CADPAT for CIC

[ouyin2000]

Well they arent really officers... even though we have to salute them, wich i find very stupid.

and what evidence do you have to support this claim that members of the CIC are not really officers of the Canadian Forces?

 

[old medic]

Actually the CIC are the largest corps of Officers in the CF

File that under useless trivia.

CIC is a list,  like the SHR and SRR lists.

Other officers are grouped by MOC and not list.

 

[ZipperHead]

In closing, like General Hillard said, the CF is a family. We should respect each other as a good family does, and not spend our time insulting one another because of our jobs.

Well, if we're a big happy family, you may want to get to know Daddy's name: it's HILLIER. He's only the CDS, you know. The highest rank in the CF. Probably want to get to know it.

Sorry about the sarcasm, but it's my way.

Al

P.S And my feeling on this issue, to keep this post on topic, is that if there is ONE soldier out there that does not have CADPAT issued, CIC officers (who have their Commision, hence they are "real" officers) should NOT be issued CADPAT. I waited long enough for mine, they can wait for theirs.

 

[HollywoodHitman]

You got that right Allan. As long as there are members of the reserves out there who havent gotten the current issued kit, they CIC should quit their whining. I was in the Cadet system years ago and it was a fine organisation and as kids we purchased out of our own pockets the VERY well used combats from the local surplus stores. For that matter, so did the CIL officers as they were called at the time.

CIC officers are NOT officers with the training or education to lead soldiers. Period. They're there to lead and guide the training of the children in their organisations.The exception to this are former Reg/Reserve officers and NCO's who have made the transition. This is not to say that they're babysitters as I'm sure many of you are thinking already. But CIC officers are what you are. Leaders of a youth group who's function is no longer simply to stimulate and develop an interest in the CF.

I have had cadets come into my unit recruiting office who are members of the cadet corps which wear our cap badge. NO knowledge whatsoever about the Regiment or the jobs of the trades which exist within the unit.

Anyway, the debate shall continue, but again, as long as there are troopies out there who are on the waiting list for their kit, the Cadet system will have to do what it's always done.........Wait it's turn until the kit starts getting old enough to be sent through the funnel to the kids.

 

[Strike]

I agree that the CIC should have to wait for their turn for issue.  However I disagree that they should not get CADPAT at all.  Why?  Because John Q Public simply does not know the difference between a CIC officer and a Reg/Res officer and, should they see them walking around in the old olives, the first thing these people will think is that the military is spending all this money on cool helos, trucks, etc, and can't even outfit its troups.  Or, they could think that this officer looks like a slob and can't take the time to exchange his/her kit for the new stuff.  There are any number of scenarios, all of them generally bad.

So, sure CIC should get CADPAT -- after everyone else.  Now, if my supply would just order me some 2 piece nomex flt suits I'd be happy!

 

[my72jeep]

You've got to be kidding me.

6600 CIC officers Canada wide. All members of the CF and subject to the Code of Service Discipline.My Commissioning Scroll is signed by the MND and The Gov. General. Now we all know that why would a Commissioned Officer not be entitled to the same basic uniform as every other member? I have Regular and Reserve time but now I work with Cadets I know my Mos is not as an Inf. Leader. Never said it was, but how many Inf. Leaders are Qualified to work with kids on every moon altering drug known to man or yet a kid with AHD or ADD or ants in his pants. (or would want to)

 

[COBRA-6]

Yes, CIC Officers hold a commission and are members of the CF, but there is a very distinct difference. PRes and Reg F members role is to defend Canada, the CIC's is to train Cadets, bottom line... it's not that CIC officer's job isn't worthwhile, but there is a distinct difference. Having them in CADPAT leads many civilians to believe they are soldiers, which they are not, and I think that's why many object to it.

 

[Spring_bok]

Just out of curiosity, how many soldiers(fully trained and not recruits or still in training) have not been issued CADPAT?  The Initial issue went to 2 Vandoo in 01 because they were the first BG to deploy with CADPAT.  First line units got it later that year.  We must be at the end of the CADPAT transition by now.  BTW CIC officers wear the same DEU that we do.  Is this an Issue too?

 

[my72jeep]

Yes, CIC Officers hold a commission and are members of the CF, but there is a very distinct difference. PRes and Reg F members role is to defend Canada, the CIC's is to train Cadets, bottom line... it's not that CIC officer's job isn't worthwhile, but there is a distinct difference. Having them in CADPAT leads many civilians to believe they are soldiers, which they are not, and I think that's why many object to it.

Define soldier?

 

[Big Foot]

Just out of curiosity, how many soldiers(fully trained and not recruits or still in training) have not been issued CADPAT?  The Initial issue went to 2 Vandoo in 01 because they were the first BG to deploy with CADPAT.  First line units got it later that year.  We must be at the end of the CADPAT transition by now. BTW CIC officers wear the same DEU that we do. Is this an Issue too?

