Author Topic: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0  (Read 146001 times)

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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #775 on: April 23, 2020, 21:45:29 »


These kind of gems come from the gun-control advocates. Banning pistol grips  ::)

Quote
As for the pistol grip — a feature on controversial weapons like the AR-15 rifle, a legal-though-restricted weapon in Canada — Cukier said there’s a reason the moulded hand grip should be banned.

“The pistol grip allows you to stabilize the weapon so you can effectively spray fire as opposed to a hunting rifle, which typically will sit on the shoulder,” she said.
https://globalnews.ca/news/6856478/gun-advocates-justin-trudeau-nova-scotia-shooting/
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Offline kkwd

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #776 on: April 23, 2020, 21:50:49 »

These kind of gems come from the gun-control advocates. Banning pistol grips  ::)
https://globalnews.ca/news/6856478/gun-advocates-justin-trudeau-nova-scotia-shooting/
I guess all those expensive sighting systems are a waste of money since you can just affix a pistol grip and shoot from the hip.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2020, 21:54:59 by kkwd »
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Offline Colin P

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #777 on: April 23, 2020, 22:46:05 »
So if I add a pistol grip to my .303, then it's an assault rifle?

Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #778 on: April 23, 2020, 22:47:30 »
So if I add a pistol grip to my .303, then it's an assault rifle?

Absolutely.
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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #779 on: April 24, 2020, 09:20:10 »
On the bright side, this should mean that SKS, M1s and mini-14 owners will be left alone. No pistol grip there....

Wendy Cukier can be relied on to always say something ill-informed about firearms. Remarkable, since she has opposed firearms ownership of any kind for decades, you think that she would have learned something, anything that is actually true (even accidentally) on the subject by now.

Offline Remius

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #780 on: April 24, 2020, 09:26:15 »
So if I add a pistol grip to my .303, then it's an assault rifle?


Assault rifles aren’t really a thing so you can call anything an assault rifle by adding all sorts of parts.

In Star Wars Battlefront 2 on Xbox I sometimes play the assault variant.  Plenty of space guns to mod up.  I much prefer the sniper variant with telescoping sights and stabilizers.

The real problem is pistols.  Han Solo’s especially.  That needs to go. Blaster pistols should be banned.
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Offline Haggis

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #781 on: April 24, 2020, 09:45:44 »
On the bright side, this should mean that SKS, M1s and mini-14 owners will be left alone. No pistol grip there....

Wendy Cukier can be relied on to always say something ill-informed about firearms. Remarkable, since she has opposed firearms ownership of any kind for decades, you think that she would have learned something, anything that is actually true (even accidentally) on the subject by now.
Nonetheless, the media listens to her and she is regularly trotted out as a gun policy "expert". Because the antis have no aversion to latching onto a criminal act involving firearms, they are always able to get out in front on this issue every time while the pro-gun groups are more cautious in their statements, using facts instead of emotions and, therefore, playing catch-up.   Gun control groups are well versed in the Catherine McKenna style of swaying public opinion.
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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #782 on: April 24, 2020, 17:28:25 »

I suppose I could re-do this SOPMOD Enfield with a pistol grip and collapsing stock too...?



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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #783 on: April 24, 2020, 17:33:03 »
I bet that’s a kicky little goat.
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Offline Baz

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #784 on: April 24, 2020, 17:37:42 »
Quote
Some of N.S. gunman's weapons came from U.S., police say
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/investigation-firearms-ns-shooting-1.5544180

Offline MCG

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #785 on: April 25, 2020, 08:26:41 »
Assault rifles aren’t really a thing so you can call anything an assault rifle by adding all sorts of parts.
Actually, assault rifles are a thing.  Assault rifles are fully automatic capable rifles which fire a sub-powered rifle ammunition.  Assault rifles are already prohibited weapons in Canada.
By contrast, "assault-style rifle" and "assault weapon" are meaningless terms.

