Author Topic: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault  (Read 45364 times)

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Offline NeverDismount

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4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« on: April 17, 2015, 18:19:13 »
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/4-british-sailors-charged-with-sexual-assault-at-cfb-shearwater-1.2332583

4 British sailors charged with sexual assault at CFB Shearwater

CTVNews.ca Staff
Published Friday, April 17, 2015 1:59PM EDT
Last Updated Friday, April 17, 2015 4:30PM EDT

Four members of the British Royal Navy have been charged with sexual assault causing bodily harm, after an incident which allegedly took place at CFB Shearwater near Halifax.

Craig Stoner, Darren Smalley, Joshua Finbow and Simon Radford were arrested late Thursday evening. Each suspect is charged with one count under the Criminal Code of Canada -- with all the charges related to a single victim.
Speaking outside court Friday, Crown attorney Scott Morrison says the men are alleged to have participated in a "group sexual assault."


 The alleged victim is a young woman and a civilian from the Halifax area. Her name is protected by a publication ban.
Morrison said bail terms are being discussed and the men are scheduled to return to court on Monday to continue those negotiations. In the meantime the men are being held in custody.

The four accused were part of a British Navy hockey team that was in the Halifax area for a tournament. The alleged crime is said to have occurred at a post-game party inside barracks at 12 Shearwater Air Force base on April 9.

In a statement released Friday, the British Ministry of Defence confirmed four members of the Royal Navy had been charged. The statement said the ministry would provide all "appropriate assistance" to Canadian authorities but said it would be premature to release more details at this time."The Royal Navy takes allegations of this nature very seriously, however as legal proceedings continue it would be inappropriate to comment further," the statement said.


The Canadian Forces National Investigation Service, which is part of the military police, began investigating the alleged crime on April 10.
“This is a disturbing accusation of sexual assault,” Lt-Col. Francis Bolduc, the commanding officer of the CFNIS, said in a news release.
“I’m pleased with the full cooperation provided by the British authorities to support the hard work and diligence of the CFNIS team in responding to this matter.” The British High Commission in Ottawa would not comment on the charges Friday. It referred all media inquiries to the U.K. Ministry of Defence in London.
With files from The Canadian Press
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Offline George Wallace

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Offline Remius

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2015, 20:08:41 »
Optio

Offline George Wallace

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2015, 20:31:14 »
OK. I thought that perhaps, because the four accused are members of the British military, the thread might be more relevant to the British Military forum.
But, that's just my opinion, and I could be wrong.

It happened on a Canadian military Base and will be tried in a Canadian Court.  Various NATO agreements will cover what happens here, although it appears that this will be dealt with in civilian Courts.
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Offline Lumber

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2015, 13:14:19 »
I'm curious why none of the new articles posted their ranks? I've never seen (well, at least I can't recall seeing) a news story article concerning military personnel (good or bad) that didn't include their ranks.
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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2015, 13:26:31 »
Its simple.  The 4 are being charged IAW the Criminal Code and all of the paperwork is filed with the Court.  The civilian court neither care or needs their military ranks and in most cases the media gets their information from the Court papers. 

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2015, 13:32:28 »
It happened on a Canadian military Base and will be tried in a Canadian Court.  Various NATO agreements will cover what happens here, although it appears that this will be dealt with in civilian Courts.

l wonder what the Royal Navy disciplinary and administrative policies and procedures WRT incidents like these are and if/ how they apply.

Here in Canada, you can be found not quilty in a crminal court but still face admin action at the very least.

Also interesting what the Base will do, etc.  There are (or were) pretty straight forward regs for SQ in the formation when I last stayed in Warrior.
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Offline garb811

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2015, 14:52:50 »
Also interesting what the Base will do, etc.  There are (or were) pretty straight forward regs for SQ in the formation when I last stayed in Warrior.
Base won't be able to do anything "to" them if that's the question?  They are effectively civilians as far as the CAF is concerned.