I'd imagine pretty much everybody has CADPAT now because RMC has now been issued it and it is initial issue at the Mega. That said, I got mine back in December

 

[Strike]

Okay guys (specifically MikeR23A and my72jeep)

The issue about the CIC being/not being officers is already being discussed on another thread.  Take it there.  This thread is about CADPATs and the CIC.  READ THE SUBJECT!!! :rage:

 

[my72jeep]

Okay guys,

The issue about the CIC being/not being officers is already being discussed on another thread.  Take it there.  This thread is about CADPATs and the CIC.  READ THE SUBJECT!!! :rage:

Sorry but it all comes down to if we are CF members we are entitled the CF uniform of the day.

 

[badpup]

Failure of some PRes members to have not recieved CADPAT would likely reside within their own unit supply system or administrative error. As I have read, all members of the Reg force should have at least the basic issue, though some items of other gear such as TAC vests are slow. those items are not on the CIC scale of issue, so are a moot point for this thread

 

[COBRA-6]

Okay guys (specifically MikeR23A and my72jeep)

The issue about the CIC being/not being officers is already being discussed on another thread.  Take it there.  This thread is about CADPATs and the CIC.  READ THE SUBJECT!!! :rage:

I think my post directly relates to this thread. What I wrote is what I've heard from many Reg F and Pres soldiers over the last few years, there is no logistical reason why CIC can't have CADPAT, there's enough to go around, they object for the reason's I stated. Even though some people might not want to hear it... that mindset may also be the reason some CIC Officers have "trouble" with their local clothing stores (as I've heard the same opinion voiced by bin rats)...

Define soldier?

A soldier is someone who's job it is to defend their nation (my def anyways..)

Again I'm not trying to rag on the CIC, I was in Cadets for 5 years and really enjoyed it, and I think it's a great organisation.

 

[PViddy]

I concur with Mr. Piper

Frankly, i have no problem purchasing "combat clothing" from a surplus store.  Coming from being an Air Cadet 4 years ago; for 7 years, now being enrolled in the CIC, it's what were used to-both Officer and Cadet pers.  The CCM is a fantastic program for youth and just another thing that makes this (Canada) such a beutiful Nation-thus most cadets do not mind purchasing a set of rugged "combats" that would probably do them beter in the filed than Hilfiger jeans.

Here is where my logic sits, i think it would just look beter for the CF as a whole if their was uniformity through out.  Now i consider myself an expert surplus shopper  but somtimes good used stuff is really hard to come by, thus it does the combat uniform no justice at all-walking around base on a field ex.  Now keep in mind, i am not saying cadets be issued CADPAT, maybe they should have their own uniform (similiar to what the army cadet league is doing now i believe) but it would definately help us CIC folks.  This whole paragraph mainly pretaing to my element (Air) since the Army guys already get CADPAT.


In short, wouldn't it just give the CF a better image if everyone was dressed the same and not in outdated OD's ? and by all means! of course the Pres and Reg force should have priority on being kitted out first.  no question.  But from what i understand, their isn't a huge shortage anymore.  Just my take on the stand point of uniformity, interested in what you Ladies and Gentleman think.

and for the record.  my "usless trivia" from previous post...i am right, call it what you will.


cheers

PV

 

[badpup]

There was until just recently a CADPAT "like" field uniform available for purchase "New" though an American outfit. However this has been currently placed on hold, as there seemed to be some form of problem with customs I believe.
They are attempting to work with or find a Canadian manufacturer for this Cadet Field dress, however it is not in the works to be an issue item.
I like the idea of a field dress uniform for the cadets, however do not believe that it should be CADPAT, or a similar digital pattern. There should still be a large surplus of the OD in new or near new condition, perhaps this should be utilized as field dress for the cadets.

 

[Ltmel]

Have people forgotten that the CIC have always had combats(and DEUs and.. garrison dress when it existed)?

We(Army CIC) wear Cadpat because it is our work dress.  Issued after everyone else of course.  I am not aware of any shortages.

Is the argument about the Air and Naval CIC?  Because, the Navy wears Naval combats and (I think, correct me if I am wrong) the air force  is getting issued Cadpat to replace their current work dress. (gotta love that blue embroidery!)

Army CIC are discernable from others (by military pers.) by their slip ons, the Air and Navy are not required to wear CIC slip ons with combats.

 

[PViddy]

The CEMS project is the Airforce version of clothe the soldier and will be providing Airforce pers with a destinct cadpat uniform, replacing Airforce workdress and integrating with the army the IECS clothing sytem.  I am unsure however, if this will trickle down to the CIC.  My bet is it would make a lot of sense, but it's pure speculation at this point.

cheers

PV

 

[Strike]

the air force  is getting issued Cadpat to replace their current work dress. (gotta love that blue embroidery!)

Thank goodness that is going to be changing.

 

[PViddy]

Thank goodness that is going to be changing.

Did you mean good ridance of the work dress, or their will be some changes to the blue slip ons/name badges/ poly pro shirts ?

i am all for a bon voyage work dress party!

cheers

PV