Liberal (Minority/Majority) Government 2025 - ???

[Czech_pivo]

Then cuts the taxes from all food and fuel products.

I know you're looking to get ahead and give your man top cover.

lol, no, I’m looking 6 months down the road as a good PM does and I’m seeing the roadblocks.

And for me PM = Project Manager

 

[Halifax Tar]

lol, no, I’m looking 6 months down the road as a good PM does and I’m seeing the roadblocks.

And for me PM = Project Manager

The Gov is basically profiteering of inflated prices. Cut the taxes.

If not this sits squarely in PMMCs lap IMHO.

 

[Eaglelord17]

The Gov is basically profiteering of inflated prices. Cut the taxes.

If not this sits squarely in PMMCs lap IMHO.

We can’t afford to cut taxes. If anything we should be starting to heavily cut expenses and/or increase taxes.

Just cutting taxes right now would be a childish reaction. There is still bills to pay and we aren’t even remotely close to breaking even.

 

[Deleted member 175000]

The Gov is basically profiteering of inflated prices. Cut the taxes.

If not this sits squarely in PMMCs lap IMHO.

That's the talking point yes.

Reality however-
-the cost of CFR is a regulatory burden, not a tax (now matter how often PP says it). Ending it today doesnt strip out the sunk cost of compliance infrastructure, or the price premium on inventories throughout the various stages of the supply chain. It would take months for that to trickle through to a price break at the pumps. Whether you like the policy or not in principle- tying its cancellation to immediate relief from the cancellation is innaccurate opportunism.

The excise tax- flat rate per litre and doesn't scale with prices, no windfall

That leaves the GST of 5%. In my neck of the woods gas has gone from 1.30 to 1.80. The GST portion of that has gone from 6.2 cents to 8.6 cents. Giving back that "windfall" doesnt move the needle on the price of gas.

Any material consumer gas relief needs to be called what it is: deficit funded transfers

 

[Halifax Tar]

We can’t afford to cut taxes. If anything we should be starting to heavily cut expenses and/or increase taxes.

Just cutting taxes right now would be a childish reaction. There is still bills to pay and we aren’t even remotely close to breaking even.

Im cool with that too, where should we start ?

Departments and agencies - Canada.ca

Here is an alphabetical list of links to current Government of Canada Departments, Agencies, Crown Corporations, Special Operating Agencies and other related organizations.

www.canada.ca

Increase taxes eh...

 

[Halifax Tar]

That's the talking point yes.

Reality however-
-the cost of CFR is a regulatory burden, not a tax (now matter how often PP says it). Ending it today doesnt strip out the sunk cost of compliance infrastructure, or the price premium on inventories throughout the various stages of the supply chain. It would take months for that to trickle through to a price break at the pumps. Whether you like the policy or not in principle- tying its cancellation to immediate relief from the cancellation is innaccurate opportunism.

The excise tax- flat rate per litre and doesn't scale with prices, no windfall

That leaves the GST of 5%. In my neck of the woods gas has gone from 1.30 to 1.80. The GST portion of that has gone from 6.2 cents to 8.6 cents. Giving back that "windfall" doesnt move the needle on the price of gas.

Any material consumer gas relief needs to be called what it is: deficit funded transfers

I am not sure what knot you tied there, I never was very good at it. I normally go with the tied lots method.

Anyways, cut the taxes on food and fuel.

Fuel isn't for me, I really could care less about the price of gas. I didn't buy V8 because I want to dread going to the pumps. But I know lots people around need that help.

Food, no food or water should be taxed period.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

Any material consumer gas relief needs to be called what it is: deficit funded transfers

Exactly.

 

[Eaglelord17]

Im cool with that too, where should we start ?

Departments and agencies - Canada.ca

Here is an alphabetical list of links to current Government of Canada Departments, Agencies, Crown Corporations, Special Operating Agencies and other related organizations.

www.canada.ca

Increase taxes eh...

I am of the opinion we shouldn’t run deficits except in times of extreme emergencies (i.e. WWII, etc.). We can afford to have no deficit, our greed prevents us and punishes the future.

Raising taxes makes people care about overspending and demands accountability because people don’t like to pay. If we had no national debt we currently would have no deficit. Thats how bad it has gotten. Thats billions upon billions wasted in interest just selling out our children. We don’t even have anything to show for it.

As to where I would start cutting, my first place would be OAS. Shouldn’t be paying welfare to people making more money than me.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I am of the opinion we shouldn’t run deficits except in times of extreme emergencies (i.e. WWII, etc.). We can afford to have no deficit, our greed prevents us and punishes the future.