Offline MilEME09

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #786 on: April 25, 2020, 10:05:19 »
Actually, assault rifles are a thing.  Assault rifles are fully automatic capable rifles which fire a sub-powered rifle ammunition.  Assault rifles are already prohibited weapons in Canada.
By contrast, "assault-style rifle" and "assault weapon" are meaningless terms.

Do you have that definition from a book? Even at RCEME School, our books still would call that a semi-automatic firearm, as does the RCMP.
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Offline MCG

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #787 on: April 25, 2020, 12:59:15 »
Actually, assault rifles are a thing.  Assault rifles are fully automatic capable rifles which fire a sub-powered rifle ammunition.  Assault rifles are already prohibited weapons in Canada.
By contrast, "assault-style rifle" and "assault weapon" are meaningless terms.

Do you have that definition from a book? Even at RCEME School, our books still would call that a semi-automatic firearm, as does the RCMP.
Why would the RCEME school refer to a fully automatic capable rifle as a semi-automatic firearm?
As for a reference that defines assault rifles as being fully automatic capable, check any number of books by Ian Hogg to include:


« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 13:04:56 by MCG »

Offline MilEME09

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #788 on: April 25, 2020, 13:04:37 »

Do you have that definition from a book? Even at RCEME School, our books still would call that a semi-automatic firearm, as does the RCMP.
Why would the RCEME school refer to a fully automatic capable rifle as a semi-automatic firearm?
As for a reference that defines assault rifles as being fully automatic capable, check any number of books by Ian Hogg to include: https://www.amazon.com/Story-Gun-Ian-V-Hogg/dp/031214895X/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=

After rechecking my available resources, I am mistaken, C7 is an automatic rifle, While assault rifle makes sense for a fully automatic rifle, it describes a physical action, not a mechanism of the weapon which is why i do not like that term.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 13:08:57 by MilEME09 »
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Offline suffolkowner

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #789 on: April 25, 2020, 13:30:42 »
Not to dig up old wounds, but I believe the terminology is derived from the US military to differentiate between battle rifles/full powered cartridges and assault rifles/intermediate powered cartridges. Outside of that there is probably no relevance

Offline MCG

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #790 on: April 25, 2020, 13:56:10 »
Not to dig up old wounds, but I believe the terminology is derived from the US military to differentiate between battle rifles/full powered cartridges and assault rifles/intermediate powered cartridges. Outside of that there is probably no relevance
No.  The terminology does draw on the distinction between full powered cartridges and intermediate powered, because it is that distinction that makes the assault rifle capable of controlled automatic fire.  But it is not derived from US military terminology.  Ian Hogg is a British historian, and he links the term back to the original assault rifle - the Sturmgewehr 44.

Offline suffolkowner

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #791 on: April 25, 2020, 14:01:31 »
No.  The terminology does draw on the distinction between full powered cartridges and intermediate powered, because it is that distinction that makes the assault rifle capable of controlled automatic fire.  But it is not derived from US military terminology.  Ian Hogg is a British historian, and he links the term back to the original assault rifle - the Sturmgewehr 44.

So maybe an assault rifle ban will leave my non automatic battle rifles alone, lol

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #792 on: April 25, 2020, 16:34:26 »
So I have an older CAF pam, which is no longer available B-GL-317-025/JK-001 Weapons Volume 25 Small Arms Vocabulary and it defines Assault Rifle as “Light, short-barrelled, selective-fire rifle utilizing an intermediate-powered cartridge".
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #793 on: April 25, 2020, 18:02:35 »
Two men face charges after police respond to weapons complaint in Dartmouth, N.S.
Quote
HALIFAX -- Two men have been arrested and are facing charges after Halifax Regional Police responded to a weapons complaint in Dartmouth, N.S. Friday afternoon.

