CAF Combat boots policy 2005-2018

[armyvern]

Vern:

That's one pub that's being done properly.

I challenge you to find an up-to-date version of the dress manual, though...

There isn't one.

Hard to publish what is in (these days) a daily influx of ammendments and changes due to kit being constantly introduced ... where the heck does one begin when nary a minute goes by where someone somewhere isn't changing beard regs, ballcap regs, TV regs, badges allowed on "XX" mess kit uniform regs ... etc etc

Perhaps that's their story?  ???

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Now, the new manual in it's electronic form (The 007 CFSM) is available to every soldier/sailor/airman who has DIN access right from their own workplace. I've posted the links to it here before and have referenced the applic paras dealing without footwear. No need to cut message ammendments either via CANFORGEN or other means --- the CFSM is updated weekly online.

No one has to run any further than their computer. Sure we need to check weekly for updates, but we had to do that in the "old days" too - and it's a 500% more effecient process to do so these days.

The ref is CFSM Vol 3, Chap 13, Sect G, 3-13G-002 - Special size personal allotment clothing, footwear and orthopaedic furniture. para's 5-10 (unless I am right out of it this morning)?  I'll post the contents here for those who don't have access to CFSM. 

CFSM Link - DWAN/Intranet/DIN access only

5.  Special size footwear:

The following definitions are provided for the purpose of this article:

Orthoses: Is an orthopaedic appliance or apparatus used to support, align, prevent or correct deformities or to improve function of moveable parts of the body. One common example is a custom foot insole. 

Orthopaedic Footwear: Is custom footwear required by individuals with deformed or surgically treated feet. This includes custom-made military pattern footwear, and internal or external modifications to military and civilian footwear. Orthopaedic footwear is funded by the Command Surgeon.

If after being fitted IAW Measuring and fitting of footwear (3-13G-003) an individual is found to have a foot size, which does not fall within the range of standard catalogue footwear sizes and does not require orthopaedic footwear, the individual will be provided with special size footwear. B/W/S are responsible to fund these requirements through their Command allotments. All special size boots are free issue to all Regular and Reserve force members. Supply sections shall ensure the member receives footwear that fits properly and that meets performance and quality standards equivalent to the authorized CF footwear to which the member is entitled as defined in the applicable scales of issue. Special size safety footwear must meet the safety standards of the regulation footwear. Supply sections are under no obligation to procure brand name footwear. The procedures for Special size shoes/oxfords is covered at para 7.

Athletic Shoes will only be issued to recruits on a one time basis and will not be exchangeable or available for purchase.  CF members Regular and Reserve force are responsible for the purchase of athletic shoes upon completion of recruit training.  The only exception would be for a member who has suffered a CF related injury or has surgically treated feet and requires a custom build athletic shoe.  In these rare cases the athletic shoe would be purchased by supply and funded by the Command Surgeon.

Note:  Class “A” Reservists shall only be issued one pair of Special Size Boots or Oxfords/Shoes as applicable. For example if an individual is entitled to one pair of shoes and two pair of boots the individual shall be issued one pair of shoes and one pair of boots. If the individual is converted to “B” or “C” class they shall be issued their full entitlement.

When special size footwear is ordered for an individual Supply Customer Maintenance MSO014 shall be used to annotate the member’s IA (special instructions) with the special size requirements. Item(s) should be brought on charge using the stock code of the closest size, taking caution to ensure that the total quantity (comprised of current balance, dues-in and special size items) does not exceed the district ROP/ROQ, which in turn could result in redistribution. Each time the individual requires footwear; the IA shall be checked to ascertain when the item was previously issued. Normally, special size footwear shall not be ordered for individuals during their last six months of service.

Special size footwear issued to an individual shall not be withdrawn when the employment justifying its issue ceases. The individual retains the footwear during his entire period of service.

6.  Orthopaedic and modified footwear:

When recommended by a medical board or specialist, individuals with deformed or surgically treated feet shall be provided with specially made or modified footwear in lieu of regulation boots and shoes.

Orthopaedic footwear shall be obtained through a Federal, Provincial or local orthopaedic and prosthetic facility IAW MSI 7000-011 Footwear requiring modification shall be altered as required by the same orthopaedic facility or by local procurement when authorized by the base medical officer, at no expense to the individual.

Special Size Orthopaedic boots and modification to boots are always at no cost to the member.  Special Size Orthopaedic Boots shall be brought on charge by CRV and entered on the individual’s IA.  Only the initial issue of Orthopaedic shoes/oxfords are free issue, procedures are detailed in para 7 of this article. 