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2015, 16:03:03 »
Understood, but certainly they must be interested in how the whole situation came to happen in a SQ.   Was the duty pers doing rounds, was it past the time guests are allowed in SQs, etc.
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Offline Lumber

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2015, 16:12:33 »
I assume they were all bunking as a time, with all there rooms next to one another. I wonder who else may have witnessed/known about this incident. Maybe that's how it came to light; maybe someone on their team knew and went to the police. Anyways, that's just speculation.
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Offline garb811

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2015, 16:13:25 »
Ah, seen.  Yeah, no doubt the Duty NCO is getting some pointed questions asked by the 12 Wing Chief.  But...Warrior block always seemed to be a bit more liberal about what was tolerated in there compared to, say, A Block.  And anytime I ever stayed in shacks for a tournament, mess dinner or whatever, Duty Staff tended to stay away.

Offline GD

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #11 on: April 18, 2015, 16:27:11 »
I don't think there is a duty NCO in the building past 15:00.

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #12 on: April 18, 2015, 16:36:17 »
There used to be one after duty until 0800.

Links to other articles in the UK.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1176491/Four-Royal-Navy-sailors-charged-sexual-assault-Canada.html
« Last Edit: April 18, 2015, 16:38:53 by Eye In The Sky »
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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2015, 21:01:23 »
I assume they were all bunking as a time, with all there rooms next to one another. I wonder who else may have witnessed/known about this incident. Maybe that's how it came to light; maybe someone on their team knew and went to the police. Anyways, that's just speculation.

According to media reports, after the assault happened, the victim went to the MP's and reported the incident.
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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2015, 09:35:25 »

I'm curious why none of the new articles posted their ranks? I've never seen (well, at least I can't recall seeing) a news story article concerning military personnel (good or bad) that didn't include their ranks.

From the pictures in the latest CBC story (  http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/4-british-sailors-charged-in-gang-rape-of-woman-were-typical-tourists-on-social-media-1.3039100 ) one of them is a PTI (Physical Training Instructor aka Clubswinger) - the rate badge shown is equivalent to MS.  Another at least entered the navy as a rating (NCM) as shown by his HMS Raleigh cap tally.

Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2015, 14:37:53 »
There are no rating/rank badges visible in any of the pics Ex-Pat.

The HMS RALEIGH pics is the closest to indicating rate, and though not absolutely positive, was likely taken when the seaman was an OS or AB (otherwise we should see a little bit of rank badge showing on the sleeve).

The seaman in the left most picture is definitely a Physical Training Instructor by trade (that is the crest on his jacket's left breast), but there are no indication whatsoever of his rate/rank visible, and in any event there are NO Master Seaman equivalent in the RN. You are a Leading Seaman or  a Petty Officer, but there is nothing in between, not even an appointment.
 

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #16 on: April 19, 2015, 14:38:37 »


From the article:
Quote
In a release Friday, a spokesperson said the navy "takes allegations of this nature very seriously, however as legal proceedings continue it would be inappropriate to comment further."

We here at Milnet have a long standing tradition of refraining from rumour, speculation and accusation until such time as they parties involved have had their day in court.

Please respect the convention.

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Offline Blackadder1916

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2015, 18:43:59 »
And they're out on bail.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3047155/Four-Royal-Navy-sailors-accused-gang-raping-woman-Canada-ice-hockey-tournament-arrive-court-granted-bail.html
Quote
Four Royal Navy sailors accused of gang raping woman in Canada after ice hockey tournament are released on bail
  • Four Royal Navy sailors are bailed following hearing Nova Scotia, Canada
  • Three sailors are from Hampshire, one is from Gloucestershire
  • They are charged with raping a 21-year-old woman at military base party
  • Men were in Canada playing a hockey tournament with Canadian forces
By Tom Leonard In Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, For Mailonline

Published: 14:34 GMT, 20 April 2015  | Updated: 21:45 GMT, 20 April 2015 

Four Royal Navy sailors charged with the gang rape of a young woman at an alcohol-fuelled party at a Canadian barracks must stay in Nova Scotia until they have been tried.

The four men appeared in turn in a courtroom in Dartmouth, near Halifax, where they were given identical but unusual bail conditions that could see them having to live on a Canadian naval base for the next few years.

Bail was set at over £2,000 for each of them but they also agreed to surrender their passports and live at the nearby Stadacona naval base in Halifax.

In a deal agreed with the British government, they will also continue to work for the Royal Navy and draw their current pay.

