05:01 by Oldgateboatdriver »

Online Karel Doorman

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #29 on: June 24, 2016, 09:10:04 »
What UKIP(and others) is/are failing to tell the people that as they say they're against the "elite"forgetting that they themselves are the elite as well.  ::)

The Brexit campaigners are for more power to the employers and less for the workers,so to say that the normal people are getting the better deal is a lie.

It will be a longterm task to renegotiate all the treaty's the best way for Britain(if possible),but done is done.Also a new poll is dawning For Schotland and Ireland to stay in the EU.So it's not finished yet.
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Offline milnews.ca

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #30 on: June 24, 2016, 09:37:56 »
First, a reminder from "Yes, Minister" about UK's reasons for joining the Common Market -- "pig's breakfast" accomplished! ;D

No. Once article 50 (leaving the EU) is triggered the British and EI have two years to negotiate but once triggered it's irreversible from my understanding
I've heard/read the two-year timeline, too, but I think there's a LOT of tangled ball of string to untangle, so that may be optimistic.

What UKIP(and others) is/are failing to tell the people that as they say they're against the "elite"forgetting that they themselves are the elite as well.  ::)
Ah, UKIP's Nigel Farage:  "Nigel Farage claims he's won Brexit 'without a bullet being fired' "  Well, maybe one ...
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Offline Colin P

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #31 on: June 24, 2016, 10:23:58 »
I would have much preferred a 60-40 split either way, more concise and clear. As far as I am concerned the EU brought this on themselves, the basic idea was good, but they couldn't stop piling on more and more stuff. The UK will suffer for a bit, but the EU members can't ignore a market of 64 million people and trade will happen. The real problem is that once the UK leaves and survives, others might decide they have had enough and pull the pin as well. Frankly the EU should strip itself back to the basics of free trade and stay clear of everything else. 

Offline GAP

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #32 on: June 24, 2016, 10:35:35 »
I think one of the overriding concerns that drove the Brexit vote was the forced immigration by the EU. The rules made the UK have to accept them once they were landed.

I don't know all the details, but the UK was literally being overrun by financial immigrants with no way of stopping them nor with removing them.

They can now do so and tell the EU to stuff it.

edited to add: In fact the best thing the UK can do is start shipping out illegal immigrants and close it's borders.
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Offline Cloud Cover

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #33 on: June 24, 2016, 10:36:50 »
Farage isn in over his head. I really hope somebody who is less of a Donald Trump as leader of the UKIP before the next election: https://youtu.be/o6UIj72XVz4

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #34 on: June 24, 2016, 10:41:27 »
I don't know all the details, but the UK was literally being overrun by financial immigrants with no way of stopping them nor with removing them.

They can now do so and tell the EU to stuff it.
I heard a lot of "those Ukrainians/Poles/Romanians/Georgians are stealing jobs from Italians" when I was in Italy last year, too -- but I also noticed almost all of the Ukrainians/Poles/Romanians/Georgians I saw working were doing jobs a lot of Italians didn't seem to want to do (mostly in-home live-in senior's care).  I wonder what'll happen if this pool of folks who'll work where others don't seem to want to dries up?
... EU members can't ignore a market of 64 million people and trade will happen ...
:nod:
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Offline GAP

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #35 on: June 24, 2016, 10:45:26 »
I heard a lot of "those Ukrainians/Poles/Romanians/Georgians are stealing jobs from Italians" when I was in Italy last year, too -- but I also noticed almost all of the Ukrainians/Poles/Romanians/Georgians I saw working were doing jobs a lot of Italians didn't seem to want to do (mostly in-home live-in senior's care).  I wonder what'll happen if this pool of folks who'll work where others don't seem to want to dries up? :nod:

The same thing Canada does....lie like hell...
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Offline Lightguns

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #36 on: June 24, 2016, 11:38:18 »
Funny how all the world's master-minds are responding like no one has ever run an independent country before.  It's not that flicking hard.
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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #37 on: June 24, 2016, 11:41:44 »
Funny how all the world's master-minds are responding like no one has ever run an independent country before.  It's not that flicking hard.

I heard one comment from a voter that prior to the EU, the UK had been running itself quite successfully for many decades and centuries.
I'm just like the CAF, I seem to have retention issues.

Offline cavalryman

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #38 on: June 24, 2016, 11:48:42 »
I'm getting a lot of entertainment in watching my left leaning friends and acquaintances self-destruct on Facebook.  Brexit seems to be the biggest disaster to befall humanity since... since...  [:p  More entertaining even is the lack of self-awareness in the way they're characterizing those who voted 'leave.'  Sadly, in the interests of maintaining peace, I've so far resisted pointing this out.  Must stay away from Facebook  :-\

Offline Chris Pook

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #39 on: June 24, 2016, 11:50:19 »
Re Gibraltar - the counter is Ceuta.

If Britain's claim to Gibraltar is invalid.  Spain's claim to Ceuta across the water is equally so. Go back to the days of the Tangiers Regiment and swap?

Re Who is next? 