Normally orthopaedic footwear shall not be ordered for individuals during their last six months of service.

Orthopaedic footwear obtained as per MSI 7000-011 is paid for by the appropriate Command Surgeon.

7.  Special Size Shoes/Oxfords

Special size shoes/oxfords are free issue upon enrolment.  Following enrolment special size shoe requirements must be purchased using applicable points for shoes/oxfords. If points are not available, member is required to purchase the shoes as per the price indicated using MSO101, option 1, action code “9.”  There are only two exceptions, which allow the free issue of shoes/oxfords following an individual’s enrolment:

The initial issue of shoes/oxfords as a result of a change in medical condition which requires shoes to accommodate orthoses such as arch supports, special insoles etc. The member must present the prescription or medical chit to Clothing Stores to be entitled to the initial free issue. The initial issue is funded by the supporting supply section through Command allotments. All subsequent requirements must be paid for using the applicable points for shoes/oxfords or funded by the member as per the price indicated using MSO101, option 1, action code “9” Clothing Stores must forward details of special size shoe purchases including members name, SN, item purchased to DSSPM email who will have the applicable number of points removed from the members account.

The initial issue of Orthopaedic or modified shoes/oxfords are free issue, and funded by the Command Surgeon. Any subsequent issues must be paid for using the applicable number of points for shoes/oxfords or funded by the member with the price indicated using MSO101 option “9." Orthopaedic footwear is defined at Para 5a. Clothing Stores must forward details of purchase to DSSPM so points can be removed, same procedure as for special size shoes. A copy of the medical officer’s recommendation is to be filed in the individual’s CF 892, and Supply Customer Maintenance MSO014 shall be used to annotate the member’s IA (special instructions) with the appropriate information.

8.  Resoling of MKIII combat boots NSN 8430-21-872-4291

Resoling is limited to the MKIII combat boot only, Medical Specialist Officers and GDMO are the only authority that can prescribe replacement of the insole and outsole components. Funding for the replacement of components is the responsibility of the supporting supply section through their command allotments as per the special funding requirements.

In the event that resoling of the MKIII is prescribed alteration specifications should be coordinated between the Medical Officer and the physiotherapist. NDHQ/DSSPM 2-3 is available to provide technical assistance, as required. 

In the event that resoling is prescribed to alleviate a medical condition diagnosed IAW policies established in MSI 7000-011, the following specifications should be followed:


Materiel - Vibram “Sierra” (Model #1276) or Vibram “Kletterlift” (Model #148) outsole with a cushion midsole of polyurethane.

Thickness - The thickness of the polyurethane should be sufficient to maintain the original heel elevation of the boot. It should generally run from approximately 1 inch thick at the heel to a third of an inch - to half an inch at the ball and toe.

9. Orthopaedic furniture. Orthopaedic furniture shall only be procured for individuals whose requirements have been given a prognosis and have been identified on an appropriate certificate signed by a medical doctor or chiropractor. A copy of the medical certificate shall be filed in the member's CF 892.  It is a unit responsibility to fund orthopaedic furniture requirements. Issues of orthopaedic chairs or furniture shall be classified as personal allotments and shall be documented on the individual’s IA special instructions using Supply Customer Maintenance MSO014. Stock number 21AAE4895 shall be used to issue orthopaedic chairs to a member’s IA. 

10.  Retention on posting of special size/orthopaedic clothing, footwear and equipment. When an individual is posted, transferred or seconded to another department the base/station/wing shall ensure that special size/orthopaedic items accompany the individual. In the case of furniture, these items may accompany individuals provided that there is departmental agreement that such transfers are cost beneficial.

 

[PMedMoe]

What enviornment are you?

Both the types of footwear and the numbers of each type of footwear you are entitled to change dependant upon enviornment and trade.

For example, sailors are not entitled to any pairs of combat boots. Air/Army aren't entitled to 2 pr sea boots.
Sup Techs, MSE Ops, Engr etc are entitled to 2 pr safety boots as well - Infantry guys to none ...

Whatever the case, whatever you are entitled to for your trade & enviornment in stock-issued footwear ... you are entitled to same (& entitled to same qty of each type as if they were your "issued") in custom/LPOd footwear if the mil pattern do not accomodate your orthotics into them.

I am Army.  Oh, and I forgot, I do have 1 pair of safety boots as required by trade. 

 

[armyvern]

I am Army.  Oh, and I forgot, I do have 1 pair of safety boots as required by trade. 

