Author Topic: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)  (Read 183374 times)

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Offline Navy_Pete

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #650 on: December 22, 2014, 11:25:56 »
I am unsure if this study took that info into account. But with other types of testing, a positive result prompts a review of the medical file and an interview of the offender with the MO to determine if there was an "alternate cause" to the positive result.

I was just curious, I doubted there was, and if it would even be significant.  Morphine was the obvious one, but with marijuana now being allowed to be prescribed to CAF members as per the CANFORGEN from a few years ago with certain (generally pretty serious) illnesses, and MDMA being investigated as part of the treatment with therapy for PTSD, there could be some 'noise' in the results.  It would come out easily enough for a normal test, but I think they normally would screen people anyway to identify expected positive results.

Given how widely available and easy drugs are to get, not sure why this is a surprise, and it's still at a much lower rate then the Canadian population.

One question I would have if they had found any correlation between the rates at the army regiments being higher then other untis, which would kind of be expected with all the Afghanistan deployments.

Offline TCBF

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #651 on: March 19, 2015, 22:27:48 »
- Drug addicts are liars. first, they lie to themselves. Then, they lie to everyone else.

- Experience has taught us that suspected and known drug users - especially those who used in civilian life before joining the military - have a much higher rate of stress injuries and failure to adapt. Do to our permissive mental health community, their inevitable VAC claims for PTSD/OSI paint the military as the bogeyman, not their previous inadequate existence before joining.

- You want the truth? DNA.

- I am retired from the Army. The civ company I work for pays for a seventy minute medical/physical exam before hiring. Drug and alcohol testing (with immediate interim results), eye, ear, mobility, strength, and flexibility tests follow. Push ups, scrunches, proper lifting technique demo (by you, not her). It is a very efficient seventy minutes. Fail? You don't get an interview - you get a "No thanks".
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #652 on: March 19, 2015, 23:15:41 »
Quote from: TCBF
- I am retired from the Army. The civ company I work for pays for a seventy minute medical/physical exam before hiring. Drug and alcohol testing (with immediate interim results), eye, ear, mobility, strength, and flexibility tests follow. Push ups, scrunches, proper lifting technique demo (by you, not her). It is a very efficient seventy minutes. Fail? You don't get an interview - you get a "No thanks".

This would save the Canadian Forces millions of dollars.
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Offline mariomike

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #653 on: March 20, 2015, 00:10:42 »
The civ company I work for pays for a seventy minute medical/physical exam before hiring. Drug and alcohol testing (with immediate interim results), eye, ear, mobility, strength, and flexibility tests follow. Push ups, scrunches, proper lifting technique demo (by you, not her). It is a very efficient seventy minutes. Fail? You don't get an interview - you get a "No thanks".

After the medical, and prior to challenging the Candidate Physical Ability Test (CPAT), the department I retired from sends candidates to this place:
http://www.awci.ca/index.php

Do to our permissive mental health community, their inevitable VAC claims for PTSD/OSI paint the military as the bogeyman, not their previous inadequate existence before joining.

In my opinion, individuals straight out of high school or college were more moldable than older individuals with "life experience" to the subcultures of the military and emergency services ( many of whom were ex-military when I hired on ). 

Background checks are obviously less complicated if the military, or service, is the individual's first career.

 






« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 23:09:19 by mariomike »

Offline TCBF

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #654 on: March 21, 2015, 23:52:16 »
After the medical, and prior to challenging the Candidate Physical Ability Test (CPAT), the department I retired from sends candidates to this place:
http://www.awci.ca/index.php

In my opinion, individuals straight out of high school or college were more moldable than older individuals with "life experience" to the subcultures of the military and emergency services ( many of whom were ex-military when I hired on ). 

Background checks are obviously less complicated if the military, or service, is the individual's first career.

- The average age of my squads in Cornwallis was 19, we had far less injuries and admin complications than my older platoons in St-Jean ten years later.
"Disarming the Canadian public is part of the new humanitarian social agenda."   - Foreign Affairs Minister Lloyd Axeworthy at a Gun Control conference in Oslo, Norway in 1998.


"I didn’t feel that it was an act of violence; you know, I felt that it was an act of liberation, that’s how I felt you know." - Ann Hansen, Canadian 'Urban Guerrilla'(one of the "Squamish Five")

Offline Pre-flight

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #655 on: March 23, 2015, 23:50:47 »
- The average age of my squads in Cornwallis was 19, we had far less injuries and admin complications than my older platoons in St-Jean ten years later.

Maybe, but then again from my experience with new Ptes coming in, the older guys are definitely more mature and more reliable. Not a hard and fast rule but definitely a trend.