Raising taxes makes people care about overspending and demands accountability because people don’t like to pay. If we had no national debt we currently would have no deficit. Thats how bad it has gotten. Thats billions upon billions wasted in interest just selling out our children. We don’t even have anything to show for it.

I think its pretty apparent Canadians don't care about debt and deficits right now.

As to where I would start cutting, my first place would be OAS. Shouldn’t be paying welfare to people making more money than me.

I agree. How do we get the voting block of those collecting OAS to buy in ?

For a politician this all comes down to re-electability. They wont touch this until that cohort is less powerful.

 

[Eaglelord17]

I think its pretty apparent Canadians don't care about debt and deficits right now.



I agree. How do we get the voting block of those collecting OAS to buy in ?

For a politician this all comes down to re-electability. They wont touch this until that cohort is less powerful.

Sometimes being in power means doing unpopular but necessary things.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Sometimes being in power means doing unpopular but necessary things.

Can you find me a politician willing to be that guy ?

 

[Deleted member 175000]

I am not sure what knot you tied there, I never was very good at it. I normally go with the tied lots method.

Anyways, cut the taxes on food and fuel.

Your exact words were "The Gov is basically profiteering of inflated prices. Cut the taxes."

I was pointing out that the actually "price profiteering" on the consumer end is minimal, and that 1:1 relief based on returning it would also be minimal.

Any absolute position that those taxes shouldn't exist is unrelated to the current Iran driven price spike, and leveraging a short-term surplus from revenue pool A (GST on oil) to permanently eliminate revenue streams B and C (Excise tax, GST on gas) is fiscally irresponsible.

 

[Eaglelord17]

Can you find me a politician willing to be that guy ?

I don’t think Chretien is willing/able to run anymore.

 

[Czech_pivo]

Im cool with that too, where should we start ?

Departments and agencies - Canada.ca

Here is an alphabetical list of links to current Government of Canada Departments, Agencies, Crown Corporations, Special Operating Agencies and other related organizations.

www.canada.ca

Increase taxes eh...

Cutting expenses does nothing in dealing with rising food costs due to higher fuel/fertilizer/input costs.
Cutting HST/GST does virtually nothing either.

There is really nothing that can be effectively done. We are not the only country in the world facing this issue - virtually ever single free market country is in the same boat.

Not even sure if this would be effective - but creating a national strategy, as they did in both WW1 and WW2, to reduce food imports might move the needle in terms of vegetables/fruits imports over the summer/fall months. Provide tax deductions or tax credits for the costs of growing your own veggies and such. Open up more municipal lands for allotments and using brown fields/lands that are awaiting development to be used to grow more veggies and such. If people can start to grow more of what they eat, it will make them healthier by being outside more, growing veggies chemically free, getting to know more of their neighbours and reducing their food bills for a 4-5 months of the year. Give them tax incentives or tax credits in the materials they need, the costs they incur and maybe a tax donation credit if they are able to donate some of the food they grow or give to elderly neighbours who can't grow their own.

When I lived in the Czech Republic in mid 90's, I lived in a suburb of Prague where the majority of the people lived in low rise apartments. Pretty much all of those folks had their own 'allotments' or 'zahradni domek', which basically was a very small 'bunkie' and some land that they used pretty much every single inch of for growing their own veggies and such. It was and still is, very very common in most of central/eastern Europe and in a number of western European countries. I wanted to have my own 'piece of land' when I lived there because it was something that I had always did when I was a kid growing up, helping out with the family garden, and, I was drinking and chasing girls way to much and I was looking for something to distract me. I went to the local Catholic Church with one of my co-workers who help interpret for me and I was allowed to use a small piece of land that had been unused for years. My Dad mailed over my seeds in the winter and by late March I had started to turn over the soil and plant. I grow alot of things that the Czechs didn't or varieties they had never seen (only 4yrs after Communism). It got me outside, meeting more of the locals and developing relationships with them, reduced my drinking and womanizing and provided me with alot more veggies options than what I had in the local grocery store.

Examples:

Allotment gardening in the Czech Republic plays a significant role in food self-provisioning, with roughly 38% of the population growing their own fruits or vegetables. While the majority of this food is grown in gardens attached to residential houses, allotments (or "garden colonies") are a crucial component of urban agriculture, particularly in large cities like Ostrava and Brno

Allotment gardens in Poland—known as rodzinne ogrody działkowe (ROD)—are a significant source of locally grown food, with over 900,000 plots covering approximately 40,000 hectares. While traditionally used for self-sufficiency, modern plots often serve a hybrid function, balancing food production with recreation

Dacha gardens (allotments) in Russia play a massive role in the country’s food supply, with recent studies and historical data showing that these small, mostly household-operated plots produce roughly 40% to over 50% of Russia's total agricultural output by value. Despite using only about 3% to 6% of the country's total agricultural land, these plots are responsible for a majority of key food items produced in Russia

There is ALOT of unused or underused land across Canada that could be used for this purpose. Here is my city of Burlington its in place on a very very small scale and the waiting time of a piece of land is long.

