• Thanks for stopping by. Logging in to a registered account will remove all generic ads. Please reach out with any questions or concerns.

The need for tactical highly visible rank (From:Re-Royalization)

Bruce Monkhouse

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Reaction score
2,131
Points
1,260
Lightguns said:
I am more concerned about the haircuts the officers are sporting. My God, they look like NCOs 

Did you really, really just type that? 
 

Scott

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Reaction score
289
Points
980
Lightguns said:
I am more concerned about the haircuts the officers are sporting. My God, they look like NCOs , grow some hair and look like officers Gentlemen.

And yet the sun did rise today...
 

PPCLI Guy

Army.ca Fixture
Donor
Reaction score
1,059
Points
1,040
Lightguns said:
I am more concerned about the haircuts the officers are sporting. My God, they look like NCOs , grow some hair and look like officers Gentlemen.

At last!  I found him!!!!

 

bick

Member
Reaction score
0
Points
160
Lightguns said:
I am more concerned about the haircuts the officers are sporting. My God, they look like NCOs , grow some hair and look like officers Gentlemen.

Wow, sounds like someone needs to get out of CTC and back to reality.
 

dimsum

Army.ca Legend
Mentor
Reaction score
3,917
Points
1,260
Did the Army just accuse the Air Force of having hair that's too short?  Is it April already? 

Back (ish) to the topic....so, when are these supposed new 1 and 2-piece flying suits and jackets coming in?  >:D
 

Eye In The Sky

Army.ca Legend
Reaction score
1,788
Points
1,060
New jackets and pants (ACE) are out.  Improvement from previous IMO.  Gortex lined.  Pants are easy on/off and would be great duck blind kit.  Jacket has zip-out liner.  Tuck-away hood.  Issue 2 of each.  :)

Its the weekend, if you want I can post a few pics.  'Cause I lead such an exciting life.  8)
 

dimsum

Army.ca Legend
Mentor
Reaction score
3,917
Points
1,260
Eye In The Sky said:
New jackets and pants (ACE) are out.  Improvement from previous IMO.  Gortex lined.  Pants are easy on/off and would be great duck blind kit.  Jacket has zip-out liner.  Tuck-away hood.  Issue 2 of each.  :)

Its the weekend, if you want I can post a few pics.  'Cause I lead such an exciting life.  8)

Ah hell, why not.  Might as well let you have a bit of excitement.  ;)
 

Good2Golf

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Mentor
Reaction score
7,916
Points
1,360
Lightguns said:
I am more concerned about the haircuts the officers are sporting. My God, they look like NCOs , grow some hair and look like officers Gentlemen.

Don't be jealous that some people take some pride in presenting a military appearance to accompany their operational posture.  As others have noted, you seem to have an archaic view of maintaining segregationalist views based on appearance alone.  Care to point us to a reference that directs officers and NCMs (perhaps that's the word you meant to use, not NCO?) different standards for hair cuts and groomin, or were you just proving to us how far removed from an operational mindset you are? ???
 

daftandbarmy

Army.ca Relic
Reaction score
10,441
Points
1,160
This style could be a tough choice to justify, especially if you face an enemy with a predilection for scalping
 

ModlrMike

Army.ca Veteran
Subscriber
Donor
Reaction score
838
Points
960
Good2Golf said:
Don't be jealous that some people take some pride in presenting a military appearance to accompany their operational posture.  As others have noted, you seem to have an archaic view of maintaining segregationalist views based on appearance alone.  Care to point us to a reference that directs officers and NCMs (perhaps that's the word you meant to use, not NCO?) different standards for hair cuts and groomin, or were you just proving to us how far removed from an operational mindset you are? ???

I'm hoping that he forgot to include the sarcasm smiley. Of course he could just be channeling his inner Strat.
 

JesseWZ

Sr. Member
Staff member
Directing Staff
Reaction score
0
Points
0
I could be wrong, but I took it as sarcasm. I didn't even think twice about it and laughed about it a little as well. Perhaps a  >:D would have been appropriate to place behind it...
 