Offline Hamish Seggie

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #656 on: March 23, 2015, 23:54:22 »
- The average age of my squads in Cornwallis was 19, we had far less injuries and admin complications than my older platoons in St-Jean ten years later.

18 and 19 year olds are more of a challenge, however they have less to "unlearn" than an older recruit.

They are easier to mould and change their thinking. Not so much with older recruits.
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Offline DovoNewb

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #657 on: April 14, 2015, 07:43:19 »
This would save the Canadian Forces millions of dollars.

People where I am constantly ask our leadership why doesn't the CF do named drug tests, as opposed to the blind testing that they do to get "statistics?" We get told about human rights, and that it is against the law. My unit in particular seems to have a lot of disciplinary investigation and actions in relation to drug use which is obviously against CF policy.

Aren't there private companies in Canada that subject their staff to drug testing at least at the time that they are hired?


Offline mariomike

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #658 on: April 14, 2015, 10:03:10 »
Aren't there private companies in Canada that subject their staff to drug testing at least at the time that they are hired?

They do where I used to work: "The candidate will be required to attend a medical examination by a physician appointed by the City to undergo and pass a pre-placement medical examination and a drug test."

Offline stealthylizard

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #659 on: April 14, 2015, 11:34:17 »
I'm drug tested annually.  I am also subject to a drug test following a recordable incident, for reasonable suspicion, or upon a client's request.  It's pretty standard now in the oilfield to have a pre-employment test, and regular or random testing.  Last time I worked for a oil-sector company without a drug test was in 1998.  The biggest change has been that most companies no longer do "in house testing".  They send you to a independent testing facility.

Offline concernedcivilian

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #660 on: January 10, 2016, 13:36:01 »
Hello everyone,
I have a family member who started BMQ a couple months ago, and while she was home over the Christmas break our family noted some drastic changes in her behaviour since leaving for St. Jean. Perhaps I'm being too sensitive, and I knew she would change somewhat when joining the forces, but these changes seemed extreme. Basically I'm just looking for advice on how to handle it (if at all possible) or just reassurance that this is normal.

Before leaving she was in a long-term relationship. At least four years. While at BMQ she decided they were going to break up and proceeded to sleep with a fellow recruit before actually breaking up with him. As soon as she came home they did break up, however.

Our family immediately noted she was exceptionally rude and mean. Bragged about being military but more in a way of saying, "I'm better than you are" and looked down on all of us.

We also learned she didn't miss home or her family at all while she was away and couldn't wait to get back home to her "boys".

During her Christmas break she took to Tinder to hook up with as many guys as possible as well as resorting to cocaine use. Also managed to drink herself so stupid that she wound up in hospital requiring stitches and claims to have no memory of how or why.

Now that she's back at CFLRS she's obviously very happy and has already been sleeping with a fellow recruit.

I'm not just speculating about all of this because she has come right out and bragged about all of this, right down to being a self-proclaimed SL--T like its something to be proud of.

Now I'm sure there is absolutely nothing I can do to stop her self-destructive behaviour but none of this seems normal for a person who was once extremely family-oriented and had a good head on her shoulders. Can BMQ really change a person that much?

Offline MCG

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #661 on: January 10, 2016, 13:48:09 »
If she is into drugs, you can help her by contacting military police.  She will not like it, but help will be forced.


Offline marinemech

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #662 on: January 10, 2016, 14:47:44 »
/\ + 1 needs help now before it gets way worse, recommend calling Garrison MPs highly likely that she will be pissed being called in to the office to explain to staff and MPs and possible drug testing and removal from platoon

Offline JesseWZ

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #663 on: January 10, 2016, 15:28:30 »
I would imagine the drug use may also be a contributing factor in the behaviour change. Nevertheless, the Forces does not condone drug use and a call to St Jean MP Detachment is in order. 1-450-358-7011 is the number for St Jean Garrison MP Det.
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Offline Not a Sig Op

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #664 on: January 10, 2016, 16:04:30 »
On the subject of cocaine, is this something you personally witnessed or just heard rumors about?

This this stage, it could be a sudden career killer. Take that into consideration.

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #665 on: January 10, 2016, 16:19:28 »
On the subject of cocaine, is this something you personally witnessed or just heard rumors about?

This this stage, it could be a sudden career killer. Take that into consideration.

So the MPs will investigate and if there are grounds for further action, so be it.  Should it not be a career killer?  ???

Regards,
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Offline MCG

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #666 on: January 10, 2016, 16:44:47 »
The career may be killed, but before that happens there will be mandatory medical referrals where help is offered.  More likely, she would be given a second chance during which she will be monitored and counseled toward drug free behavior.