Police received a report at 3:14 p.m. that two men had been passing a firearm back and forth in the parking lot of the Canadian Tire in Dartmouth Crossing.
Quote
Police believe the men took the airsoft weapon to the parking lot and passed it back and forth, then entered the Canadian Tire store to purchase airsoft ammunition and a Co2 canister.
Quote
The men are facing charges of possession of a weapon dangerous to the public peace.

https://atlantic.ctvnews.ca/two-men-face-charges-after-police-respond-to-weapons-complaint-in-dartmouth-n-s-1.4910892

Overkill?

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Offline ballz

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #794 on: April 25, 2020, 18:50:10 »
Two men face charges after police respond to weapons complaint in Dartmouth, N.S.
https://atlantic.ctvnews.ca/two-men-face-charges-after-police-respond-to-weapons-complaint-in-dartmouth-n-s-1.4910892

Overkill?

The usual oppression of Canada's 2nd-class citizens....
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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #795 on: April 25, 2020, 19:27:28 »
The two are tone deaf maybe, but I can't figure out how an airsoft rifle could be considered a weapon dangerous to the public peace.
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Offline my72jeep

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #796 on: April 25, 2020, 20:22:03 »
The two are tone deaf maybe, but I can't figure out how an airsoft rifle could be considered a weapon dangerous to the public peace.
It’s catch all charge just like unsafe storage. Yahoos with look alike guns could start a panic. It will most likely stick do to the current climate in Nova Scotia.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 20:32:06 by my72jeep »
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Offline Oldgateboatdriver

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #797 on: April 26, 2020, 08:59:48 »
The two are tone deaf maybe, but I can't figure out how an airsoft rifle could be considered a weapon dangerous to the public peace.

Section 88 of the Criminal Code states: "Every person commits an offence who carries or possesses a weapon, an imitation of a weapon, a prohibited device or any ammunition or prohibited ammunition for a purpose dangerous to the public peace or for the purpose of committing an offence."

So an air soft gun can certainly qualify as an imitation of a weapon, especially to the uneducated eye.

However, you may have noted that either the journalist because he wanted to edit his piece, or the cops because they wanted to make a point outside the purview of the law as drafted, left out the word "purpose" from the accusation. This actually requires evidence of an intent to use the imitation weapon for a dangerous purpose to public peace. That intent will be hard to prove, as merely showing up somewhere with a weapon for a legal purpose yet causing concern in some citizens is not sufficient evidence of intent.

In short, the mere effect caused in some citizens is not proof of intent in and of itself.

I suspect that the charges will be dropped quietly once a defence attorney gets involved.

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #798 on: April 26, 2020, 09:36:32 »
Section 88 of the Criminal Code states: "Every person commits an offence who carries or possesses a weapon, an imitation of a weapon, a prohibited device or any ammunition or prohibited ammunition for a purpose dangerous to the public peace or for the purpose of committing an offence."

So an air soft gun can certainly qualify as an imitation of a weapon, especially to the uneducated eye.

However, you may have noted that either the journalist because he wanted to edit his piece, or the cops because they wanted to make a point outside the purview of the law as drafted, left out the word "purpose" from the accusation. This actually requires evidence of an intent to use the imitation weapon for a dangerous purpose to public peace. That intent will be hard to prove, as merely showing up somewhere with a weapon for a legal purpose yet causing concern in some citizens is not sufficient evidence of intent.

In short, the mere effect caused in some citizens is not proof of intent in and of itself.

I suspect that the charges will be dropped quietly once a defence attorney gets involved.
Any competent defense lawyer should be able to shred this one, but not before costing these two a pretty hefty sum.
Apparently, a "USUAL SUSPECT"

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Offline Haggis

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Re: The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0
« Reply #799 on: April 26, 2020, 09:41:42 »
Any competent defense lawyer should be able to shred this one, but not before costing these two a pretty hefty sum.

Which is punishment enough and will encourage other Airsofters to be more discreet.  Mission accomplished.
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