I put my money on the Dutch and the Danes.  Although Hollande and Merkel both have to get through elections in 2017.  And the Brits will still be negotiating then.

Re Britain's position.

The Poles, Estonians, Latvians, Lithuanians, Swedes, Finns, Danes, Poles, Romanians, Hungarians, Czechs and Slovaks all want something that Britain can offer - Britain's forces and its nuclear umbrella.   They also want access to Britain and the world's 5th largest economy.  The same goes for Cyprus and Malta.

The core anti-Brit vote will come from those currently in power in Brussels, Luxembourg and Paris.  As usual.

Re Stability

Everything takes time and nothing is ever what it seems.  Politicians and bureaucrats will continue to play the same game with modified rules.

Re Scotland

Scotland is not a country, no more than Northern Ireland and certainly not London.  Sturgeon is reduced to hoping that Sadiq Khan, the Lord Mayor of London will assist her in getting a seat at the negotiating table.   Spain, France and every other country with a separatist tendency will reject that.  Scotland has to become a country before it can apply to become an EU member.



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Offline S.M.A.

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #40 on: June 24, 2016, 11:52:40 »
The global shockwaves of the Brexit continue to be felt:

Yahoo Finance

Quote
A single word explains why financial markets everywhere are nosediving
On Thursday, Britain voted to exit the European Union. Global markets are falling sharply. But the Brexit alone doesn't justify the magnitude of the sell-off.

By Sam Ro | Yahoo Finance – 3 hours ago

British voters stunned the world as they voted to leave the European Union.

The results were followed by the worst crash in the British pound against the US dollar ever. At one point, the pound had fallen to a 30-year low of around $1.32. Meanwhile, stocks markets around the world are plummeting, with the UK's FTSE 100 down 4.5%, Germany's Dax down 7.1%, and Japan's Nikkei down 7.9%. Dow futures are down 540 points, or 3% from Thursday's levels. Investors and traders everywhere are losing money today.

And so begins what could be a two-year long, very complicated process of renogitiating trade deals and other policies as the UK aims to decouple from the EU.


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Offline daftandbarmy

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #41 on: June 24, 2016, 12:26:24 »
I'm getting a lot of entertainment in watching my left leaning friends and acquaintances self-destruct on Facebook.  Brexit seems to be the biggest disaster to befall humanity since... since...  [:p  More entertaining even is the lack of self-awareness in the way they're characterizing those who voted 'leave.'  Sadly, in the interests of maintaining peace, I've so far resisted pointing this out.  Must stay away from Facebook  :-\

When in doubt, quote the first leader of a united Europe:

"If the populace knew with what idiocy they were ruled, they would revolt."

Charlemagne
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Offline Colin P

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #42 on: June 24, 2016, 13:16:22 »
If Scotland left the UK to stay with the EU, that would be a marriage the EU would long regret, a Greece without the food or the weather.

Offline milnews.ca

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #43 on: June 24, 2016, 13:31:07 »
If Scotland left the UK to stay with the EU, that would be a marriage the EU would long regret, a Greece without the food or the weather.
But with scotch ...
“The risk of insult is the price of clarity.” -- Roy H. Williams

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Offline cavalryman

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #44 on: June 24, 2016, 13:37:11 »
But with scotch ...
Which will all vanish in domestic consumption once the Scots realize they were better off in the UK - which by then will have realized that it's better off without Scotland's drag on the public purse  ;D

Offline FJAG

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #45 on: June 24, 2016, 13:46:25 »
If Scotland left the UK to stay with the EU, that would be a marriage the EU would long regret, a Greece without the food or the weather.

Who gets custody of the North Sea oil?  :dunno:

 :cheers:
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Offline Cloud Cover

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #46 on: June 24, 2016, 14:10:36 »
Who gets custody of the North Sea oil?  :dunno:

 :cheers:

Good point. Will Norway buy out the Scots? LOL. Maybe they will pump it dry in the next 2 years.

You're right. I Never  Met A Motherfucker Quite Like You, or someone as smart as you.  Never ever will, either.

Offline Lightguns

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #47 on: June 24, 2016, 14:14:06 »
Good point. Will Norway buy out the Scots? LOL. Maybe they will pump it dry in the next 2 years.

Without the South paying the Scot welfare bill, they will have to pump it out. 
Done, 34 years, 43 days complete, got's me damn pension!

Offline Chris Pook

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #48 on: June 24, 2016, 14:42:24 »
Who gets custody of the North Sea oil?  :dunno:

 :cheers:

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/17/shetland-may-reconsider-place-scotland-yes-vote-alistair-carmichael

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Re: Brexit Vote: 51.9% leave, 48.1 stay
« Reply #49 on: June 24, 2016, 14:44:50 »
Tangent, but I was asked why PM David Cameron had to (?) step down after the Brexit vote was finalized.  I didn't think it was also a non-confidence vote?  Or did he just feel it was a good time to cut his losses and go?
Philip II of Macedon to Spartans (346 BC):  "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."

Reply:  "If."