Community Gardens

Growing an edible garden is a fun way to get active outdoors and enjoy fresh and nutritious fruits, veggies and herbs. Our community garden program lets you rent a garden plot for a season to grow your garden.

www.burlington.ca

• Due to high demand, garden plot permits are for one season. All plots must be entirely cleared at the end of the season.
• All applicants will have to submit their lottery registration every year. There will be no wait-list or carry over to the next year.
• The garden season begins May 1 and ends October 31.

https://www.burlington.ca/en/arts-culture-and-events/resources/Farms-Community-Gardens-and-Markets/Community_Garden_Plot_Diagrams_FINAL-s.pdf

 

[Halifax Tar]

I don’t think Chretien is willing/able to run anymore.

Doubtful lol.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Cutting expenses does nothing in dealing with rising food costs due to higher fuel/fertilizer/input costs.
Cutting HST/GST does virtually nothing either.

There is really nothing that can be effectively done. We are not the only country in the world facing this issue - virtually ever single free market country is in the same boat.

Not even sure if this would be effective - but creating a national strategy, as they did in both WW1 and WW2, to reduce food imports might move the needle in terms of vegetables/fruits imports over the summer/fall months. Provide tax deductions or tax credits for the costs of growing your own veggies and such. Open up more municipal lands for allotments and using brown fields/lands that are awaiting development to be used to grow more veggies and such. If people can start to grow more of what they eat, it will make them healthier by being outside more, growing veggies chemically free, getting to know more of their neighbours and reducing their food bills for a 4-5 months of the year. Give them tax incentives or tax credits in the materials they need, the costs they incur and maybe a tax donation credit if they are able to donate some of the food they grow or give to elderly neighbours who can't grow their own.

When I lived in the Czech Republic in mid 90's, I lived in a suburb of Prague where the majority of the people lived in low rise apartments. Pretty much all of those folks had their own 'allotments' or 'zahradni domek', which basically was a very small 'bunkie' and some land that they used pretty much every single inch of for growing their own veggies and such. It was and still is, very very common in most of central/eastern Europe and in a number of western European countries. I wanted to have my own 'piece of land' when I lived there because it was something that I had always did when I was a kid growing up, helping out with the family garden, and, I was drinking and chasing girls way to much and I was looking for something to distract me. I went to the local Catholic Church with one of my co-workers who help interpret for me and I was allowed to use a small piece of land that had been unused for years. My Dad mailed over my seeds in the winter and by late March I had started to turn over the soil and plant. I grow alot of things that the Czechs didn't or varieties they had never seen (only 4yrs after Communism). It got me outside, meeting more of the locals and developing relationships with them, reduced my drinking and womanizing and provided me with alot more veggies options than what I had in the local grocery store.

Examples:

Allotment gardening in the Czech Republic plays a significant role in food self-provisioning, with roughly 38% of the population growing their own fruits or vegetables. While the majority of this food is grown in gardens attached to residential houses, allotments (or "garden colonies") are a crucial component of urban agriculture, particularly in large cities like Ostrava and Brno

Allotment gardens in Poland—known as rodzinne ogrody działkowe (ROD)—are a significant source of locally grown food, with over 900,000 plots covering approximately 40,000 hectares. While traditionally used for self-sufficiency, modern plots often serve a hybrid function, balancing food production with recreation

Dacha gardens (allotments) in Russia play a massive role in the country’s food supply, with recent studies and historical data showing that these small, mostly household-operated plots produce roughly 40% to over 50% of Russia's total agricultural output by value. Despite using only about 3% to 6% of the country's total agricultural land, these plots are responsible for a majority of key food items produced in Russia

There is ALOT of unused or underused land across Canada that could be used for this purpose. Here is my city of Burlington its in place on a very very small scale and the waiting time of a piece of land is long.

Community Gardens

Growing an edible garden is a fun way to get active outdoors and enjoy fresh and nutritious fruits, veggies and herbs. Our community garden program lets you rent a garden plot for a season to grow your garden.

www.burlington.ca

• Due to high demand, garden plot permits are for one season. All plots must be entirely cleared at the end of the season.
• All applicants will have to submit their lottery registration every year. There will be no wait-list or carry over to the next year.
• The garden season begins May 1 and ends October 31.

https://www.burlington.ca/en/arts-culture-and-events/resources/Farms-Community-Gardens-and-Markets/Community_Garden_Plot_Diagrams_FINAL-s.pdf

Canada has turned itself into a nanny/welfare state.