Then you're entitled to

2 pr cbt boots (or GP);
2 pr CWWB; and
1 pr safety boots.

If any of the above do not accomodate your orthotics (chit dated within 2 years), you are entitled to have them LPOd (or custom). You'd still end up entitled to 5 pairs total at the end of the day.

Whether you choose to go to clothing and obtain them however is another matter as you stated below that you had "chosen" not to. Many pers choose not to get the ankle boots or oxfords done as they rarely wear them; depends on your personal sit.

 

[meni0n]

After being told by the doc at the base clinic to go get vibram sole boots, I went to clothing stores, and was told that there is a new policy, I have to bring them both of my Mk IIIs to exchange for one pair of vibram sole. Anyone else got that policy in their LFC or is that just LFQA? I`m going on course soon and would need two pairs.

 

[McG]

After being told by the doc at the base clinic to go get vibram sole boots, I went to clothing stores, and was told that there is a new policy, I have to bring them both of my Mk IIIs to exchange for one pair of vibram sole.

1. Health Services cannot prescribe brand-names for footwear.  They may prescribe that your footwear need to have given characteristics which are not found in the issued footwear - in this case the supply system would choose if the best way of achieving the characteristic would be re-soled MkIII, new GP boots, or an alternative LPO product.

2.  If you require special footwear, your entitlement is not reduced as to the number of boots that you should have unless you are a Class A reservist. 

For every boot that you have an entitlement, the CF is responsible to provide you footwear that fit your feet and are medically compatible with you.  If you are not getting this, that ask to speak with a supervisor at clothing stores.  If this fails, have your chain of command engage.  If this still fails to result in a timely resolution, then submit a redress of grievance to your Commanding Officer (who will probably forward it to the CO of your local ASG/ASU as IA).

If you are getting boots in the right quantities for every entitled type that fit and are medically compatible but you just don't like them, then submit a UCR.

 

[meni0n]

Thanks for the info. The new GP boots have vibram soles on them and that's what the doc meant when he wrote it on the chit. I actually did have two pairs issued and now waiting to go get sized for orthodics and then see how well they fit. But I did do a BFT in the new boots and they were horrible, my feet were a mess after. I don't know if it was because I didn't have the time to break them in or because they were just a tad longer than a snug fit. Some guys on the BFT wore Magnums which they said they bought only to wear for the 13km. Right now it seems like not a bad idea as I really don't want to go thru the same pain again.

 

[George Wallace]

Thanks for the info. The new GP boots have vibram soles on them and that's what the doc meant when he wrote it on the chit. I actually did have two pairs issued and now waiting to go get sized for orthodics and then see how well they fit. But I did do a BFT in the new boots and they were horrible, my feet were a mess after. I don't know if it was because I didn't have the time to break them in or because they were just a tad longer than a snug fit. Some guys on the BFT wore Magnums which they said they bought only to wear for the 13km. Right now it seems like not a bad idea as I really don't want to go thru the same pain again.

There is a topic on the GP boots (or Mark IV as some like to call them) and how they are comfy slippers when in the office, but cripplers when worn in the Field for long marches.  Even when broken in for a year, they will rip your feet to shreds.

 

[meni0n]

Thanks for the info George. Now I am not sure what to do, I have to have boots with vibram sole for medical reason but the boots destroyed my feet on the march. Should I go back to the doc and ask for a chit for boots that won't screw up my feet like the GP did?

 

[Loachman]

That could not hurt.

I did the BFT a couple of weeks ago with Magnums and Sole Footbeds. No foot issues at all. I had convinced/helped convince several others to try Magnums as well, and a few more were going to buy some after the BFT.

I did my last BFT two years ago with Mk IIIs and Sole Footbeds, and had to tape my feet to avoid blisters. That was unusual as I never had blister problems before. These were my oldest/comfiest Mk IIIs though, and perhaps a little loose as a result. I bought my Magnums shortly afterwards, mainly because of the atrocious a** f**ce cold wet weather boots.

No sense using forty-year-old boot technology when competitive manufacturers have gone so far beyond that.

 

[PuckChaser]

Though I'm not a doctor, a lot of the BFT issues people have are their boots aren't snug. I've only ever gotten 1 blister from a BFT or ruckmarch, and it was because my socks bunched up on a toe. Friction is a killer, and if your feet are sliding forwards and backwards, or side to side with every step, its a recipe for hamburger feet. If your GP boots don't fit perfectly, try QM and get a snug size (they stretch when broken in). If they can't give you the right size (insist that close enough isn't good enough) and your chit for COTS boots should be good to go.

