Royal Canadian Air Force headed to mission in Africa ‘very soon’: top general

[PuckChaser]

Maybe I'm getting crotchety as I veer towards senior citizenship or things have changed considerably since I retired, but why is the Chief of Defence Staff leading the advance party to Mali?  Surely there is someone more junior (but still senior enough - didn't Gen Vance say he needed all the generals for those circumstances) who is capable of being first on the ground.  Hasn't a commander for this mission been appointed yet?

Need the big guns out to sell the mission that has had no debate in Parliament or little in the way of goals other than "get a security council seat".

 

[medicineman]

Maybe I'm getting crotchety as I veer towards senior citizenship or things have changed considerably since I retired, but why is the Chief of Defence Staff leading the advance party to Mali?  Surely there is someone more junior (but still senior enough - didn't Gen Vance say he needed all the generals for those circumstances) who is capable of being first on the ground.  Hasn't a commander for this mission been appointed yet?

To apologize on behalf of the government officials too chicken to visit themselves because of the shyteshow it has become?

MM

 

[MarkOttawa]

Justin Trudeau gov't has been stressing warm and fuzzy medevac aspect of mission but Gen. Vance acknowledges killer peacekeeping aspect pols don't like to talk about--note also two extra helos:

...
Two large Chinook transport helicopters and four smaller Griffon escorts, along with one spare of each in case of break downs, are due to arrive next month and replace the Germans, who have been flying here for more than a year....

The Canadians will fly primarily medical evacuation missions — at least one Chinook and two Griffons must on standby at the expansive nearby helipad at all times — but Vance said they could also be called upon to do other tasks.

Those could include providing medical assistance to a joint counter-terrorism force established by Mali and four of its neighbours to fight Islamist jihadists and others [G5 Sahel force pushed by France and supported by UNSC, barely covered by Canadian media https://www.securitycouncilreport.org/monthly-forecast/2018-05/g5_sahel_joint_force.php ], Vance said, as well as the actual defending of Malian civilians.

But it could also mean protecting convoys and giving fire support to fellow peacekeepers who find themselves in trouble, though Vance said those would only launched in extremis — if absolutely no other option was available...
http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/a-dozen-canadian-peacekeepers-arrive-in-mali-as-yearlong-mission-begins

Mark
Ottawa

 

[daftandbarmy]

Maybe I'm getting crotchety as I veer towards senior citizenship or things have changed considerably since I retired, but why is the Chief of Defence Staff leading the advance party to Mali?  Surely there is someone more junior (but still senior enough - didn't Gen Vance say he needed all the generals for those circumstances) who is capable of being first on the ground.  Hasn't a commander for this mission been appointed yet?

http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/a-dozen-canadian-peacekeepers-arrive-in-mali-as-yearlong-mission-begins

It's starting to remind me of 1996 when the Comd FMC LFC whatever the frig the army was called deployed to central Africa.  A sense that if we send someone over-ranked they won't notice that we don't have the tools to do the job.

Because he is a tactical General and merely aping the customs of his risk averse peers by micromanaging the he** out of everything?

Tactical Generals: Leaders, Technology, and the Perils

https://www.brookings.edu/articles/tactical-generals-leaders-technology-and-the-perils/

 

[Cloud Cover]

"— if absolutely no other option was available..."

What great frickin allies we are, eh? Ok, sign this document affirming that you've tried everything else and no other option is available ... so after that's done, we will go in and blow every one of those heathen to gatling gun hell. Also, after that we'll use the big chopper to bring in some donuts and coffee, but not if it's dark outside.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

Because he is a tactical General and merely aping the customs of his risk averse peers by micromanaging the he** out of everything?

Tactical Generals: Leaders, Technology, and the Perils

https://www.brookings.edu/articles/tactical-generals-leaders-technology-and-the-perils/

Cheap shot - but nice reference.

Alternatively, the military has provided sound military advice to the government on how they could best achieve their stated geo-political objectives.  Having done so, and having deployed a significant number of troops on a theatre activation party, the CDS is there to a) show the flag, b) lead from the front, and c) perhaps even settle a few outstanding details.

But no doubt you have it right.