I can guarantee you Canadians will turn to their political leaders for help and solutions in this.

We literally can't get people to take their own physical fitness and health seriously and you think a modern day victory garden will work. My friend this isn't going to end well. And the party in power will pay the butchers bill if they cant be seen to be doing something.

This is the door the NDP can drive their bus through. Unbridled social spending.

 

[Deleted member 175000]

It's not sexy- but what I'd love to see is a commitment to not spend the O&G tax windfall, to stick to the budget and apply any excess revenues to reducing this year's deficit

 

[Czech_pivo]

Canada has turned itself into a nanny/welfare state.

I can guarantee you Canadians will turn to their political leaders for help and solutions in this.

We literally can get people to be take their own physical fitness and health seriously and you think a modern day victory garden will work. My friend this isn't going to end well. And the party in power will pay the butchers bill if they cant be seen to be doing something.

While I don't disagree with you overall, I'm not willing to throw in the towel, shrug my shoulders and walk away.

I know that you know that there is no 'one size fits all' solution to this problem or any problem, but that doesn't mean that solutions that fit part of the problem shouldn't be found or implemented. I had forgotten the term 'victory gardens' for what I was describing, but if these 'Victory Gardens' implemented brought 5, 10, 15% of the population out of their basements/family rooms and growing veggies for 4 months of the year that had a net overall reduction of 5% or 7% in the amount of veggies/fruits that we import from June-Oct would that be a bad thing? If it resulted in lower blood pressure, weight loss and more sense of community belonging among those 5 or 10 or 15% of the population, would that be a 'success' or a 'failure?'

I counted up how many community garden plots my city of Burlington has available every year, its around 225. These are only available for 1yr and then you give it up and have to go back into the lottery system for the following year to see if you are lucky enough to get a plot next season. As a result there is no 'pride of ownership', no real 'connection' to the land because one year you have it and next year you don't. I have little doubt that it Burlington tripled the number available to 600 plots a year they'd all be gone. This program needs to be scaled up to them have 2,000 plots available, with multi-year leases available. The demand is there and they need to incentivize it even more.

We will always have those among us that believe in the Welfare State (that is why the NDP exist in its current form - I know a cheap shot, but am I really wrong?), so we just have to accept this fact and to address the needs of those who are willing to 'change', to 'help', to 'stand on their own two feet', with some help and direction.

 

[Jarnhamar]

We can’t afford to cut taxes. If anything we should be starting to heavily cut expenses and/or increase taxes.

Just cutting taxes right now would be a childish reaction. There is still bills to pay and we aren’t even remotely close to breaking even.

Where do you think we should increase taxes?

 

[Halifax Tar]

While I don't disagree with you overall, I'm not willing to throw in the towel, shrug my shoulders and walk away.

I know that you know that there is no 'one size fits all' solution to this problem or any problem, but that doesn't mean that solutions that fit part of the problem shouldn't be found or implemented. I had forgotten the term 'victory gardens' for what I was describing, but if these 'Victory Gardens' implemented brought 5, 10, 15% of the population out of their basements/family rooms and growing veggies for 4 months of the year that had a net overall reduction of 5% or 7% in the amount of veggies/fruits that we import from June-Oct would that be a bad thing? If it resulted in lower blood pressure, weight loss and more sense of community belonging among those 5 or 10 or 15% of the population, would that be a 'success' or a 'failure?'

I counted up how many community garden plots my city of Burlington has available every year, its around 225. These are only available for 1yr and then you give it up and have to go back into the lottery system for the following year to see if you are lucky enough to get a plot next season. As a result there is no 'pride of ownership', no real 'connection' to the land because one year you have it and next year you don't. I have little doubt that it Burlington tripled the number available to 600 plots a year they'd all be gone. This program needs to be scaled up to them have 2,000 plots available, with multi-year leases available. The demand is there and they need to incentivize it even more.

We will always have those among us that believe in the Welfare State (that is why the NDP exist in its current form - I know a cheap shot, but am I really wrong?), so we just have to accept this fact and to address the needs of those who are willing to 'change', to 'help', to 'stand on their own two feet', with some help and direction.

Canadians will expect our Gov to do something about this, and victory gardens isn't the solution.

Our bloated and obese Gov is and will be exposed. Cuts to taxes and spending will be expected. Thankfully I think defence will finally be accepted and necessary spend. The cuts really need to be made in social programs, health care, and the arts.