It was not clear last night how they will keep themselves occupied thousands of miles from their shipmates and a representative from the British High Commission who was in court refused to elaborate.

The four – Joshua Finbow, 23, a submarine engineer, Craig Stoner, 24, Simon Radford, 31, and Darren Smalley, 35 – had been playing for the Royal Navy ice hockey team in a tournament at the Shearwater naval base just east of Halifax.

The alleged sexual assault, in which police sources say all four men had sexual intercourse with their victim, took place on April 10 after the sailors had returned to the barracks from a hockey game.

Sources say their victim, who is aged in her early 20s and lives in Halifax, had accompanied a friend who had been invited to attend the party by local Canadian servicemen.

Yesterday, all four men – three of them wearing black Royal Navy ice hockey team hoodies – looked relieved to be getting out of custody as they respectfully answered Judge John MacDougall’s questions.

They all said they understood their bail conditions and Crown prosecutor Eric Taylor said outside court that the accused had not asked to be returned to the UK.

They were ordered to return to court on May 27 and given the names of seven people – the victim and six witnesses – who they were forbidden to contact.

They must not leave the province of Nova Scotia and cannot apply for new passports. They must remain employed by the navy and must not resign without the court’s permission.

The four, no longer trying to hide their faces, later filed out of the court building and were driven away together in a large white SUV to their new home on the close Stadacona base. They ignored a question over how they might plead in the case.

Commander Michael O’Sullivan, the air and naval advisor at the British High Commission, has spoken to the four and described the alleged offences as ‘serious’ but stressed they were as yet only allegations.

The Commander, who drove the car the men left the court in, added: ‘We’re assisting the Canadian authorities with their investigation.’

The four are charged with sexual assault causing bodily harm and group sexual assault – offences that are punishable by up to 14 years in prison.

Crown prosecutor Eric Taylor said the investigation was still at an early stage and the results of forensic tests could result in additional charges.

‘It will be up to the Royal Navy to decide now how to employ them while their charges are working their way through the court,’ he said.

Canadian military investigators have described the alleged offences as ‘a disturbing accusation of sexual assault’.
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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2015, 19:15:45 »
They have to stay at 12 Wing.  Can't imagine that's a comfortable experience for anyone involved.

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2015, 19:26:49 »
From CBC,

Quote
Crown attorney Eric Taylor says the four accused will apply to live in Atlantic block at Stadacona. He said they are not under house arrest and are free to come and go as they wish
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Offline GD

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2015, 19:28:50 »
How would something like this work? Would they work for the CF or would they be working for the RN?

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2015, 20:07:38 »
How would something like this work? Would they work for the CF or would they be working for the RN?

They will end up being paid and employed by the RN (as it states at their bail hearing they cannot resign from the RN) but no doubt the RN will ask the RCN to find some suitable duty for them to perform.  Not quite how you want to get an exchange position with another navy eh?

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2015, 23:51:24 »
I've got to admit, the few posts alluding to giving them crappy jobs to do pending trial disturbs me a little.  I'm sure opinions would be somewhat different if you put yourself in the shoes of someone charged for a crime you know in your own mind you didn't commit.  Let's give them their day in court, eh?

Offline MCG

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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #23 on: April 21, 2015, 08:16:31 »
Do you have some inside info they are absolutely innocent and being framed?

...

It is nice too see you concerned for the 4 accused and not the victim.   ::)
Concern for victims does not necessitate punishing accused until they may be found innocent.  The only one posting as though they have inside information on the truth is you. 


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Re: 4 RN Sailors Charged with Gang Sexual Assault
« Reply #24 on: April 21, 2015, 08:44:09 »
Do you have some inside info they are absolutely innocent and being framed?

Rape is down on my list of lowest crimes committed by the lowest form of ******* life.  Gang rape is just all the way to the bottom of the barrel and then burrowed into the wood some.

I will stick to my posted comments because, trust me, they are much less PC than what I posted.

If you that sensitive, don't read this thread.   

It is nice too see you concerned for the 4 accused and not the victim.   ::)

OTOH,  do you have some inside info that they're guilty? If so then you should not be posting here. At all.

Im concerned for all. Full stop. That doesn't have me jumping to any conclusion though.
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