 

[TQMS]

Trudeau's 1st peacekeeping mission just under stated goal of 15% female soldiers

'Canadian Armed Forces have done their work of making sure that we have the right people,' says Harjit Sajjan.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mali-women-peacekeeper-short-1.4721774

 

[CBH99]

Agreed with PPCLI guy on every point

 

[daftandbarmy]

Trudeau's 1st peacekeeping mission just under stated goal of 15% female soldiers

'Canadian Armed Forces have done their work of making sure that we have the right people,' says Harjit Sajjan.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mali-women-peacekeeper-short-1.4721774

I wonder if Prince Justin really understands the extra levels of stress he might be putting on female CAF members required to do more than their fair share, just to make sure that his quota is achieved.

 

[brihard]

Trudeau's 1st peacekeeping mission just under stated goal of 15% female soldiers

'Canadian Armed Forces have done their work of making sure that we have the right people,' says Harjit Sajjan.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/mali-women-peacekeeper-short-1.4721774

From this article, what jumped out at me:

“He acknowledged it does not meet the target, but insisted that once other peacekeeping commitments make it to the field, including a proposed 200-soldier rapid reaction force, the numbers will improve.”

Are we looking at some sort of combat QRF capability as well for this op? Because that’s a game changer in terms of the risks our troops will be exposed to. I don’t know how else to read that but.

 

[TQMS]

From this article, what jumped out at me:

“He acknowledged it does not meet the target, but insisted that once other peacekeeping commitments make it to the field, including a proposed 200-soldier rapid reaction force, the numbers will improve.”

Are we looking at some sort of combat QRF capability as well for this op? Because that’s a game changer in terms of the risks our troops will be exposed to. I don’t know how else to read that but.

I caught the same thing. If they do add on a QRF (of some sort and of that size) they are essentially doubling the size of the original mission and will be including a whole lot more kit.

 

[FSTO]

Not an army guy but doesn't a QRF need some sort of armour and air support?

 

[Good2Golf]

Not an army guy but doesn't a QRF need some sort of armour and air support?

'Depends'

A QRF could range from small det of light fast to something big and bruising with lots of enablers.  The definition will be interesting to see, once announced.

:2c:

Regards
G2G

 

[Journeyman]

But it could also mean protecting convoys and giving fire support to fellow peacekeepers who find themselves in trouble....

That's the mission of another military powerhouse -- El Salvador.

The Dutch AH-64s and German Eurocopter Tigers gone, but hey, El Salvador still has 3 x MD500s in location.  [:-[


I guess as long as the enemy has no Air Defence, three Killer Eggs is still a useful contriution.  :dunno:

 

[daftandbarmy]

Not an army guy but doesn't a QRF need some sort of armour and air support?

Like in 'Blackhawk Down'?

Yeah, it's probably a good idea.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Well I guess we just found a role for the TAPV's perhaps with some LAV 6's to give them heavier firepower?

 

[daftandbarmy]

Well I guess we just found a role for the TAPV's perhaps with some LAV 6's to give them heavier firepower?

Aaaaaaaannnnnnnd..... there's your slippery slope, right?

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Aaaaaaaannnnnnnd..... there's your slippery slope, right?

What did Kennedy say about Vietnam:

"It's like taking a drink (of alcohol), it tastes good and eventually you want more"

 

[garb811]

I wonder if Prince Justin really understands the extra levels of stress he might be putting on female CAF members required to do more than their fair share, just to make sure that his quota is achieved.

Has anyone actually seen any staff checks or CFTPOs for Op PRESENCE that state they are specifically looking for a female member for "x" position?  I've seen a few MP staff checks and CFTPOs and none of them mentioned anything about having a specific gender requirement.

 

[MarkOttawa]

Given that it appears the CAF personnel will be mainly at the base or on the helos it is hard to see how any percentage of female members will contribute to this goal in an official Forces tweet:
https://twitter.com/CanadianForces/status/1011689432095784960

...The presence of women on peace support ops helps to empower women in host communities, reduces conflict and confrontation, makes UN forces more approachable and broadens mission skill sets...

Also:

Canada’s National Action Plan on Women, Peace and Security
http://international.gc.ca/world-monde/issues_development-enjeux_developpement/gender_equality-egalite_sexes/national_action_plan_wps-plan_national_action_fps.aspx?lang=eng

Meanwhile see what Bundeswehr helo pilot has to say at link about zero contact with locals when with MINUSMA--scroll down to 2:20 on 1st video under "More from CBC News on Canada's Mali mission" https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/mali-bad-allies-canadian-troops-1.4720747

All factless virtue-signalling.

Mark
Ottawa