Good2Golf

Moderator
Staff member
Directing Staff
Subscriber
Mentor
Reaction score
7,916
Points
1,360
So if we play the "it was really sarcasm" game, what  does that mean, then?  That short haircuts don't an operational/competent officer make? Some of those young officers in the photo were Aurora pilots and ACSOs who, along with their NCM FE and AESOP brethren, were flying aircraft well into crappy airspace feet dry over Libya to guide CAS and SCAR missions.  Either way, it is a narrow-minded view that symbolizes a good measure of RCAIS*. ::)



*rectal-cranial auto-insertion syndrome
 

Fishbone Jones

Army.ca Myth
Subscriber
Donor
Reaction score
837
Points
1,060
All right folks.

Time to put a cap on this and get back to the thread subject.

---Staff---
 

Sharp

Jr. Member
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Just like in the movie "A Few Good Men", one of the Marines upon arriving to Cuba had told the two main characters that "if the Cubans spot someone wearing white, they'll think its a high ranking official and wouldn't mind taking a shot".

I don't think you want to be targeted for being a high ranking officer/ncm.

In this case, it's the highly visible patch, rather than a full uniform. Just a thought, no need for hate comments to arise.
 

Eye In The Sky

Army.ca Legend
Reaction score
1,788
Points
1,060
Good2Golf said:
Some of those young officers in the photo were Aurora pilots and ACSOs who, along with their NCM FE and AESOP brethren, were flying aircraft well into crappy airspace feet dry over Libya to guide CAS and SCAR missions.

Thought I'd throw this one out there for anyone who might have a few minutes to spare.

Punching Above Its Weight
 

daftandbarmy

Army.ca Relic
Reaction score
10,441
Points
1,160
Just in case we need to restate the obvious reason underlying the need for subdued rank insignia:

Reducing the risk of damage

During the stalking phase of his attack a sniper will, if time allows, try to identify high-value targets such as senior officers or senior NCOs. He will do this by closely observing the behavior of the people in front of him. His intention is to identify who is in charge and then prepare to fire at them. It naturally follows that leaders should attempt to blend into the background by avoiding anything that distinguishes them from the most junior soldiers and attracts the interest of a sniper. In order to reduce a sniper's ability to damage the chain of command, doctrine and equipment need to prevent any observable "leadership" behaviors and signs.

Insignia, e.g. rank insignia, should be subdued (dark/black as opposed to bright colors), camouflage colors on camouflage, battle-dress identical for all ranks, military servants and rank-based luxuries (like saluting) avoided in forward areas, and commands and instruction should be given discreetly. Additionally, other acts such as looking at maps, using a radio, pointing authoritatively, abstaining from menial tasks and other forms of body language can betray an officer's rank. However, it is important to emphasize that if a sniper cannot identify an officer or NCO, he may then select any person that he has a good chance of hitting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter-sniper_tactics
 

Journeyman

Army.ca Legend
Subscriber
Reaction score
1,049
Points
940
daftandbarmy said:
Just in case we need to restate the obvious reason underlying the need for subdued rank insignia....
Yes, but that refers to military situations as opposed to uniformed bureaucracies, and we know which takes precedence in a peacetime army.
 

JorgSlice

Banned
Banned
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Don't know about anyone else but I don't wear nametape or rank insignia in the field. Not like anyone can see it under my TAC vest anyway.

As subdued nametapes and slip ons are readily available in CF spec from places like CP Gear and the High-Vis ones are being shoved down our throat one can easily differentiate the purpose of them.

High-vis for garrison and subdued for field and ops.
 

Old Sweat

Army.ca Fixture
Donor
Reaction score
77
Points
480
As someone who was serving  as a subaltern in 1964 when the subdued badges of rank were introduced by an army (ours) whose leaders had led in battle, I firmly believe:

a. at the company and platoon level pretty badges of rank are a menace;

b. above that at battalion and brigade, maybe they allow people to be recognized; and

c. above that, who cares?

:sarcasm:
 

Fishbone Jones

Army.ca Myth
Subscriber
Donor
Reaction score
837
Points
1,060
I worked a couple of time wit the SAS, on the periphery.

I had a task one time that required me to acertain who was in charge in order to figure out how things would be done.

They always stood around, facing outwards, as a group.

When I asked who was in charge, I was politlety told to state my business and it would be taken care of.

When I pressed them, I was told in more vigorous terms that they knew who was in charge and that was all that should matter to me, nor was it my business.

I stated my business and left. The SSM knew the response before I returned.

It would seem, this high vis rank business, is born out of a sense of insecurity and lack of personal self worth.

An officer should be recognised by his bearing and familiarity, not a rank badge.
 
Top