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #667 on: January 10, 2016, 17:01:34 »
Sounds to me like someone who was seeking male attention, and suddenly found all kinds of it.  The military doesn't make her a sl*t, being a sl*t makes her a sl*t.  Think of it like the meek mouse who comes home completely different after a year at university away from controlling interests.  The drug thing is not on, at all, call the cops.  The arrogance and chesty-ness is not uncommon in new troops who have a grossly exaggerated opinion of their own value to the big machine.
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Offline garb811

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #668 on: January 10, 2016, 18:37:39 »
Or maybe (and probably more likely then her having been a closet coke head slut all these years with the four year relationship with a guy only being cover for the lack of male attention :facepalm:), something traumatic has happened to her and this "acting out" is her way of trying to deal with it.  Not like we never see this with folks who have had otherwise "by the book" careers and suddenly they go off the rails for no apparent reason until they finally are ready to seek the help they need...

Offline marinemech

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #669 on: January 10, 2016, 19:04:21 »
BMQ is a rough time for some people, I had the unfortunate experience of being in the garrison when a young recruit (week 3 or 4), jumped or fell from the 8th floor landing on the roof of the 3rd floor. Luckily the platoon on the 4th floor was able to get to him and preform basic first aid while waiting for emergency personnel from the civvie side and the base. Luckily for him and for all who witnessed the incident he survived

Offline Poacher434

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #670 on: January 12, 2016, 00:30:12 »
Calling the MP's is a viable solution, also contacting the course staff can be something to do as well.

From teaching on many courses I can attest to the fact that instructors do notice changes in recruits from day one of course throughout, so your call can shed some further light on a curious instructor.

Also since she is enlisted you can also contact 1-800-268-7708 The Canadian Armed Forces Member Assistance Program.
 I swear by this and have pushed it more times than I care to remember, It is completely free and can be utilized by her or yourself, the program is confidential and the operators are very friendly and knowledgeable as to where the best help can be obtained.

They can even listen to a situation over the phone and reccomend the best places to seek assistance (they have also been known to cover some initial psychiatric treatments/screenings)

If you don't want to call the military police (although it is highly recomended to) at least call the CAF members assistance. They can probably give you better advice than anyone here (unless some counselors want to chime in)

Bear in mind I am not qualified, nor am I telling you the best solution, this is strictly my reccomendation as an experienced instructor, mental health instructor, and suicide/mental fitness supervisor.

Offline Eye In The Sky

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #671 on: January 12, 2016, 03:04:29 »
To the OP:  many, many people have gone thru BMQ and changed but not like that.  The best thing you can do is help to get her the help she needs, whether she wants it or not.  She is heading down a bad road that has no good end.

The MP number for that area is a great place to start.  Whatever she does and however hard it is to witness, remember she is an adult now and responsible for her actions.

There is also the option of contacting CFLRS to express your concerns;  I would suggest her Course Warrant Officer or Course Officer would be the place to start there.  If you know her platoon/course number, they would be able to point you in the right direction.
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Offline Jarnhamar

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #672 on: January 12, 2016, 09:07:53 »
Hello everyone,
I have a family member who

-proceeded to sleep with a fellow recruit
-was exceptionally rude and mean.
-Bragged about being military
-looked down on all of us.
-she didn't miss home
-couldn't wait to get back home to her "boys".
-took to Tinder to hook up with as many guys as possible
-resorting to cocaine use.
-managed to drink herself so stupid that she wound up in hospital requiring stitches
- has already been sleeping with a fellow recruit.
-being a self-proclaimed SL--T like its something to be proud of.

To me this sounds more like a character assassination from an angry ex boyfriend than a concerned family member.

Saying theres nothing you can do to stop her self-destructive behavior sure doesn't sound like your heart is into "helping her"
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Offline Strike

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #673 on: January 12, 2016, 12:43:47 »
To me this sounds more like a character assassination from an angry ex boyfriend than a concerned family member.

Saying theres nothing you can do to stop her self-destructive behavior sure doesn't sound like your heart is into "helping her"

I have to admit, this didn't even cross my mind until you mentioned it.  Looking at the original post even deeper -- what is the general age range to use Tinder?  An older relative would likely refer to what she is doing as 'hooking up with people online.' This does seem a tad specific.  And a concerned family member using terms like slut?  Even if she did use those terms herself, most people who care would try and tone it down by using a term like promiscuous or loose.

I also noticed the OP hasn't come back.  No thoughts on what everyone is saying?  No more questions?
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Offline Remius

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Re: Drug use/drug testing in the CF (merged)
« Reply #674 on: January 12, 2016, 12:57:23 »
Sister?  Brother? Cousin?

Who knows.
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