 

[George Wallace]

Though I'm not a doctor, a lot of the BFT issues people have are their boots aren't snug. I've only ever gotten 1 blister from a BFT or ruckmarch, and it was because my socks bunched up on a toe. Friction is a killer, and if your feet are sliding forwards and backwards, or side to side with every step, its a recipe for hamburger feet. If your GP boots don't fit perfectly, try QM and get a snug size (they stretch when broken in). If they can't give you the right size (insist that close enough isn't good enough) and your chit for COTS boots should be good to go.

The hard leather cup in the heel is a killer.  Blisters on top of feet as well as bottoms.  These are fairly serious problems for a boot to have.  I have had Mk I, Mk II, and Mk III boots over the years, with very few problems with blisters, other than Nijmegen.  The GP boots ended that trend.  My feet were butchered. 


[Edit to add:  And that was in the days when we had to do the 2 X 10 mile, later the 2 X 13 km.]

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Though I'm not a doctor, a lot of the BFT issues people have are their boots aren't snug. I've only ever gotten 1 blister from a BFT or ruckmarch, and it was because my socks bunched up on a toe. Friction is a killer, and if your feet are sliding forwards and backwards, or side to side with every step, its a recipe for hamburger feet. If your GP boots don't fit perfectly, try QM and get a snug size (they stretch when broken in). If they can't give you the right size (insist that close enough isn't good enough) and your chit for COTS boots should be good to go.

Just going to hazard a guess , but I'll bet most everyone here already knows how to suck eggs.

But thanks anyway.

 

[meni0n]

If I still had my MK3s I doubt I would have had the same problems. I do know my feet moved a little bit inside but it didn't cause a lot of problems. The boot is a tad on the heavy side, which gave me shin splints for the first km or so so until I slowed down a bit, which translated into more muscle fatigue on my legs, which I never had with the lighter MK3s. I also noticed the area near the big toe on the left boot is pretty tight which is why the toenail on my toe is a shade of blue-red. I only got 1 blister on the whole walk so it wasn't really the friction as much as the boots themselves.

 

[Loachman]

Many years ago, I started carving off the "corners" of the heel on new combat boots to round them and reduce the camming action of the foot coming down and rotating. No shin splints since. The Magnums already have rounded heels.

 

[COBRA-6]

That could not hurt.

I did the BFT a couple of weeks ago with Magnums and Sole Footbeds. No foot issues at all. I had convinced/helped convince several others to try Magnums as well, and a few more were going to buy some after the BFT.

I did my last BFT two years ago with Mk IIIs and Sole Footbeds, and had to tape my feet to avoid blisters. That was unusual as I never had blister problems before. These were my oldest/comfiest Mk IIIs though, and perhaps a little loose as a result. I bought my Magnums shortly afterwards, mainly because of the atrocious a** f**ce cold wet weather boots.

No sense using forty-year-old boot technology when competitive manufacturers have gone so far beyond that.

I used to get crazy blood blisters doing ruck marches, and shin splints. Switched to Original SWAT with Superfeet insoles and now I don't even get hotspots. I will never go back. Convinced a few others to try SWATs or Magnums and they are all converts. Some go through the process to get a chit so they don't have to buy them, others just pick up a pair on their own dime. No one seems to care either way, as long as they're black here or tan over there.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I used to get crazy blood blisters doing ruck marches, and shin splints. Switched to Original SWAT with Superfeet insoles and now I don't even get hotspots. I will never go back. Convinced a few others to try SWATs or Magnums and they are all converts. Some go through the process to get a chit so they don't have to buy them, others just pick up a pair on their own dime. No one seems to care either way, as long as they're black here or tan over there.

My SWATS & Magnums are the best boots I've had on my feet since I joined in 68. A heck of a long way from hobnailed, cleated boots and putees I started with ;D

 

[COBRA-6]

My SWATS & Magnums are the best boots I've had on my feet since I joined in 68. A heck of a long way from hobnailed, cleated boots and putees I started with ;D

I found a pic!  ;D

 

[medaid]

Magnums are great (for me) and I haven't worn a pair of issued boots since I got them. Honestly, with the insulated versions of Magnums out there now, who'd want to wear the WWB?

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Question for those who might know:

Is there a list of CF-approved LPO replacement boots for each kind of "issued" boot?  If so...where the hell do you find it?  If not...why not?

It sure would make it easier for all involved.